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    • These companies don't actually like to take people to court.  Legal fees in small claims are capped at £50.  However, the people who run the companies are so stupid that they are incapable of dealing with their own court cases and so have to employ local solicitors which costs them a bomb.  So even if they win in court they lose IYSWIM.     If you give them both barrels now there is a good chance they will decide it's not worth their while and go after some other naive mug instead.  There are no guarantees of course.   Just to clear a few things up.  You actually paid the parking fee - twice - but the machine was knackered, right?  Any proof of this?  Then the fleecers sent out a second demand without sending the first so you couldn't appeal or get the discount, right?   Also, can you remember what you wrote to them?  In particular if you outed yourself as the driver?
    • Iv not had a phone mine went off ,so not ad chance borrow one im just trying get my passwords reset.
    • hi sorry about that i never no were to post 
    • Okay I was just checking that the parcel hadn't been sent by a retail supplier in which case it might have been easier to get them to take responsibility. As usual, Hermes and Packlink are playing piggy in the middle and of course, you are Piggy. You should certainly make a claim against Packlink and against Hermes. However, they will both knock you back, of course. You could then sue Packlink or you could then sue Hermes of course Packlink are in Spain which is why it is a mistake to use Packlink for anything because they are outside the jurisdiction. Assuming that you want to proceed to take legal action then you will have to sue Hermes – who will try to say that you have no contract with them in your contract is with Packlink. What Hermes won't tell you though is that under the Contracts (Rights of Third Parties) Act you enjoy full legal rights against Hermes as if you were a direct contracting partner. Additionally, it is Hermes that have been negligent and so if you bring a legal action then you will allege breach of contract as well as negligence. For a claim of this value – £150 – Hermes will at the very least force you to begin a small claim in the County Court by issuing the court papers. They are then quite likely to push you to a hearing but opt for mediation en route. At mediation they will try to say that the contract is with Packlink. They will then back down and make you an offer which will be less than you are claiming – but if you stand your ground then they will eventually agree to pay you everything including the cost of your claim. Of course there is always a risk of losing – but it's extremely unlikely. This is particularly because for this kind of money, Hermes would rather not risk going to court and getting a judgement which makes it clear that you have third party rights and also that it is unfair for them to try and escape liability for these kinds of breach of contract and this kind of negligence. So the advice is, continue your claim against Packlink. Continue your claim against Hermes. When you get confirmation that they are declining responsibility, send Hermes a 14 day letter of claim and then on day 15 issue the papers. Read around this forum about other Hermes stories and also the steps involved in beginning a small claim in the County Court. We will help you all the way.
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    • I’m in desperate need of help
       
      I bought some clothes online in may through Evans and paid through PayPal
      returned them all seven days later
       
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      i suffer with mental health issues and this is affecting my health and I’d saved the money for a year to buy these clothes as I’m on a low income .
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Private Parking Tickets - Template Letters - If you wrote before finding this site.


Please note that this topic has not had any new posts for the last 3197 days.

If you are trying to post a different story then you should start your own new thread. Posting on this thread is likely to mean that you won't get the help and advice that you need.

If you are trying to post information which is relevant to the story in this thread then please flag it up to the site team and they will allow you to post.

Thank you

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IMPORTANT INFORMATION

 

This does not constitute legal advice and is not represented as a substitute for legal advice from an appropriately qualified person or firm.

 

This is what the writer would do in the contemplated circumstances. It is placed freely in the public domain on the basis that if it is used no liability of any kind attaches to the writer and/or the publisher.

 

Any person relying on this information does so entirely at their own risk.

 

****************************************************

 

A Cautionary Note

 

Since I drafted these templates, life and experience has moved on.

Much of the advice given now is to ignore completely all correspondence from PPCs.

 

My only slight reservation about this is that in the remote possibility of a case being argued in court, would a failure to respond be presented by the claimant and accepted by the court as the actions of an unreasonable person? Would this then count against you?

 

It really comes down to how you, personally, see the risk and whether you are prepared to run the risk.

 

If you are not comfortable to ignore all communications and are not happy with running the risk I outlined above then the templates are possibly for you.

 

I have always said, and stand by the view that you should not initiate correspondence.

