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    • I've just started to read Carey v HSBC on Casemine, 
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    • love the extra £1000 charge for confidentialy there BF   Also OP even if they don't offer OOC it doesn't mean your claim isn't good. I had 3 against EVRi that were heard over the last 3 weeks. They sent me emails asking me to discontinue as I wouldn't win. Went infront of a judge and won all 3.    Just remember the law is on your side. The judges will be aware of this.   Where you can its important to try to point out at the hearing the specific part of the contract they breached. I found this was very helpful and the Judge made reference to it when they gave their judgements and it seemed this was pretty important as once you have identified a specific breach the matter turns straight to liability. From there its a case of pointing out the unlawfullness of their insurance and then that should be it.
    • I know dx and thanks again for yours and others help. I was 99.999% certain last payment was over six years ago if not longer.  👍
    • Paragraph 23 – "standard industry practice" – put this in bold type. They are stupid to rely on this and we might as well carry on emphasising how stupid they are. I wonder why they could even have begun to think some kind of compelling argument – "the other boys do it so I do it as well…" Same with paragraph 26   Paragraph 45 – The Defendants have so far been unable to produce any judgements at any level which disagree with the three judgements…  …court, but I would respectfully request…   Just the few amendments above – and I think it's fine. I think you should stick to the format that you are using. This has been used lots of times and has even been applauded by judges for being meticulous and clear. You aren't a professional. Nobody is expecting professional standards and although it's important that you understand exactly what you are doing – you don't really want to come over to the judge that you have done this kind of thing before. As a litigant in person you get a certain licence/leeway from judges and that is helpful to you – especially if you are facing a professional advocate. The way this is laid out is far clearer than the mess that you will get from EVRi. Quite frankly they undermine their own credibility by trying to say that they should win simply because it is "standard industry practice". It wouldn't at all surprise me if EVRi make you a last moment offer of the entire value of your claim partly to avoid judgement and also partly to avoid the embarrassment of having this kind of rubbish exposed in court. If they do happen to do that, then you should make sure that they pay everything. If they suddenly make you an out-of-court offer and this means that they are worried that they are going to lose and so you must make sure that you get every penny – interest, costs – everything you claimed. Finally, if they do make you an out-of-court offer they will try to sign you up to a confidentiality agreement. The answer to that is absolutely – No. It's not part of the claim and if they want to settle then they settle the claim as it stands and don't try add anything on. If they want confidentiality then that will cost an extra £1000. If they don't like it then they can go do the other thing. Once you have made the amendments suggested above – it should be the final version. court,. I don't think we are going to make any more changes. Your next job good to make sure that you are completely familiar with it all. That you understand the arguments. Have you made a court familiarisation visit?
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Where is the Banks defence?


bruce47
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I thought the banks had until the 28th to submit a defence?

 

Do we know when it will be published, is there any reason its not been published yet? Maybe they have not entered a defence? it will be good to see so some of the more legally minded members can give us there view on it.

 

Could we email the OFT and request a copy of it or do they not have to show it to us?

 

Reading the agreement the OFT have until the 26th Oct to respond to the defence.

 

I hope its not like the waiver review and takes 2 months for them to publish the documents

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Just spoke to the delightful Kate Farrow at OFT and she's going to let me know when they get the ok to post it on the OFT site.

 

They definately have the defense (and counterclaim) and are ''very keen'' to put it up but their lawyers are still looking at the legalities of making them public.

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Well at least they have received it!

 

Just hope it doesnt take them to long to publish it, if it is to be a public document then why should there lawyers have to look at it first.

 

Anyway good news just hope they pull there fingers out.

 

I wonder what the counter claim is? will be intresting

 

Thanks for the info

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I spoke to OFT today regarding the banks defence, they say they are going through it at the moment to see what they can publish as there is some commercially sensitive data in it which they have to remove, also they are altering there POC due to the banks defence.

I asked where else i can get an original copy of the defence with nothing deleted. He said you would need to apply to the High Courts civil procedures rules where an un edited copy of the defence can be obtained.

Just spoke to Royal Courts Justice - 020 79476000

Commercial Dept / Registry Claim no - 2007 folio 1186

The banks have entered 7/8 defences so it seems they all have there own. got an address of them

Royal Courts of Justice

Commercial Court

Room EB13

Strand

London

WC2A 2LL

They say you need to request copies of the defence in writing first, they will then write back to tell you how much the docs will cost, send a cheque and they will send the docs on.

I will send of and keep you updated and again anyone else can do the same to see who gets them first. Prob better to just email them to MOD as i wouldn’t want to copy and paste them onto a thread just in case

Just a shame about the postal strikes.

Also actually she mentioned if i was close by so i presume if anyone is near the address they can call in get a price and call back to pick up the defence would save a lot of time but i am miles away.

Thanks

Bruce

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Sounds good, there are 8 defences i from eack bank. Funny enough i asked if they can email the defence to me and they said no it would have to be in hard copies. But i guess its who asks for it!!!

