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    • Should this to be take into court with him or should he send something in earlier?
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    • Hi, In my last post I mentioned I had received an email from SS who were asking me to hand over the keys to my mother’s flat so they could pass them to the Law firm who have been appointed court of protection to access, secure and insure my mother’s property.  Feeling this, all quickly getting out of my hands I emailed ss requesting proof of this. I HAVEN’T HEARD BACK FROM SS.  Yesterday, I received an email (with attached court of protection order) from the Law Firm confirming this was correct (please see below a copy of this).  After reading the court of protection order I do have some concerns about it:   (a)   I only found out yesterday, the Law firm had been appointed by the court back in January.  Up until now, I have not received any notification regarding this.  (b)   Section 2   - States I am estranged from my mother.  This is NOT CORRECT    The only reason I stepped back from my mother was to protect myself from the guy (groomer) who had befriended her & was very aggressive towards me & because of my mother’s dementia she had become aggressive also.  I constantly tried to warned SS about this guy's manipulative behaviour towards my mother and his increasing aggressiveness towards me (as mentioned in previous posts).  Each time I was ignored.  Instead, SS encouraged his involvement with my mother – including him in her care plans and mental health assessments.   I was literally pushed out because I feared him and my mother’s increasing aggression towards me. Up until I stepped back, I had always looked after my mother and since her admission to the care home, I visit regularly.   .(c)    Sections -  4, 5 and 7  I am struggling to understand these as I don’t have a legal background.  I was wondering if there is anyone who might be able to explain what they mean.  It’s been a horrendous situation where I had to walk away from my mother at her most vulnerable because of; ss (not helping), scammer and groomer. I have no legal background, nor experience in highly manipulative people or an understanding of how the SS system operates, finding myself isolated, scared and powerless to the point I haven’t collected my personal belongings and items for my mother’s room in the care home.  Sadly, the court has only had heard one version of this story SS’s, and based their decision on that. My mother’s situation and the experience I have gone through could happen to anyone who has a vulnerable parent.    If anyone any thoughts on this much appreciated.  Thank you. ______________________________________________________  (Below is the Court of Protection Order)  COURT OF PROTECTION                                                                                                                                                                                   No xxx  MENTAL CAPACITY ACT 2005 In the matter of Name xxx ORDER Made by  Depty District Judge At xxx Made on xxx Issued on 18 January 2024  WHEREAS  1.     xxx Solicitors, Address xxx  ("Applicant”) has applied for an order under the Mental Capacity Act 2005.  2.     The Court notes (my mother) is said to be estranged from all her three children and only one, (me) has been notified.  3.     (Me) was previously appointed as Atorney for Property and Affairs for (my mother).  The Exhibity NAJ at (date) refers to (me) and all replacement Attorneys are now officially standing down.  4.     Pursuant to Rule 9.10 of the Court of Protection Rules 2017 and Practice Direction 9B the Applicant 2must seek to identify at least three persons who are likely to have an interest in being notified that an application has been issues.”  The children of (my mother), and any other appointed attorneys are likely to have an interest in the application, because of the nature of relationship to (my mother).  5.     The Court considers that the notification requirements are an important safeguard for the person in respect of whom an order is sought.  6.     The Court notes that it is said that the local authority no longer has access to (my mother’s) Property.  7.     Further information is required for the Court to determine the application.  IT IS ORDERED THAT  Within 28 days of the issue date this order, the Applicant shall file a form COP24 witness statement confirming that the other children of (my mother) and any replacement attorneys have been notified of the application and shall confirm their name, address, and date upon which those persons were notified.  If the Applicant wishes the Court to dispense with any further notification, they should file a COP9 and COP24 explaining, what steps (if any) have been taken to attempt notification and why notification should be dispensed with.   Pending the determination of the application to appoint a deputy for (my mother), the Applicant is authorised to take such steps as are proportionate and necessary to access, secure and insure the house and property of (my mother).   This order was made without a hearing and without notice.  Any person affected by this order may apply within 21 days of the date on which the order was served to have the order set aside or varied pursuant to Rule 13.4 of the Court of Protection Rules 2017 (“the Rules”).  Such application must be made on Form COP9 and in accordance with Part 10 Rules.              
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Car HP and cca request


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Ive got a car on hp but have never received a credit aggrement all i was given was a pre credit approval form which all the figures are wrong. I am not at the half way stage yet.I can not afford to keep up the repayments and was wondering what happens if i cca them if i can , can they still reposses the car or if they dont produce one what happens re the car do i return it and get my money back or can i keep it with no further payments. Ialso live in scotland which means they have to go to court to get posetion.I will try and scan the form i have later ,thanks for any help

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I love HP agreements. They are so easy to make a pigs ear of....

