This is because the ruling by the OFT mentioned £12 - the banks assume that means its ok to charge £12 now. HSBC likely decided to make it a tenner to seem like they are the "nicer" bank - its still a huge rip off since its all automated and likely costs them under £1 per transaction!

Apparently, according to their Customer Services Representative whom I spoke to this morning (I returned her call to me) the Data Protection department at Halifax BOS don't believe that a man walking in off the street and gaining access to my personal information which was held in my name only is a breach of the data protection act! I've blogged my story - I'd like to have it passed around and bandied about as much as possible so heres a link if anyone is interested. I've put in a complaint with the Consumer complaints web page of the OFT suggesting that Halifax service is "not fit for purpose." Taking the day off today to fill in the forms for the information commissioners office and to read up on the banking ombudsman. How they can now say "it wasn't a breach in the data protection act" when they have already admitted liability in a letter to me I don't know.

haha I'd be hopping mad if they did that! Funny thing is this, when I was about Ooo 18 my mum persuaded one of my brothers to call my bank and ask them about my financial status. Anyway long story short bank read me the notes of his conversation with them over the phone to me - at the end the guy said "oh *&^% I wasnt supposed to tell you that" - back then there was no data protection act to protect me. Today there is - its bad enough when a family member does it but a complete stranger? I want their guts and his for garters. I'd like some new earrings made of some of their dangly bits too

Ooh good call re OFT.. hrmm I guess tonight I spend my evening doing more research and less knitting

Yep thats exactly what I'd like to see happen - see them fined. I'd like to see that happen its like giving them a kick in the hoobajoobs via someone else. I dunno if I should accept the £150 and tell them I dont accept it as full and final settlement or just ignore it and hit up the information commissioners office and the ombudsman. Wondering if I should contact the FSA too

Thanks for the reply! Not sure what I need the legal advice for tho? I mean clearly they aren't going to do anything about the breach and they have made it absolutely crystal clear that this is the final and full settlement they would be prepared to offer. Oddly its not really about the money its more about what the hell they are going to do to stop this happening again in the future. And today I read that the indian call centres that Halifax employed have been selling our data for a fiver a pop! Credit data stolen at Indian call centres - Sunday Times - Times Online

