I've now managed to get this 'Parking Charge' cancelled. Thank you for all your help guys. Couldn't have persevered this far without your support. Keep the good work going.

Thanks for responding so soon. I have scanned a few pages of it, which I thought were most relevant so i'll post these up. If you feel you need to see more then pls let me know and I will try and post the rest up. Please see attached. Page 9 onwards is them directly responding to my defence and everything before I believe is generic nonsense.

Hi guys. Upon getting ideas from comments I sent off a defence, which was along the theme of: Denying a contract was formed as defendants car had broken down, rendering her unable to accept or reject the contract. I mentioned 'Frustration of contract', explained the mitigating circumstance, that my mother was distressed and panicked as she had to get home to make dinner for her dependent diabetic husband and reading signs was the last thing on her mind as she was trying to find a fix. I explained that breaking down is not a breach of contract, I claimed that the charge is not reflection of loss to Parking Eye and if my mother would have shopped for an hour and 40 minutes, she would have met the £5 threshold for free parking anyway. I pointed out that the car park was virtually empty as well. I claimed that the charges were punitive. Since then, PE have sent us a 66 page document which is a Notice to Proceed. They have stated other cases such as Barry Beavis and Somerfields etc and have indirected contended all the areas I highlighted, such as their right as agents to collect the money, enforceability of charge, the amount proportionality etc. They also sent an aerial view of the car park with references to location of signs and the sizes of them. I went to the store and spoke to the store manager and he claims that there is nothing he can do about it as the issue has gone to court but told me to give PE a call and ask them if they would be willing to scale the charge back to the original £60. He confirmed that Morrisons were the land owners but said that PE have incurred admin fees, hence he cant/wont get involved. Guys can you help me decide what to do? If I do challenge it, what basis should this be on? If I take it all the way to court, and if I lose, is the £175 charge fixed or will it be higher at that stage? Should I call them up and try and get it settled for £60. I think the only evidence I may have is the registration plate on the other vehicle that I arrived in to help my mothers, the timings of exit of both vehicles would corroborate my version of events, but that evidence only they can find on their system. I asked the store manager to check the CCTV on the day and you would see my mother approaching other customers asking them for help and assistance and some even trying to help but he said that CCTV footage is deleted after 28 days. Other than that I have itemised billing, which shows the time of my mothers call to me (soon after she entered the car park) and then subsequent phone calls backwards and forwards, as we updated one another on our progresses, my mothers with the car situation and mine with getting a lift to her. The itemisation proves that the calls stop soon before the vehicle left the car park, as I arrived. Not sure it will be sufficient and from what PE have said, the contract is formed as soon as you enter, regardless. Please can you help

Guys, marvellous suggestions. Some true ingenuity. I have submitted my defence (15 minutes past the deadline ) and I incorporated many things that were suggested. I didnt get much time to actively pursue Morrisons but the rest I included. I guess time will now tell what transpires. SabreSheep I'm sorry I couldnt post a draft here for feedback, I only started drafting it an hour before the deadline as I have been extremely busy with work and other commitments. However, if you would like to see it, I dont mind sending it to you for feedback

Hi, all. I have received a court notice by Nottingham County Court, on behalf of ParkingEye. It is for the amount of £175.00, which comprises of £100 amount claimed, £25 court fee and £50 Solicitors costs. A few months ago my mother entered a Morrisons car park and broke down (car wouldnt start). She called me, distressed, and I went out to her and got the car to start. In the midst of the ordeal, she didnt read the signs and did not obtain a ticket (£1 for 2 hours, refundable upon £5 in store spending) and didnt do any shopping either, as she tended to the car and was trying to obtain help from other shoppers. The total time from entry to exit was 1 hour 39 minutes, so the 2 hour limit was not breached. Although I understand that a ticket should have been obtained, to the value of £1. £100 seems a little excessive and punitive for forgetting to display a ticket, (which in all likelihood would have been negated by shopping anyway) during a circumstance that was out of our control and caused my mother to panic and get distressed. when Parking Eye first sent us a parking charge notice, I wrongly advised my mother to ignore it, as I recalled some time back reading that they could not enforce it. Which has now lead to a court notice. I have sent off the acknowledgement of service and need to respond with a defence by this weekend. I wanted to know if I have a plausible case with prospects of succeeding, or atleast reducing the costs to more proportional or reasonable amounts and if so what should be the basis of my defence? Or whether I should suck it up and pay it off? Also if I contest it, could the charges be increased later on down the line, in court? Also I thought that at county courts each party is responsible for their own legal costs. I would be grateful if some experience or expertise could be dispensed. If I have made any etiquette errors, then please accept my apologies and point them out to me to rectify. Many thanks.

Hi all. My adjudication date was set for next week and I was looking forward to going and presenting my case against the council in person. I was also going to make an application of costs to the adjudicators as I believe and had evidence to suggest that the LEA have continuously acted in an unreasonable and vexatious way. Anyway I have received a letter today from the council informing me that they will not be contesting the appeal and that I do not need to attend the PATAS hearing. A little disappointed that they made me go through so much, over a period of 6 months, to go and cancel it of their own accord a week before adjudication. I wonder how many would have caved before this point and paid off their PCN, whether it was lawful or not. All this could have been avoided if they had just looked at my appeal to them objectively and in light of the evidence presented. No doubt that it what they have done now and assessed their merits of success and awards being made against them and decided to cancel it. Is this effectively the absolute end of the matter or do I have any rights to do/claim anything further? The LEA have still not responded to my Freedom of Information request, which they were obliged to do within 20 days. I think I will start by reporting that to the ICO. Thank you very much to everyone who posted here to help, I dont think I could have persevered for as long without your moral support and guidance.