 

Presumably you bought a car and the dealer sorted out a finance deal for you. You need to scan and post the details of what limited paperwork you have on here.

 

You may have traded in your old car or put down a deposit - but no matter what, you'll have received a separate bill/invoice/receipt for your dealings with the dealer and a separate batch of paperwork for the loan. You must find your paperwork from the dealer - you can get the other stuff for the loan from the finance company later.

 

But what do you have so far?

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HP agreements are nearly always defective

 

You need to CCA and SAR the lender (£1 and £10 respectively). That gets you what you need to know under the Consumer Credit Act and Data Protection Act. Browse the site to see how to do it and why. (It is FAR better that you know why you are doing things rather just knowing what to do).

 

Why do you say the figures on the form are wrong? Did you keep any paperwork from the dealer? (aside from that approval form)

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this is the only paper work i have as the garage and finance company are the same people i part exed a car and was given £4000 for it which cleared the finance owing on it i then paid £395 cash deposit plus financed the rest ie £5000 but the figures show different ,it looks like they added some together then took off th px figure

My Documents.zip

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As predicted...

 

Was the car you were buying £9395?

 

This is not the agreement. It isn't executed and can't be as there isn't any room for signatures of the creditor/debtor.

 

You have no choice but to ask for a copy of the agreement under S79 of the CCA. That will show what paperwork they do have. What you have scanned is not enforceable. What did you sign?

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The agrement has to state the total cash price of the goods and in the pre contract document it says that that is £9395. If that does not apear on the agreement you get under the CCA request (and it won't) then it is unenforceable. But we'll come back to that later on when you get it.

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This is the agreement ive been sent nothing else it does say in box 2 TAP (3+8 is £8680.16 but if you add up box 3 &8 it does not make £8680.16 so im thinkin of using there figures and returning the car with no more to pay as ive paid over £6537.58 according to there workings on this aggrement will i be able to do this any advice very much appreciated

ccagif.zip

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according to my copy of Goode - the total payable under the agreement is

the total cash price 9395?

+ credit and charges 3680

Total payable = 13075 (50% = 6537). This is odd. It's the first one I've seen that's 100% accurate. Bu the date on the agreement is 05/05 (when it was printed?). It's well post Wilson case.

 

Bad news I'm afraid. It is kosher if the price on the windscreen was £9395.

If not, it gets interesting. The total payable under the agreement is the price of the car + credit cost. The cash and car deposit you paid is counted as a credit payable against the "half of the agreement" figure. So quickly terminate. You may find yourself getting a call from the finance people trying to get you to accept a good offer to buy it.

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the price was not on the screen but was told it was £5395 my part ex was on finance and they gave me £4000 in part ex which cleared that finance which is not shown this is where the figures dont make sense to me as it does not show the settlement of my previous hp. so im gonna terminate and take the figures they have used on the agreement theyr not gonna be happy as i live 600 miles from the garage and on an scottish island (expensive ferry crossing) is that there problem or mine

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Doesnt the agreement also have to state how much the deposite was? as i dont see it in there.

OFT debt collection guidance

 

Please remember the only stupid question is the one you dont ask so dont worry about asking the stupid questions.

 

Essex girl in pc world looking 4 curtains 4 her pc,the assistant says u dont need curtains 4 a computer!!Essex girl says,''HELLOOO!! i,ve got WINDOWS!!'.

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Godmother - it does state the deposit on the agreement.

 

Chickenmad. This agreement says that you are paying £9395 for a Rover 75 Club in May 2006. I'm not a car freak but I wouldn't pay that much for a Rover. They were bust by then so there weren't any new models. You say that the price was £5395 - I would say £5 to £6 was about the right figure. Was that figure £5395 agreed? (It is important because those verbal dsicussions also form part of the "contract").

 

You have also said that they would take the car off you and sort out the finance outstanding on it. What was that old car worth (forget the finance) when you got rid of it to the garage? (a rough idea).