I don't really know where to put this, so I've picked here if it is wrong, I apologise. I really want to make as many people as possible aware of my story: On Tuesday 8 August 2006 I went and had a jab for Tetanus, Diphtheria and Polio. I was laid up for a couple of days after and returned to work on the Friday 11th August for half a day. When I got there, I called Halifax insurance division in relation to a problem I was having with a buildings insurance policy that was a block policy. They had not noted another property by address on the block policy which was taken out in 1997 (the property is the flat above my own) - they told me that they were not insuring anything other than one property and they said "we did tell you all this on 8th August." Cue my concern that I didn't speak to them on 8th August - so who did they speak to? I was still rather poorly and let it slide till Monday 14th when I was back to full health. I called them on 14th and asked who they had spoken to on the 8th as it certainly wasn't me. Apparently "someone" had gone into my local branch in Wimbledon and had spoken to a member of staff there, who had called the Insurance division on two separate occasions over some time from 11:55am. The staff member, who's name I won't reveal initially though I am sorely tempted to do so, was a woman who had worked for Halifax for some time and was a very experienced staffer - so much so that she was the front of house contact person. As it turns out, the person who walked in was a man. I am a woman with a rather feminine name, and frankly never in my life have I ever met a man with my name. I don't honestly ever think I will either. Apparently, this man had some kind of letter from a solicitor - the letter has never been produced by Halifax BOS, therefore it either doesn't exist or they didn't bother to take a copy of it to help back them up when they were caught. So it transpires that the man who did this was the man who lives upstairs from me. He admitted this to me on 1 September, where he laughed in my face and said he hadn't broken the law but the bank were at fault as they shouldn't have given him the information, he didn't care though as he had what he wanted. The information they gave him was that the building he lives in is not insured, this was incorrect information and Halifax insurance have since assured me that the building IS insured and has been insured since 1997. They changed underwriters at one point and therefore they no longer offer block policies but that they would honour the policy but not renew it in October (as it happens they sent me a renewal letter just this week!). The man owed me insurance payments for the last four years and in light of the information they gave him, he refused to pay what he owed. I tried to call Halifax on 14th August; some 40 telephone calls later (in which I was asked my security details twice only) where you call a number that takes you through to a call centre who then connect you to the branch (they won't give you the branch telephone number) yielded nothing but a ringing phone repeatedly. Eventually I extracted a fax number and branch manager’s name. I sent 5 faxes asking them to call me urgently as there was a possible fraud / ID theft going on on one of my accounts (at this stage I didn't know who had got the info just that someone had). I received silence in response. The call centre assured me they had sent emails to the Manager and to the staff member who had given out my information asking them to call me. I had no choice then but to take 15th August off work. I'd wasted an entire working day on phone calls and faxes and now I was forced to take a day off to go and deal with this. I went into my branch in Wimbledon and the first person I met was the staff member in question. I asked her if she recognised me, and when she said no I presented her with my passport and asked her if she recognised my name now. Her face paled a little and then I hit with the burning question "could you explain to me why you have given out information on one of my accounts last Tuesday morning to someone who was not me?" She went to get the manager. She then came out and offered me a cup of tea or coffee in the nicest possible way but her face gave away that she was rather scared and upset. She knew she had done wrong. The manager finally came out and I requested that we establish a) was it a man or a woman who had come in b) I wished to view CCTV footage and c) I wished the police to be involved. I was sweet talked nicely and told I had to give them 5 days and that CCTV footage is not held on the premises and that I shouldn't involve the police just yet. I left rather incensed and still with no explanation. So I took a trip to the police who told me that I should give them the five days they requested and then review how I felt. Five days came and passed. I called the manager (she gave me a number for the branch finally) and asked what was happening. She said she'd passed it to head office "haven't they contacted you?" She then composed a letter admitting liability and offered me £50 as a gesture of goodwill and hand delivered the letter on her way home that night. I wrote back thanking her for the gesture and pointing out the very real and actual cost to me in terms of finances (two days salary) and in addition the worry that my personal data was now floating around with some random stranger who walked in off the street. I was told it was to be passed to head office. 8 weeks later I finally get a scrawled letter saying "sorry you aren't happy we can offer you £150 as full and final settlement" and here’s how to contact the ombudsman. I've not replied to that, but I chatted to the nice chap in customer services who was dealing with the insurance side of things. He asked me how everything else was; I told him what they had said in the banking division. Interestingly he was rather shocked himself and said he thought it was appalling and that it seemed a bit stupid to just offer £150 which doesn’t cover my costs, and suggest I go to the ombudsman when it will cost Halifax £380 if I go to the ombudsman irrespective of whether they are found at fault or not! Anyway so here I am, with an offer of £150 in full and final settlement - I don't want to accept it as "full and final settlement" - I'd hoped they would go after the guy as it is the guy who lives upstairs from me and he has openly admitted he did it. His solicitor tried to fob it off as "oh his mortgage is with Halifax thats why he did it" when the reality is, he bought his place for cash outright - he doesn't have a mortgage. So I guess I'm taking a nice trip to the Ombudsman and wondering how I go about contacting the Information Comissioners Office. Ultimately for me it isn't about the money side of things, it is entirely the principle of the thing; that a random person of the opposite sex can walk in off the street and just get detailled information about policy or account documents without challenge from the staff at Halifax. So since they were nice and understanding and helpful about this, I'm going to stick a SAR in next week when I've finished putting together my nat west claim

I wrote to give them the 7 days as a gesture of goodwill and two days later a letter arrived apologising and telling me they had now ordered the other statements and that they couldn't possibly point out where manual intervention had taken place since that would be too much like hard work Bang on the 7th day the post arrived with copy statements. Now to squeeze in the time to work out the charges! In addition - I know this isn't the place for it but still its my thread ;P - Halifax BOS have made a major breach in the data protection act by giving information to a 3rd party (a man at that and I have a very girly name - there is no way a man is named by my forename). They offered me £50 as a soother, it didn't even cover my costs as I had to take time off work since they wouldn't answer the phone at my branch where they made the breach. So they then offered me £150 as full and final settlement. This one is going to be an interesting series of events, I'm also off to prepare my letter to the Ombudsman and the information commissioners office to report them for a serious breach in the data protection act!

Tracey - have you had any luck with this? Wondered if they did comply with your SAR, they have partly complied with mine providing statements to October 2002 - there are still another two years of statements (and thats the time they hit me with the massive charges) to come...

An update - I know it isn't the 40 days till tomorrow, however the documentation hasn't come and there has been no correspondence from them at all. Should I give them 7 days extra by letter as a gesture of goodwill?

The local planning officer told me it was a matter for buildings control. Buildings control told me it was a matter for planning. Both shirked any involvement whatsoever and both told me that you don't ever need planning permission for anything, but that its there as a precaution should someone object to the works I told them both I'd like to object to the works and both said I couldn't :? She has refused to stop work. I guess I'm gonna have to go pay for legal advice on this matter too urgh. Already working on 3 other litigation matters to do with the tenant. I can see me having to sell and move out of the area over all of this - the neighbours who I've never had any contact with have suddenly all ganged up on me!