 

The “sticky” entitled Private Parking Tickets - Template Letters shared my approach for how I would deal with a private parking ticket from the outset and before I had communicated with the private parking company.

 

I then wondered how I would approach the position if I, or say for example my wife, had already written to the private parking company explaining the background and basically appealing to their better nature. I’m also thinking that we had then received a response telling us that our appeal had been rejected.

 

This sets out the approach that I would then take.

 

I do recommend that you first read the sticky entitled Private Parking Tickets - Template Letters because that does include some detail, background and information that I have not repeated here.

 

This does NOT apply to those parking tickets issued by the LA, police or Traffic Wardens. You are free to this approach provided you read and agree to the “Important Information” at the top and foot of this post.

 

Again I acknowledge the excellent work by petej2811 in his article which can be seen here. His work is the inspiration behind much of this and he deserves appropriate credit. If I repeat anything he has said it is meant as a compliment and if I say anything in disagreement it is meant with respect.

 

Add to your armoury for complaints with a compaint revolving around the data protection act. See here for details.

 

Feedback with any typos, inaccuracies, omissions, improvements, errors etc is most welcome. I may come back and edit this post (subject to permissions) to add and clarify matters including relating to feedback.

 

We do also need to think about the exception to not initiating correspondence that I referred to on the other thread. If I was not the owner of the car (say for example I had a company car, hire car or garage courtesy car) the person identified as the keeper would receive the letter from the private parking company, pay the bill and seek to recover the funds from me under alleged contractual obligation.

 

So what I would do is to try and employ the technique above by getting the owners of the car to write and obviously amended version of the letter above. They might be reluctant to do so in which case I would trya and persuade the owners either to write and give my name only (as driver) and failing that my name and address. In the event of there being no co-operation from the vehicle owners, this is the only circumstance where I would initiate correspondence. This is the letter I would write:

Dear Sirs,

 

Re: Vehicle Reg No: [#]

 

On [dd mmmm yyyy] you issued a parking ticket to the above mentioned vehicle that I had parked in [state location].

 

Could you please advise the basis in law that you feel enables you to issue a parking ticket that appears to mimic those issued by the police, traffic wardens and/or local authorities and to levy penalties

 

In the meantime I absolutely deny your claim that the amount claimed, or any amount at all, is due to you from me.

 

Yours Faithfully

The response to the “appeal” rejection:

The option of pushing back and saying that they need to take the matter up with the driver is now not available to us so we need to modify our approach. My response would read something like this:

Dear Sirs,

 

Re: Your letter dated [dd/mmmm/yyyy] Reference[#]

 

Thank you for your captioned letter.

 

Since I wrote to you I have been doing some research.

 

I now understand that your “parking ticket” purported to have been issued with the force of law behind it. I now believe this not to be the case.

 

Would you please advise me what statute(s) and/or judicial precedent enable you to enforce this penalty against me.

 

In the meantime I absolutely deny your claim that the amount claimed, or any amount at all, is due to you from me.

 

Yours Faithfully

If you are lucky that will be the end of the matter and you will hear no more.

 

It is more likely that they will write again, this is where it becomes more tricky to compose a template. What I have done is to write a basic letter and made suggestions for paragraphs you can insert depending on what they have said.

 

The basic letter:

This is the top and tail ready for paragraphs to be added.

Dear Sirs,

 

Re: Your letter dated [dd/mmmm/yyyy] Reference[#]

 

I refer to previous correspondence.

 

[#]

 

Unless you provide evidence to substantiate your claim against me I shall be unable to assist you further in this matter and I restate my denial of this claim.

 

Yours Faithfully

The variable paragraphs to add to the basic letter:

You will need to make the appropriate amendments if you are writing for someone else.

You may need to write more than once. I suggest that two or three times is sufficient before moving on to a “cease and desist” letter.

 

If they have simply ignored what you have previously said.

At this juncture there is nothing further that I can add to my letter of dd mmmm yyyy (copy enclosed).

If they allege that you entered into a binding contract with them:

You appear to claim that I entered into a binding contract with you. Please provide evidence that your purported contractual terms were communicated to me in a way that I read, understood and accepted them prior to leaving my vehicle.

