Jump to content


Does Statute Barred Rule Apply To Dwp ?


DOBBYDOG
style="text-align: center;">  

Thread Locked

because no one has posted on it for the last 6050 days.

If you need to add something to this thread then

 

Please click the "Report " link

 

at the bottom of one of the posts.

 

If you want to post a new story then

Please

Start your own new thread

That way you will attract more attention to your story and get more visitors and more help 

 

Thanks

Recommended Posts

Enquiry for a friend.

 

Was claiming benefits many moons ago.

Had a social fund loan for around £400.

Stopped claiming benefits and started work in 2000. No contact or any payments since then.

Now has letter from Fredrick International LTD asking for full payment of over £300.

 

Question, Does the six year rule apply to this debt.

Many thanks in advance. x

Link to post
Share on other sites

Does the six year rule apply to this debt.

 

Yes.

HAVE YOU BEEN TREATED UNFAIRLY BY CREDITORS OR DCA's?

 

BEWARE OF CLAIMS MANAGEMENT COMPANIES OFFERING TO WRITE OFF YOUR DEBTS.

 

 

Please note opinions given by rory32 are offered informally as a lay-person in good faith based on personal experience. For legal advice, you must always consult a registered and insured lawyer.

Link to post
Share on other sites

To expand slightly on the above :razz:

 

The DWP has 6 years to take action through the courts to recover benefit overpayments and social fund loans. This time starts running from the date of the final decision made on the overpayment and from when the social fund loan was due to be paid. But the DWP are still allowed to make deductions from your benefit for a debt over 6 years old as they don’t need to go to court to do this. This applies to overpayments of benefits such as income support, job seekers allowance, pension credit, housing benefit, council tax benefit and paying back social fund loans.

Link to post
Share on other sites

They can take it from most benefits you may claim in future, with the exception of some disability benefits which are protected. They do not have to go to to court to do this, and there's no legal obligation to inform you in advance that this is what they intend to do if the six years has passed. The Statute of Limitations applies, but unlike ordinary unsecured debts on simple contract, doesn't stop recovery by DWP but does stop a DCA.

 

It is a debt to the Crown which could be taken from a pension or even from your 'estate' after death, if a relative claims a Funeral Grant. Doing away with the old Benefits Agency and merging with others to form DWP made it a lot easier to do this.

 

It was unusual to use DCA's in the past as the overwhelming majority of people would at some point come into contact with DWP again, but now with private pension arrangements, and people moving abroad quite freely etc, they do make more of an effort to chase them up, rather than just wait.

 

I think it's highly unlikely that the DCA will/can actually do anything about it anyway.

HOIST BY THEIR OWN PETARD.

 

Blimey it works....:-)

Link to post
Share on other sites

I'll try to be as brief as my previous post :p

 

Yes.

HAVE YOU BEEN TREATED UNFAIRLY BY CREDITORS OR DCA's?

 

BEWARE OF CLAIMS MANAGEMENT COMPANIES OFFERING TO WRITE OFF YOUR DEBTS.

 

 

Please note opinions given by rory32 are offered informally as a lay-person in good faith based on personal experience. For legal advice, you must always consult a registered and insured lawyer.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Exactly, The Limitations Act applies to all debts in England and Wales, even crown debts like council tax.

HAVE YOU BEEN TREATED UNFAIRLY BY CREDITORS OR DCA's?

 

BEWARE OF CLAIMS MANAGEMENT COMPANIES OFFERING TO WRITE OFF YOUR DEBTS.

 

 

Please note opinions given by rory32 are offered informally as a lay-person in good faith based on personal experience. For legal advice, you must always consult a registered and insured lawyer.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Sorry for butting in again, but this will be useful for the CSA stuff,

 

English and Welsh enforcement guides - Advisers section - Child Support Agency

 

Check Chapter 2 Sec 7 about liability orders, and limitations. A lot will depend on your individual circumstances.

HOIST BY THEIR OWN PETARD.

 

Blimey it works....:-)

Link to post
Share on other sites

Exactly, The Limitations Act applies to all debts in England and Wales, even crown debts like council tax.

 

i'm sorry sir, that statement isn't correct. Whilst the limitation act doesn't apply on c.tax, it has it's own limitation period under reg 34(3) of the Council Tax (Administration & Enforcement) Regulations 1992 (SI 613/1992). The Local Authority may not apply for a Liability Order after "the period of six years beginning with the day on which it becomes due". This was clarified furthermore by Regentford v Thanet District Council (2004) which stated that the limitation period runs from the date that a demand for payment is first served on the c.tax payer. The usual acknowledgement/part-payment rules apply.

 

There is no limitation period for Income Tax or VAT arrears and i'm pretty sure there isn't one for CSA arrears either.

  • Haha 3
Link to post
Share on other sites

Damn, sorry about that rowbo.

 

Sequenci, thanks for correcting me.

HAVE YOU BEEN TREATED UNFAIRLY BY CREDITORS OR DCA's?