Next Wednesday, 27th September, will be 40 days since my initial letter to Nat West (sent on 18 August 2006). I've still only received statements from October 2002 onwards. I did send a letter on 31 August reminding them they have 27 days left. If they fail to respond I guess they get a letter giving them 7 more days then we take it from there. I hope they do respond, I don't want to have to estimate costs.

I am a freeholder of my property and the flat above me. My tenant wishes to sell and there has been inumerable shennanigans by him in this process (including him going into my bank and extracting information from them by deception - they have admitted that this has happened and accepted liability. He has also been withholding payment on buildings insurance). On 31 July he apparently signed a party wall agreement with my neighbour on the other side who wishes to put in a loft conversion. On 11 September he said to me he had done this. I contacted the neighbour and told her the party wall agreement she has is defective. She then served me with party wall agreement papers and insisted I sign them immediately. I'm not overly happy about ANY of this, as far as I can tell I should have been given written notice two months in advance. Can I accept that the party wall agreement she has given me is my two months written notice or am I now forced to sign this agreement immediately as she is saying I have to? I honestly have been mucked about and given so much stress by my tenant and now by her since the beginning of July. She has done nothing but be argumentative and antagonistic since I advised her the party wall agreement she has is defective. She came to see me and asked me to sign it - I said I would like to get advice before signing it and she went off the deep end at me. When she finally stopped going off the deep end she started trying to emotionally blackmail me by saying she has children and they will have to move out etc. She doesn't have any children that I've ever seen or heard and I've lived there for 10 years! She appears to have a flat mate who is in her 20s! I tried to discuss this with her rationally again today and she just went off on one at me again becoming argumentative and saying "all you have to do is sign it" - the agreement she has given me says stuff like "I agree that I have had the plans explained to me in full by the architect" when I haven't. I also know that I am entitled to a surveyor and she says that "there are ways around this to save time - I can take before and after photos to satisfy you that I've not damaged your wall" I'm not interested in saving time any more - I would have been happy to accommodate in as quick a way as possible till she started to really **** me off and add even more stress on me. I tried to get help from the planning department and buildings control - the planning permission has not yet been granted and in addition they told me that in fact no one ever needs planning application it is just a precaution in case anyone objects!!!! IF that is true why the hell do we ever bother to apply for planning? The work has already started! Buildings control said it was nothing to do with them and that it was a matter between me and her. I find it incredible that they don't care that work has already started!!! The woman didn't even apologise to me for not doing her research properly - if she had at least bloody said "I'm really sorry I've messed up" instead of just yelling her head off and trying to bully me into signing this thing immediately I wouldn't be so upset! Can anyone offer advise?

I agree! Taking it one at a time and as a challenge is a great outlook. I also wish I'd known long ago what I have learned here. I've been so excited and happy to find this place (found when looking for "action against other bank" on google for the DPA breach) I've emailled our whole office with the details! (thats only about 15 people but hey 15 more into the pot all helps!). My memory is horrid too, I'm glad we can come back here to find what we need and yes everyone here has been completely fantastic! Good luck with the procedure, can't wait to get my "stuart Higley" eventually!

Urgh I should have researched you before replying as I did then! I'm so sorry that sounds like hell on earth! I'm dealing with another matter at the moment too - actually its a twofold matter; my other bank (the one I went to after nat west) gave some information about one of my accounts to an 'unnamed' 3rd party. The staff member said the bloke had a solicitors letter but still she shouldn't have given it out - I'm a woman with a girly name. I'd be in shock to ever meet a bloke with my forename! They are at the moment negotiating with me for a compensatory fee (and likely hush money) but it actually turns out the man in question is my tenant (I'm a freeholder) and he lives upstairs from me! He is selling his place; he is using the information he obtained that day (which actually was wrong - the bank screwed up twice, gave out info and gave out WRONG info) to withhold almost £600 from me. Its a huge mess, and I'm very close to litigating. His purchasor has said they will give him till tomorrow to pay up or they pull out. I've felt terribly alone in all of this really (until now!), the treatment nat west gave me was horrible but frankly its nothing in comparison to what you appear to be going through (and many others here on this site too). When I settle with the other bank on the other matter, I'll be going after them for charges too =D Well done you for staying composed, quite honestly I'd have completely lost it if I'd been you!!