 

Even if I did - which I deny - it is my claim that the charge you allege I have to pay you is unenforceable at law being an unlawful penalty charge.

If they allege that you trespassed:

You appear to claim that I trespassed. I deny that I committed this tort and that any liability to you arises.

 

Even if I did - which I deny - it is my claim that the charge you allege I have to pay you is unenforceable at law being an unlawful penalty charge and not an appropriate remedy for trespass.

If they have added further charges:

I note that you have increased the amount of the alleged debt. Given that you have failed to substantiate and support your claim that I am indebted to you; this is unreasonable, inappropriate and, quite probably, unlawful. In addition to my previous denials I absolutely deny any liability to you for this additional sum.

If they threaten debt collection:

I note your comments about debt collectors. Given that this debt is in dispute I shall simply advise them that the debt is in dispute and they will have to refer back to you.

If they threaten court action:

I will welcome the opportunity to defend your allegation in court and am confident of success. Of course you will be required to produce the evidence that I have requested and you have failed to provide. You will also have to answer to the court why you failed to do so.

NOTE: In either of the two circumstances above, you may wish also to add the relevant bits from the "Cease and Desist letter".

 

The cease and desist letter:

Refer to the section with the same title in the sticky entitled Private Parking Tickets - Template Letters.

The same letter applies.

 

If you receive a letter from debt collectors:

Refer to the section with the same title in the sticky entitled Private Parking Tickets - Template Letters.

The same letter applies.

 

IMPORTANT INFORMATION

 

This does not constitute legal advice and is not represented as a substitute for legal advice from an appropriately qualified person or firm.

 

This is what the writer would do in the contemplated circumstances. It is placed freely in the public domain on the basis that if it is used no liability of any kind attaches to the writer and/or the publisher.

 

Any person relying on this information does so entirely at their own risk.

Edited by Bernie_the_Bolt
Added cautionary note
  • Haha 1

********************************************

Nothing in this post constitutes "advice" which I may not, in any event, be qualified to provide.

The only interpretation permitted on this post (or any others I may have made) is that this is what I would personally consider doing in the circumstances discussed. Each and every reader of this post or any other I may have made must take responsibility for forming their own view and making their own decision.

I receive an unwieldy number of private messages. I am happy to respond to messages posted on open forum but am unable to respond to private messages, seeking advice, when the substance of that message should properly be on the open forum.

Many thanks for your assistance and understanding on this.

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  • 3 weeks later...
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Thanks Bernie. My email addy is on my original post. I wonder if you'd be so kind as to drop me an email. I'd like you to have a read of my pro-forma.

 

Regards,

 

PJ

Litigation –

 

Lloyds TSB – Won (x2)

Barclays – Won

Abbey – Won

Welcome Finance – Won

Capital One – Won

AS Securi-T (as an advisor) – Won (x2)

 

Barclaycard – Ongoing

Lloyds TSB Credit Card – Ongoing

Experian – Ongoing

Ebay - Ongoing

Barclays (DPA issues) - Ongoing

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  • 2 weeks later...

Hi Bernie,

 

My name is Gilly (aka GorgeousGilly). I dont know if you have seen my "story" on the website (30 November) re Civil Enforcement Limited's penalty charge notice which was sent to my fiance.... He was at a petrol station and weeks later received a notice advising him he was being fined for 50 pounds (rising to 100 pounds if not paid within 2 weeks). He has not paid or contacted them yet. I am new to the site and have had a look at the template letters which all look fab. But not sure which one I could use to make these people go away though. Could you pls point me in the right direction please? I am so relieved that this site exists! Many thanks. Cheers.

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  • 1 month later...

Hi everyone, Great reading all the info on here although it can be a little overwhelming. The wife received a parking ticket from parking eye and sent off a cheque. I have just rang the bank and stopped the cheque. I am the registered keeper and my wife was the one parking in the car park. Was i right to stop the cheque? What point do i need to correspond with them now? obviously I will now get a letter when the payment is stopped.

Thank you in advance.

kevin

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  • 2 months later...