 

I have wrote a letter to send to them today so will send it anyway. Keep us posted if there is anything intresting. It will be good to have a un edited copy so we can see what the OFT have taken out when they publish the defence themselves.

 

Thanks

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Yeah it would be very interesting to see what they leave out. The solicitor

I spoke to seemed to think the banks were in negotiation with the OFT as

to what goes up on the site but actually the defence is a public document. I'll post it up as soon as I get it.

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Well yet again the banks are idiots - who cares what they post on the OFT website. Anyone with interest will be able to obtain a copy from the court - this includes other banks - the only people who could actually make use of this 'commercially sensitive information'.

 

What this commercially sensitive information actually is is the tiny cost of processing a bank charge - but we know that anyway - Banks and OFT: stop stalling.

A £35 pound bank charge is not a charge for a service. Its theft.

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And why the hell are the OFT not publishing this public document - I mean - anyone who is interested is going to see the unedited version anyway - whos side are the OFT on here?

A £35 pound bank charge is not a charge for a service. Its theft.

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And why the hell are the OFT not publishing this public document - I mean - anyone who is interested is going to see the unedited version anyway - whos side are the OFT on here?[/quote]

 

Certainly not ours if the last few months are anything to go by..:-?

27th April - Requested Statements

13th May - Received Statements:D

15th May - Preliminary request for £4780 sent.:D

16th May - Royal Mail confirm Letter received.:D

23rd May - Received Letter considering claim. :grin:

30th May - Letter Before Action sent. :D

10th July - Times Up!! FOS claim going in.

16th July - Measly 30% of claim offered as goodwill

17th July - Rejected offer letter sent

25th July - Acknowledgement of Reject Letter received

26th July - Screwed over by the OFT,Banks, FSA & FOS all in one go.:evil:

Never even felt it happen.

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I emiled them for the price and sending the defence to me and got a price of,

 

I unable to email you the copies of that you have requested as we do not have the facility to do that at the moment. I can only send you the hardcopies of the documents via the post. So please can you provide the court with a postal address. And unfortunately have already sent those documents to our reprographics department for photocopying so as soon as I get it back which normally takes 48 hrs, will I be able to tell you the exact cost. I can pre-warn you that we do charge £5 for the first 10 pages & 50 pence there after per document.

so i think! its going to be around £4 if i am correct in thinking 50 pence per document then means each defence as there are 8 of them?

Hopefuly CRX250 will get a copy first, but we will get copies before they are published by the OFT anyway!!

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I too am very interested in getting sight of these docs as soon as possible. I have done the same thing, phoned the court, got the same story as other posteres and phoned and emailed the OFT. However, I have now seen the other posts on here and would be grateful if first person to receive unedited copies could post them on this thread. We also need to make sure that we get sight of any counterclaims issued by the Banks. Counterclaims are probably the reason why the OFT now wish to amend their own POC.

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I have received an email back regarding the price just as well i was sat down!!

 

 

The copies have come back & the full cost for your photocopying is £85.50 and the cheque should be made payable to HMCS ( Her Majesty Court Service

 

Yours Sincerely

 

 

I think i may need to do a pay per view lol!!!

 

I am going to send of the the un edited copy as the OFT defence when published i expect will be half as long as these ones.

 

I wont be able to post them on the site because there is approx 160 pages according to the price and i don't have the time to scan all the pages and post them.

 

If any member wants to do this i can get copies done and post them to an address for them if they cover the costs of the copys and postage, sorry but its the best i can do. If there was 20 -30 pages i would scan them and put them on a thread but 160 would take to long.

 

CRFX250 have you any idea when you will receive the PDF version as this would be a lot quicker to put on a thread, also just out of intrest i got a reply back from Sion Simon MP the guy on the Northen rock program last week, asking for my postal address so he can reply back in writing to me. I am guessing if i say where my address is which is 120 miles from where he is he will say to speak to my own MP?? or do you think he still might reply?? not emailed my address yet just thought i would see what you think first.

 

Thanks

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HI Bruce,

 

If you're going to order the full docs then I don't mind scanning them and posting them here. I'll happily send you a cheque for copies and postage. PM me with the amount I need to send you and address.

A £35 pound bank charge is not a charge for a service. Its theft.

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just a quick question - if the banks have not filed totally the same defence - or one of them makes a slip up in the wording could there be a different outcome from one bank to the other?

 

Or as it is OFT agaist all the banks named could there only be one decision?

 

Probably a stupid question - just curious

 

Jan

Please note I am not an expert - I am not offering opinions or legal help - Please use all the information provided on the site in FAQ- step by step instructions and library- thanks Jansus:)

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/images/icons/icon1.gif

offer from A&L 24/8/07 - after case stayed

 

"What makes the desert beautiful is that somewhere it hides a well." - Antione de Saint Exupery

 

 

PROUD TO BE AN ORANGE

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