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Paying Debts off not good enough . . .


Beakermeep83
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Hello,

 

My mum had help with CAB to start paying back her debts. She came to an agreement with all companies involved and has been paying back the agreed amounts for 18 months now and has never missed a payment.

 

However, she has now been receiving letters stating that her debts have been passed on to DCA's.

 

What should she do??

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Right, they are:

 

* HSBC - Managed Loan, now with Metropolitan Collection Services

* Littlewoods - Visa, now with Cabot Financial

* Marks & Spencers - Credit card, still with them

* Argos - Credit card, now with Fredrickson International Ltd

* Evans Store Card - now with CL Finance Ltd

* Littlewoods Flexible Account - still with them

* Studio Cards - still with them

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ok, cool we have something to work with

 

right these DCAs must prove they have a legal right to collect these debts,

 

the Law (consumer Credit Act 1974) requires that where credit is given to consumers there must be a regulated agreement. now under Act you are legally entitled to ask for a copy of the credit agreement

 

the letter is here http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/general-debt/20758-creditors-dcas-letter-templates.html

 

you need letter N

 

dont sign it instead print your name,

 

send it recorded delivery.

 

the companies have 12 working days to supply a true copy of the agreement. now if they do reply and provide an agreement you will need to post a copy on here so we can scrutinise it as you will be surprised how many credit agreements are totally un-enforcable

 

if they dont supply the information then they are default of their obligations and not entitled to enforce the debt while the default continues if they dont supply the requested information under the Act in the 12 working days plus a further 30 calendar days they commit a criminal offence and should be reported to trading standards

 

if it comes back that they don't have an agreement for the account then you are in a very strong position to negotiate with your mums creditors. it may even be the case that if her financial situation dictates so she would be within her rights to totally withhold payment

i hope this helps, any questions please ask away

 

regards

paul

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I think its a good place to start atleast

 

by sending the requests it will allow you an overview of what agreements are enforcable and which are not

 

just shout if you need any help and we will see what we can do

 

regards

paul

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Also, condider whether there were any charges on the debts that you can reclaim, or PPI that you could reclaim.

i will be off site for the next month or so. if you have any problems, feel free to report the post so a moderator can help you.

 

I am not a qualified or practicing lawyer.

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  • 2 weeks later...

Right, my mum has had her first reply, this is from Marks and Spencers:

 

"Thank you for contacting us. Sorry for the delay in sending you the requested information, which was due to technical difficulties retrieving the documentation.

 

I enclose a copy of the original application form and the terms and conditions.

 

I have signed a copy of your current monthly statement, which outlines the outstanding balance. The agreement is now broken, and the full balance is due.

 

Your account requires an immediate payment of £671.68 for the present arrears. We accept debit card payments by telephone. Until we receive a payment, further recovery action will continue which could mean that your account is passed to an outside collecting agent.

 

We have complied with our legal duties under section 77 and 78 of the Consumer Credit Act and I trust that matters have noe been resolved."

 

My mum has been paying £5 a month for over 2 years. She received a letter in August 07 stating that they were pleased she had been making payments and for her to call and review. This was done and my mum has continued making payments until she sent the CCA.

 

What should she do next?

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Ok, is there any chance you cn post up a copy of what they sent

 

often we see the "Weve sent you " blahblahblah but whne we look at the documents they dont comply with the law and therefore are not enforcable

 

so if you can scan a copy on to here , remove all the personal details first

 

we can scrutinise it and give you our opinion

 

regards

paul

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IS MY AGREEMENT ENFORCEABLE( Via section 127(3) CCA1974)

PRESCRIBED TERMS FOR THE PURPOSES OF SECTIONS 61(1)(0) AND 127(3) OF THE

CONSUMER CREDIT ACT 1974 Taken from sced.6(1983/1553) regulations

(If you just want to find out, skip the bits in between the stars it’s just some extra information)

 

**What do we mean by unenforceable?

In the Consumer Credit Act section 127 there is a provision for making an agreement unenforceable if it does not contain certain pieces of information.

Subsections 1,2,3,4 state which pieces of information these are, and everything mentioned there must be included within the body of the agreement, if one is missing the agreement is unenforceable.