I just got my first "civil traffic enforcement notice" this morning after 13 years of trouble-free driving. I was parked in a retail park, using the facilities of the retail park the same as I have done since it opened over a decade ago. Had lunch at the restaurant there, visited nine of the shops on the retail park (only managed to find what I wanted in one though). Got up this morning to find a fine for £95 in the post. Reason given was exceeding the 3hrs parking by 30 mins. Talk about furious - there were signs saying the car park was being monitored by CCTV, which was great, made me feel safer etc. Nowhere did I see any signs saying you had to be out in 3 hours. Was I meant to abandon my shopping in the store, drive out of the car park, then drive back in again to complete it? Anyone with a young family ever tried to shop in a retail park in under 3 hours? By the time you've got the kids out of the car, that's 15 mins gone. Another two hours down Pizza Hut waiting to be served and getting the bill. As for taking my PC back to PC World for a refund, that takes so long that another Ice Age has passed. So annoying that I have shopped there for years and now I get fined for doing the same shopping I have always done. I've tried everywhere to get in touch with the management of the retail park concerned to ask why they are now employing a company to harass shoppers who spend hundreds of quid in their retail park every year. No trace of the management's address anywhere :-(

 

Needless to say, this thread has given me a lot of info to try to fight back with. After all, £95 to us is over two weeks' food budget, so I am definitely going to put up a fight.

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  • 3 weeks later...

I have recently received a ticket from OPC. I was parked at what I thought was Watford station carpark and bought a ticket from their pay and display machine. Turns out I was in an area patrolled by OPC for a block of flats. There was no notice where the OPC area started and the NPC area for the station ended. All the OPC signs were well inside the private area, well beyond where I parked, very high up and with small print. I have appealed, sent in photos showing lack of signage and they replied that they will go ahead to enforce the fine. Has anyone else had problems with this particular area. The advice posted looks really helpful so thanks to everyone who has posted so far. Reej

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  • 1 month later...
  • 1 month later...

I recently received a parking ticket at a netto carpark in west bromwich, from a company called cp plus, for £50. i wrote to them to fight my case, as i had a valid ticket in the car which the inspector failed to see. i sent a copy of this ticket (not the original) along with a letter to them. they wrote back basically saying tough, you still have to pay, he wouldn't have made a mistake. i've now written again, using your second letter on this page (response to an appeal rejection) and i'll be posting that off shortly. i'll keep you informed of the outcome.

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  • 2 weeks later...

I received a letter today from CP Plus in relation to my second letter sent last week, which was the response to 'appeal' letter above.

 

In the letter, they say they are members of the British Parking Association, and they refuse to 'enter into ongoing correspondence with you on this matter'.

 

Basically, they're saying they still want the money!

 

Note, as previously stated, I had a valid parking ticket in my car when they ticketed me.

 

My response (which I had to do myself, due to no clear response for that letter type being available) was as follows:

 

Thank you for your captioned letter.

 

Unless you provide evidence to substantiate your claim against me I shall be unable to assist you further in this matter and I restate my denial of this claim.

 

Please note, as previously stated, I had a valid parking ticket in my car, which your Warden failed to see, even though it was completely visible on the dashboard.

Photographic evidence will be required in a court of law to substantiate your claim. Please supply me with this evidence.

If you wish to take me to court, to fight this claim, I will welcome the opportunity to defend your allegation, and am confident of success.

 

I can only hope that this resolves the situation.

 

I would really appreciate further advise, as this may not be the case.

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They will probably still write a few rubbish letters - you are 'on the hook' i.e. communicating so they will play you out. just keep everything else they send you safe and don't reply any more. You look to have done enough.

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leeches do not let go their grip too easily. same thing exactly.

Don't worry this one will fall off soon enough.

meanwhile enjoy the knowledge that they are spending time and money in a completely futile effort. Gives you a warm glow doesn't it. :)

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  • 3 weeks later...

Hi, I would welcome some advcie on my particular case. I have been shopping at a particular tesco shopping complex for 15 years. They have recently (within 28 days) of my being issued a PCN enlisted the help of SAFE PARK UK to crack down on parking issues.

I am not going to bore you with the whys and wherefores of what happened but essentially i got a parking ticket for parking in a disabled spot with without displaying a blue badge. I have ignored the request for payment, but have now received the first letter from them.