Right - I've sent them another letter saying "you've missed out statements prior to October 2002 and the notes etc but you have 27 days left to cough em up" and I've just totted up what they have charged me since then. I have to say for the most part until October last year the account had been run in credit. I accidentally went overdrawn on it last October when in the USA on holiday my main card wouldn't work in a cash machine so I used the nat west one thinking I'd be ok. Anyway since October last year I've been charged.... *drum roll* £354.50! Thats pretty stinky! I can't wait to get the other statements, I KNOW from back then it was over the £600 mark. NW staff member - you are correct and thank you for that, it was indeed Referral Fees - they appear up and down each month over the last ten months and the most charged in any one month is indeed £90!

I'd just use the template letters - one of the best things about them (and I'll dig out the link in a min) is that it helps to keep your anger in check. I have just sent an LBA to do with my statements. It was a nice reminder template to say "hey you haven't done as request but its ok you still have 27 days to respond!" If they don't then they get the final one which is "give in 7 days or meet my friend, Ms Knee in your proverbial hoobajoos" OK the templates library is here http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/bank-templates-library/ If you aren't sure which letter to send follow the other threads which are at the same stage as you to so you send the right thing. It's very important to ensure you are sending the right thing at the right time. If you are still stuck, the site chat (which works very well) is a good place to go but beware of pink pants. Edit to say: if I didnt have the templates to follow I'd fail because I know that my anger would get the better of me and it would come across in my own composed correspondence. Once one openly loses ones temper one has instantly lost the fight. Try to stay calm if you can - I know its not easy but we'll all be here to cheer you on!

OK reading another thread http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/natwest-bank/21849-warms-natwest-2.html this looks very much like the standard bog off letter - was it from stuart wossisname? Issue your LBA now and stick to your timetable to show you mean business.

I'll bump and hope someone else can help with this. I would have said that while it IS confidential it directly relates to you and that you have requested this under the S.A.R and they have to comply. I could be very wrong - what we need is Natweststaffmember or someone else to give advice here. I'm sorry that I'm no expert and that my replies are very much guesses, I'm hoping to learn from your experience with this too.

hah - the things they did to sell records back then

I should have been clearer - this is what I was responding to when relating to not posting abroad.

haha I guess I am still a youngster but that one was one of the ones I remembered while typing this - I've no idea why *laugh* Do I correctly remember a green vinyl version of God Save The Queen? =D

Well - you are correct in that if the terms and conditions state you may make a single copy for back up purposes then of course you may make a single copy However if it doesn't expressly say that, then copying it for any reason without permission is breaching copyright laws. However, not that I could possibly advocate such a thing in my position, who's gonna know if you make a back-up for the kids to paw all over with greasy fingers or not? Interestingly, copying a track you've bought off iTunes onto your iPod is technically breaking copyright law.. There is a minor loophole something entitled "The Analogue Hole" and that is recording something you are hearing through the speaker jack. That is one way of circumventing the copy protection stuff without actually breaking the copy protection software on the product. There is software that assists in doing this too. Technically this is still breaking copyright law unless you have the express permission of the copyright holder. Music is moving into being a commodity - to some extent it already is. You listen to the radio right? You know you are paying for that even though it doesn't feel like it? You pay for listening to BBC radio via your license fee and from commercial stations by listening to the ads they play. One day all music will be a commodity - you turn on your tap water comes out, you pay a bill for water but most people don't think about it when they turn on the tap - music will be the same; its already going that way. On demand radio with personal playlists etc much like the TV is now with it being on demand. I don't honestly see why anyone even would bother to "own" a physical product with music on it in the future, since soon enough we'll be able to get it on demand for a monthly fee. *shrugs* Still I love the feel of my old vinyl and even still have a copy of the Belle Stars "This is the sign of the times" in a shaped picture disk and gatefold sleeve =D

When posting auctions always note that you only ship to the UK & Eire. Don't let anyone tell you to ship it to another address outside of that and if they don't have a shipping address inside UK & E report them as a non paying bidder. I've also seen all sorts with ebay. Paypal stiffed me on one refund by taking too long to investigate - they paid back 6 other people who had submitted AFTER I had before they paid me back and then they only gave me a fiver back - the thing had cost £30. They said there were insufficient funds in the persons paypal account to cover it. Grrr

This is absolutely incorrect. You will note in the copyright notice on DVD's etc that it states "no copying blah blah blah without authorisation from the copyright owner" - Reproducing anything that is copyrighted without the express permission of the copyright holder is breaking the law. The crime is not circumventing the copy-protection though that is also a crime in and of itself. Edit: (I work in copyright protection - no I'm not one of the gits chasing people who download music =P)