 

BEWARE OF CLAIMS MANAGEMENT COMPANIES OFFERING TO WRITE OFF YOUR DEBTS.

 

 

Please note opinions given by rory32 are offered informally as a lay-person in good faith based on personal experience. For legal advice, you must always consult a registered and insured lawyer.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Oh bugger looks like I owe the CSA 3 Grand from when I was working and now I'm on benefits they want it all...bugger!

 

let me investigate this for you. i'll try and be as quick as i can but i'm busy in my dayjob at the mo (mondays are always crazy busy!)

Link to post
Share on other sites

Thanks sequenci I'd appreciate that its just this debt was incurred about 1998-99 and now its 2007 and they want their money!!! Never heard of it till now, hopeful as ever, Phil.

 

no worries,

 

i've been chatting with one of my superiors here about this. she seems to think that there used to be a six year rule for the csa to obtain a liability order but now that has been quashed and they can obtain a liability order whenever they like! - i'm still on the case with this and hope to have a definative answer by 4.30

Link to post
Share on other sites

Here we go:

 

From 12th July 2006, a liability order can be sought no matter how old the debt, except for amounts that became due on of before 12 july 2000. Debts that are older than six years on 12 july 2006 cannot be enforced and will be recovered by other methods such as Deduction from Earnings orders. The six years do not begin to run until the non-resident parents is notified of the assessment or calculation.

 

So, in essence, the time limit starts when the debt became due, any idea of when this was? I'm thinking they didn't state they actually want their money until recently?

Link to post
Share on other sites

DWP have a Debt Management section on their website at DWP - Debt Management Customer Charter. It contains a code of practice, and is worth reading:

 

In delivering our services we will:

  • set clear standards so that you know what you can expect
  • communicate clearly and effectively and in plain language
  • make our services easy to use, particularly for those with specific needs
  • treat people fairly and with respect
  • treat what you tell us as confidential
  • put things right as quickly and efficiently as possible, if they go wrong.

 

They go on to list a number of external companies they use (which doesn't include Fredrickson).

 

It also contains their complaints procedure. As well as sending the DCA a 'statute barred' letter, I'd also complain to DWP about a) being chased for a statute-barred debt, b) not being contacted directly by them first, and c) why Fredricksons isn't on their list.

 

Thinking aloud: Do government debt-collecting departments need a consumer credit licence? Whether they do or not, does the third party responsibility for DCA's actions referred to in the OFT Guidelines apply to them?

Link to post
Share on other sites

DWP have a Debt Management section on their website at DWP - Debt Management Customer Charter. It contains a code of practice, and is worth reading:

 

 

 

They go on to list a number of external companies they use (which doesn't include Fredrickson).

 

It also contains their complaints procedure. As well as sending the DCA a 'statute barred' letter, I'd also complain to DWP about a) being chased for a statute-barred debt, b) not being contacted directly by them first, and c) why Fredricksons isn't on their list.

 

Thinking aloud: Do government debt-collecting departments need a consumer credit licence? Whether they do or not, does the third party responsibility for DCA's actions referred to in the OFT Guidelines apply to them?

 

SP,

 

If I may step in again for a second, I think I can provide some answers.

 

a) The Statute of Limitations may not apply in this case as per the link provided in my earlier post, depending on circumstances and liability orders. With these kind of debts it is wrong to automatically assume six years and you're in the clear. If it's been to a Magistrate, it could come back at a later date.

 

b) Not sure about the precise details but if there are no benefits involved at the moment the DWP, or CSA in this case will try other methods if they can't make direct deductions from benefit. This will also depend on the age of the claim and liabilty order

 

c) The list you provided is for DWP - CSA is to all intents and purposes a separate entity using it's own methods and agents. They've had a lot of bad press as everyone knows, so they are actually being encouraged to be ruthless to collect more money from absent parents. Whether that's a good or bad thing is entirely down to your individual point of view.

 

Government departments dont need a CCL, but third party agents would be expected to abide by OFT guidelines particularly on harassment and data protection. If they don't, then it is VERY important to complain directly to a local DWP/CSA office. Once you have the name of DWP/CSA staff dealing with your case, they have a sense of accountability and you'll probably find the heavy stuff will stop and attitudes will change. After all, they run the risk of getting their arses kicked whereas DCA staff get away with it.

HOIST BY THEIR OWN PETARD.

 

Blimey it works....:-)

Link to post
Share on other sites

Please let me explain:-

Met woman-had child-asked to leave-she had someone else-parted-csa contacted-year lated csa spring £3000 payday for her- I become ill-leave work-benefits-contacted 2007 august-pay up £123.00 a month or Debt collector gets it-can't pay- DCA on case- agreed on £50.00 a month-but is statue barred right? Found CAG-writing this-never been in front of magistrate- I'm here now.....What do you think people?

Link to post
Share on other sites

Please let me explain:-

Met woman-had child-asked to leave-she had someone else-parted-csa contacted-year lated csa spring £3000 payday for her- I become ill-leave work-benefits-contacted 2007 august-pay up £123.00 a month or Debt collector gets it-can't pay- DCA on case- agreed on £50.00 a month-but is statue barred right? Found CAG-writing this-never been in front of magistrate- I'm here now.....What do you think people?