They claim that the law of trespass states it is the drivers responsibility to abide by all the terms and conditions in force that the landowner has made clear on signs or in written notices, therefore they are in breach of the regulations of the governing private land.

 

They aslo say that they have been advised by the DVLA that the vehicle is registered to me and as such i am responsible for the penalty. pay up in 7 days or incur and additional £20 on top of the £90 plus they will forward to Recovery Specialist at further costs and court action will be taken.

 

I honestly did not see the signs as they are new since the last time i went there.

 

I have read the letter templates and i am now deciding whether to write to them or ignore. Many are saying to write, but others say you are taking the bait and then they will not let go!

 

What should i do?

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Their letter to you is absolute and complete rubbish, smelly rubbish at that. why engage with /cheats/incompetents who have already shown no ability to understand or recognise the law ? Do you think your letter will be opened on their road to Damascus ? They have no chance. save your stamp and write a friend a letter instead.

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Hey Lamma,

 

I have an update. I have now received a letter from Trethowans Solicitors of Southampton, telling me to pay £50 within 14 days, or they're taking me to court.

 

I replied as follows (via email, but it's saved on my pc)...

 

(i've missed off the beginning and ending for obvious reasons)

 

As I’ve instructed CP Plus Ltd, on numerous occasions, I had a valid ticket, visible on my dashboard, between the hours of 11.39am and 1.39pm that day.

A scanned copy of that ticket is attached.

I cannot understand how or why the inspector missed this ticket, as it was visible on my dashboard, for all to see, and in date and time. I have yet to see photographic evidence to prove otherwise.

Because I paid for this ticket, and have full evidence of having this ticket, and you have no photographic evidence to support your claim that I did NOT have this ticket in my car, then it is obvious that I would win any case against this company in court.

I have advised CP Plus Ltd on numerous occasions of this, but they have still seen fit to take their case to the next level.

If you would like to take this case to the Birmingham court, I’ll be more than happy to fight my case.

I had a valid ticket in my car. You have no photographic evidence to prove that I didn’t have a valid ticket in my car. I still have said ticket, so it’s my word against your inspectors, and as I have the ticket, and you do not have the photographic evidence, I think a judge would rule that I am in favour, wouldn’t you agree?

But if you do wish to take me to court, please do so, and I’ll put in a counter claim for compensation for the stress this company has caused me in respect of this situation.

I’ll have the backing of my CPN, and my other Healthcare officials, to back up my case, in regards to my stress levels endured due to this continuous struggle and harassment to prove I am innocent.

 

 

Lamma, thoughts please?

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"see you in court" much easier to type and means the same thing. I would have just ignored the trethowans letter. I would have scoured it closely to phrase my complaint to the SRA though :) If they carry on in face of your letter they must be mad.

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  • 4 weeks later...

Okay, well even though I wrote an email to Trethowans, it's been ignored, and they've written to me again stating if they do not receive the £50, they'll be passing my details back to CP Plus Ltd, who will take me to court.

 

Time to look for the SRA's address, and write a letter to them. It's times like this, I wish I had ink cartridges. Hmmmmmmmm maybe I can email them instead, and scan the letters. I'll have to see.

 

More to follow, when i've got more updates.

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Hi, brand new user so be gentle with me. I came across this site whilst trying to find out what I can do about the Penalty Charge Notice I received yesterday from Bedford Parking Services in one of their car parks. I am feeling SO incensed because I parked on the end of a row,in a proper bay but a few inches over, due to the huge vehicle next to me, giving him room to open his door......Code 86, Parked beyond the Bay Markings!! Grrr! I checked signs afterwards and, although there were small signs saying 'Park in a bay', any normal person would accept that this meant, don't leave your car round the edge of the park. I was not causing any obstruction at all.

My question is about signage before I appeal. If there had been any indication that I would receive a penalty for this heinous offence, I would have parked elsewhere, I have never heard of such an offence before. Should there have been a sign ie 'Failure to park with all four wheels in a bay will result in a Penalty Notice being issued.'

I have searched legislation but I think they wrote it in Greek.

Hope someone can help.Thanks for listening.

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came across this site whilst trying to find out what I can do about the Penalty Charge Notice I received yesterday from Bedford Parking Services in one of their car parks.