 

I think that the HP agreement is NOT enforceable. If you agreed that the cash price of the Rover 75 was £5395 then that is the cash price of the goods. They have deliberately confused the issue by then pushing up the value of the Rover by the amount of the trade in. That affects your rights under the CCA and I think it is clear that that is why they have done that. What it seems that after accounting for finance the old car had no value at all. You are going to tell me what the old car was worth - what was the finance outstanding on it?

 

You might have to Section 142 them. Very rare - but seems like you will need to. Section 142 gets a court to determine the validity of the agreement. It keeps your credit record clean if it currently is.

 

Answer to above ASAP please.

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I cant see it on there but that might be becasue i cant make the document much bigger

OFT debt collection guidance

 

Please remember the only stupid question is the one you dont ask so dont worry about asking the stupid questions.

 

Essex girl in pc world looking 4 curtains 4 her pc,the assistant says u dont need curtains 4 a computer!!Essex girl says,''HELLOOO!! i,ve got WINDOWS!!'.

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the price was agreed verbally as the garage had just got the car in and it wasnt preped they had 2 others for sale around the same price i didnt want to spend more than £5k so im 100% sure of the price the trade in was (no comments please) a kia sportage on a 04 plate but had a strange history of reg by kia but was an import and was worth between £4000 - £4500 had these figures given as partex at several garages and had finance outstanding with log book so was desperate to get out of that mess the settlement was approx £39xx so basically i put down £395 in cash deposit. i definetley bought the car april 05 not may 06 what should be my next move as there chasing for payment

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Its how you want to play it. The agreement is not properly executed as it does not state the total cash price correctly. The figure for credit is stated correctly but by fiddling the cash price they have inflated the amount of the "half the payments bit". I would send off a notice of termination of the agreement. Say that the agreement is now terminated (that means that they can't bang you off a default notice, or if they do it's invalid and simply challengeable in court). Say that the agreement was improperly executed and if they do not accept your calculation of 50% as being £5395 + £3680 = £9075 X 50% = £4537.50 then you will apply to the Court for an order under s142 of the Consumer Credit Act determing this as the correct figure.

 

Dodgy practice by the HP company/garage. And if it isn't, it is just a simple mistake, then I'm proven right - most HP agreements are wrong!

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When you take that car back (reasonable distance) not like AFG say "you've got to bring the car down to Worthing" make sure that you have photographed every inch of the car. Reasonable wear and tear is OK. They will say it has been trashed so "you owe us £500 for repairs to he bodywork". You've had the car for over two years and it can't be expected to look new. The photos in and out are your proof. But make sure that days newspaper headlines are in a couple of the shots.

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im not planning to take it back im gonna tell them to collect it as ill need to pay £100 ferry fare to get off the island then its 60 miles to inverness the nearest town a friend terminated a car a few yrs ago here and the finance company in glasgow left it abandoned for 2yrs till a neibour phoned them and bought it for peanuts off them its far to expensive to collect up here and there 600 miles from me so can go and whistle ,will i need to send off v5 to them so im not liable for it on the road where do i stand

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Good question - what does "reasonable" mean in this context. The agreement is flawed in that it does not correctly state your rights of termination. So you were intent on paying half the payments and then terminating the agreement. But they misled you so you paid too much. It is a "balance" thing. If they decide to take action because you won't take it back where they want then you have the option to go back to the court and apply for the agreement to be effectively rewritten. Which would mean that if you won they would owe you money. So, compromise. Tell them you'll drop if off at the ferry terminal at YOUR end at the time and date of their choosing. Don't forget - all letters by recorded delivery.

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received a letter today from finance company it reads as follows

 

dated 20.11.07

 

Re :your hire purchase agreement and voluntary termination

 

can you please contact us to arrange return of your vehicle with V5 and any relevant paper work within 7 days (27.11.07)

 

when the vehicle has been return to delbrook and as had a satisfactory inspection a balance of £329.17 will be outstanding. This is arrears of £179.17 plus default charges of £150.00

 

I do owe arrears of £179.17 and the £150 is charges for 10 letters at £15 each , so do i write to them and in form them where they can collect the car ie home address or ferry terminal, my other problem is the condition as it needs a tyre has space saver on rear at mo the rear brakes need attention and the 2 front tyres are in need of replacement any ideas whats my best course of action to reduce my liability im broke at the moment so theres no way im delivering it 600 miles away i have about £10 to last me 3 weeks thanks for any help

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