 

My opinion??

 

Tell the DCA to F... O..

Contact CSA tell them you are prepared to pay the 50 notes (or less!!),...... but because you were unaware of the full details and circumstances of the claim you wish for your circumstances to be reassessed (you're not too well) and to appeal against the alleged arrears which are based on an incorrect assessment.

 

That'll get things rolling.

 

The case may have been to a Magistrate, not you personally, you don't have to appear. Once you know what the situation is, you will be in a better position to argue your case.

 

Get a second opinion before you do anything - there may be a better way

 

All the best.

  • Haha 1

HOIST BY THEIR OWN PETARD.

 

Blimey it works....:-)

Link to post
Share on other sites

Enquiry for a friend.

 

Was claiming benefits many moons ago.

Had a social fund loan for around £400.

Stopped claiming benefits and started work in 2000. No contact or any payments since then.

Now has letter from Fredrick International LTD asking for full payment of over £300.

 

Question, Does the six year rule apply to this debt.

Many thanks in advance. x

 

 

I'm all confused now with all the CSA stuff going on :confused: as not sure if this is the same or not. Would it be wise to send the statute barred letter or to make an offer of payment related to this post :rolleyes: Many thanks x

 

Good luck Rowbo. I hope you get it sorted ;)

Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm all confused now with all the CSA stuff going on :confused: as not sure if this is the same or not. Would it be wise to send the statute barred letter or to make an offer of payment related to this post :rolleyes: Many thanks x

 

Good luck Rowbo. I hope you get it sorted ;)

 

DWP debts can be stat barred but if you claim benefits in the future they amount owing can be taken from that.

 

the limitation act bars the remedy but not the right.

Link to post
Share on other sites

First let me apologise to Dobbydog for hi-jacking the thread, I apologise my friend...but I have news.....(Interesting I hear you cry!).. come theres more to tell!!!

Phoned CSA about the whole thing. Very nice chap provided me with some interesting information:-

1) the assessment from the CSA was carried out when I was working in 1999(news to me too!) and the amount calculated at £2295 in my absence(they had me down at my mothers!)

2) I informed chap of 6 year Statue barring he agreed and said "NO COURT ACTION CAN BE TAKEN NOW OR EVER!" but debt will still exist, if you follow me

3) I will not be chased except by toothless DCA's!(my thoughts!) on his words so have cancelled my debt card and ordered a new one so DCA can't cash in on my money(had given the DCA my details before I met CAG and its band of followers!)

I am a happy man now again thanks to CAG advice and three grand better off!!!! OH HAPPY DAYS, OH HAPPY DAYS!

Link to post
Share on other sites

That's excellent news. :) :)

 

Unlike DCA's they are 'target' driven, and that's another one accounted for. ;)

 

I knew it wouldn't be too bad, and not going through all the assessment/appeal process is a real winner, you definitely got a good one there - Govt depts are are far easier to deal with than DCA's.

 

Now you can well and truly tell the DCA to F... O.. !!!

 

 

 

 

Beer time....:)

HOIST BY THEIR OWN PETARD.

 

Blimey it works....:-)

Link to post
Share on other sites

Enquiry for a friend.

 

Was claiming benefits many moons ago.

Had a social fund loan for around £400.

Stopped claiming benefits and started work in 2000. No contact or any payments since then.

Now has letter from Fredrick International LTD asking for full payment of over £300.

 

Question, Does the six year rule apply to this debt.

Many thanks in advance. x

 

 

Dobbydog,

 

If you are working now, and have not made any payments on the Social Fund loan for at least six years, you could ignore the DCA. They can't do anything, but they will pester you beyond belief.

 

If you do nothing now, if/when you claim anything from DWP in future there is a very high probability they will just automatically start deductions for the outstanding loan. As I said earlier, some disability benefits are protected but IS, JSA etc they will just dip in and help themselves at a rate of 5-10 quid a week depending on what you are getting. There's not much you can do to stop it.

 

The alternative is to contact them and offer to pay what you can afford. It would be a good idea to first ask for proof of the loan in the form of a copy of the original application. That can be difficult for them to get hold of depending on many factors, and they may offer you a 'screen print' of your Social Fund record which could include the giro number and where and when it was cashed, or to which account it was paid. It is quite difficult to question some of these things without raising the question of fraud, and that is not a good road to take (if you really did have the money).

 

The choice is yours, but I'm sure you'll find things are not half as bad as you might expect. Often the target is to clear up arrears, whether that means by payment or write-off will largely depend on who you speak to, and how you deal with it.

 

All the best.

HOIST BY THEIR OWN PETARD.

 

Blimey it works....:-)

Link to post
Share on other sites

  • Recently Browsing   0 Caggers

    • No registered users viewing this page.

  • Have we helped you ...?


×
×
  • Create New...