 

First interesting point... a private parking company cannot issue Penalty Charge Notices, so if that is what they have given you have a laugh, file in the drawer (ready for all the other junk they will send you) then ignore it. Job Done. :D

 

My question is about signage before I appeal.

DO NOT APPEAL!

There is no such thing as an appeal to a PPC (well not one that will ever be successful.)

Let me save you a stamp; *puts pretend PPC hat on*

Your Appeal is Unsuccessful. Please pay me megabucks or I'll eat your dog.

 

I have searched legislation but I think they wrote it in Greek.

There is no legislation to find. You are no doubt confusing legislation covering official council/police PCNs with the junk mail of a PPC. How can there be legislation covering something that is inherently illegal? ;)
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I've just joined this forum as my girlfriend received a letter out of the blue from Trethowans Solicitors (mentioned already earlier on in this thread).

 

The letter warns that the vehicle registered to her committed an offence in a car park resulting in a charge notice being issued, which remains unpaid. The letter is vague about the charge, it just says the vehicle "did not adhere to the Parking Regulations as details on the Notice Boards" and threatens court proceedings.

 

It's also vague about the location of the offence. "George Eliot" is all it says - we had to search the internet to find out this relates to a hospital car park in Nuneaton.

 

Well, I can confirm that neither I nor my girlfriend have ever been to Nuneaton in our puff! We live in Glasgow, the offence was dated in August, she's owned the car a lot longer than that, and it hasn't been out of Scotland let alone anywhere near Nuneaton.

 

To me it screams mistaken identity, either the attendant has written the registration down wrongly or someone has a cloned number plate. It would be nice if the letter detailed the make & model of the car - I bet it doesn't even match!

 

I've e-mailed Trethowans (their e-mail address is given on the letter) to explain everything including where the car was at the time stated. However the experience of "southernsoftee" on this thread makes me wonder whether common sense will prevail without us having to get a solicitor of our own involved.

 

I have to say as well that the tone of the letter is appalling, guilt is assumed and it is obviously meant to sound threatening. Payment details printed in bold and all. Pathetic!

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The letter warns that the vehicle registered to her committed an offence in a car park resulting in a charge notice being issued, which remains unpaid.

 

How naughty of the vehicle to commit an offence. Maybe Trethowans should have a stern word word the car. ;)

 

The letter is vague about the charge, it just says the vehicle "did not adhere to the Parking Regulations as details on the Notice Boards" and threatens court proceedings.

 

Once again, this vehicle clearly needs a good telling off. Perhaps we should support Trethowans in taking this vehicle to court to teach it a lesson :D

 

I've e-mailed Trethowans (their e-mail address is given on the letter) to explain everything including where the car was at the time stated. However the experience of "southernsoftee" on this thread makes me wonder whether common sense will prevail without us having to get a solicitor of our own involved.

Oops, writing to them and expecting common sense has been a mistake. All you have really done is establish a line of communication for them which they will exploit for many moons to come. :( You will not need a solicitor I am sure so save your money on that one.

 

I have to say as well that the tone of the letter is appalling, guilt is assumed and it is obviously meant to sound threatening. Payment details printed in bold and all. Pathetic!

Ah! so it is a standardly formatted PPC letter then.
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Crem,

 

so do you think they can be convinced to go away just by my writing to them? The e-mail that I've sent demolishes the basis for the charge, all they have to do is make a couple of rudimentary fact checks and they will see they are wasting their time.

 

Nevertheless I'm fortunate enough to know someone who is a solicitor so they're going to do me a favour and write to them anyway.

 

Cheers

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I doubt anyone writing to them at this stage, either you or your solicitor mate, will make them go away. By all accounts PPCs and their asociates don't even seem to read letters you send them so have no idea what strong defense you have.

 

Best general advice is usually just to ignore anything they send your way, but keep it safe for your day in court. (not that I would hold your breathe on it ever getting that far)

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Please note that this topic has not had any new posts for the last 3197 days.

If you are trying to post a different story then you should start your own new thread. Posting on this thread is likely to mean that you won't get the help and advice that you need.

If you are trying to post information which is relevant to the story in this thread then please flag it up to the site team and they will allow you to post.

Thank you

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