 

How does unenforceable differ from enforceable with a court order only?

When an agreement is unenforceable it means that the court or the judge cannot make a ruling on it. The court cannot make it enforceable.

When an agreement is enforceable only by ruling of the court it means that the agreement can be stopped by the debtor but the court has the power to re-instate it and allow the credit to continue to enforce.**

 

The Pescribed Terms are these

 

A Amount of credit

A term stating the amount of credit

 

B Repayments

A term stating how the debtor is to discharge his obligations under the agreement to make the repayments, which may be expressed by reference to a combination of any of the following-

(a) Number of repayments;

(b) Amount of repayments;

© Frequency and timing of repayments;

(d) Dates of repayments;

(e) The manner in which any of the above may be determined; or in any other way, and any power of the creditor to vary what is payable.

 

C Rate of interest

A term stating the rate of interest to be applied to the credit issued under the agreement

D Credit limit

This may be a term or the manner in which it will be determined or that there is no credit limit.

--------------------------

 

Which of these applies to you depends on the type of agreement you have?

 

For a Running Account (credit card) agreement

 

BC and D Apply

 

For a Restricted Use Debtor Creditor Supplier

  • Where the dealer is the supplier and the creditor is the one providing the finance.
  • The money can only be used for the purpose it is given.
  • There is no interest on the purchase (the cash price is the same as the total price)
  • And there is no advance payment

A is applicable

 

For a fixed Sum Credit Agreement

A conventional credit agreement with none of the above restrictions

 

A and B apply

 

For a Hire Agreement

 

B is Applicable

 

 

Hi there

 

the above is taken from peter bards thread on agreement enforcability

 

since the agreement is for a credit card, it must contain the terms in ppoints BC&D

 

if they are not within the document, it would render the agreement unenforcable

 

have a look and if you need any thing clarified let me know

 

regards

paul

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If you have a digital camera you can take pictures of the documents and then post them direct from your pc. Alternatively if you know someone with a scanner that can load them onto their own pc they can email them to you and you can forward to one of the site helpers or mods. Just ask for email address'.

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ok cool , at least we can look at the agreement.

 

make sure you remove all the personal details from it before you post it,

 

i will reserve judgment on the enforceability of the form until we've had a look

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*My mum has had a reply from CL Finance Ltd, debt from Evans Store Card.

 

All they have sent is a statement which shows the £1 postal order as a payment off the balance. Nothing else at all.

 

What should you she do next?

 

* Also received a reply from Cabot Financial, debt from Littlewoods Visa.

 

This has stated that they do not have the requested information and have written to Littlewoods asking for it to be forwarded and that if they can not do this within the 12 days they will write to my mum letting her know.

 

* And a reply from Metropolitan Collection Services Ltd, debt from HSBC Managed Loan.

 

Same letter as Cabot sent.

 

My mum has had her postal orders returned for these two.

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*My mum has had a reply from CL Finance Ltd, debt from Evans Store Card.

 

All they have sent is a statement which shows the £1 postal order as a payment off the balance. Nothing else at all.

 

What should you she do next? AT THE MOMENT, NOTHING, WAIT UNTIL THE 12 WORKING DAYS PLUS THE 30 CALENDAR DAYS EXPIRE THEN WHEN THEY DEMAND PAYMENT WE CAN RESPOND AS THEY WILL BE COMMITTING AN OFFENCE

 

* Also received a reply from Cabot Financial, debt from Littlewoods Visa.

 

This has stated that they do not have the requested information and have written to Littlewoods asking for it to be forwarded and that if they can not do this within the 12 days they will write to my mum letting her know.

 

* And a reply from Metropolitan Collection Services Ltd, debt from HSBC Managed Loan.

 

Same letter as Cabot sent.

 

My mum has had her postal orders returned for these two.

 

THE SAME ADVICE STANDS FOR THESE TOO, ONCE THE 12 WORKING DAYS EXPIRE YOU CAN LEGITIMATELY WITHHOLD PAYMENT UNTIL THEY COMPLY IF THEY RETURN THE PAYMENT THATS THEIR PROBLEM, YOUVE SENT IT SO THEY ARE STILL OBLIGED TO SUPPLY THE DOCUMENTS

 

.....

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