Hi King (and others), just an update: I spoke to PATAS and they have said that they have not notified the council of a registered case yet because it is 'inconsistent'. I am not the registered keeper of the car and they therefore need an authorisation letter from the registered keeper to say that they give consent to myself to deal with this pcn on their behalf. I am the named driver on the car insurance. They have said that I can contact the LA and explain this to them, but I dont want to contact them if I dont have to. Any comments or advice? I have sent PATAS the authorisation document they have requested today. Once they receive this they said they will notify the LA that an appeal has been registered. I asked PATAS what would have happened if I did not contact them to tell them I have received a Charge Certificate from the council and they said that they would have posted a letter to me in due course anyway to ask me for an authorisation letter. So calling them and finding out has just saved some time (assuming they receive it without any hiccups). So as far as I am concerned I would not have known of any irregularity until the point I received a letter from PATAS in the post and up until that point I would have been under the impression that the council have acted unlawfully, had I not called. I just dont want to contact the council and have to explain anything to them if I dont have to. What would you guys do? Would you bite the bullet and inform the LA just in case they take further action after no payment has been received after 14 days or would you risk and feel that they will stop their processes, or even cancel the charge certificate themselves once they receive notification of an appeal from PATAS (which should be within the 14 days of the CC anyway)? Thanks for any input.

Thank you king for once again a very insightful response. I will forward a copy of the charge certificate alongside my comments to the adjudicators office on Tuesday. I may also ring the LA on Tuesday and ask them what they're playing at. May record the call too. The LA are being way to wayward. I may need to pick your brains regarding application of costs at a later stage. Thanks for all your help. Much appreciated.

Just opened the post and I have a Charge Certificate from the council. They really are hungry SOB's. Their NoR was dated Thursday 17th April and it said I had 28 days to pay the full amount OR appeal to the adjudicator from the date the notice was DELIVERED. I received the NoR on Saturday but could have easily have received it on Monday. Anyway I sent the appeal off to the adjudicator on 14th May and they received it on the 16th, which is within 28 days whichever way you calculate it. Yet on the 23rd they sent me out this charge certificate. It says to make payment within 14 days or they are taking me to court. Not to sure what action to take, if any. Any advice? Are the council being over zealous or should they have been contacted by the adjudicators by now? I dont want to ignore the Charge certificate and then have bailiffs chasing me.

Thanks again King. Any opinions on whether the FoI findings should be included or omitted? The video footage also shows another vehicle indicating to come into the bus lane and then starting the manoever to proceeding to change into the bus lane, so clearly I wasnt the only person inadvertently duped into using the bus lane either. Im considering taking snapshots from the video and adding this as another point of appeal. I will look to see if theres anymore River roads in the area, although I dont think there is, but the current one is very long, maybe 3 miles or so and bends etc. Without having a technical knowledge of how to use co ordinates from the pictures and convert them with google maps to find the point on a map, it would have been very difficult to ascertain the point of alleged contravention. It confused me for several hours as I was trying to figure out which side of the road I got it on as I had also returned via that route that evening.

Thank you king, very insightful and encouraging post. About the repairs to the sign, the council say they didnt do any repairs as its Tfl that are responsible for them and Tfl have also said that they carried out no repairs to the sign. Signs dont repair themselves so I dont know what to make of it and whether submitting the information obtained using the FoI act would support or harm my case if I provided these details to the adjudicator. I intend to send off my form either today or tomorrow. On one hand the council may claim the signs were never faulty (despite my evidence) unless i tampered with them myself or the adjudicator may think I am suggesting the anomaly is some sort of cover up and I may lose credibility.

Thanks for your input King. Is the fact that the enforcement notice didnt contain information on where to send formal representations a point I should also be making? Also the councils delay to provide the video recording for over 6 weeks and after a dozen or so requests? I will see if I can upload the pictures of the sign in a pdf like ive done with the EN and NOR above so you can understand better the situation from the motorists POV.

So I made my formal representations to the council last month. I highlighted: -My disappointment in their rejection-given that they rejected without addressing any of my points -The reason why I had ended up on the bus lane was because of defective signs (which I highlighted in my informal appeal and they rejected them saying that they have checked and have found them to all be valid) and provided the council with evidence of them -Highlighted the signs had been defective for over 2 months -Made a request under the FoI act to provide a figure of the amount of enforcements made on that stretch during the defective signs period -Pointed out that the CCTV footage does not show any signage or road markings -Pointed out the council have breached their procedures by sending Enforcement Notice before the 28 day period was over -Councils failure to provide CCTV footage for over 6 weeks and after over a dozen requests -Provided a secondary explanation of defective signage + adverse weather conditions + unfamiliarity of location all leading to the contravention occurring. I asked the council in a separate request for CCTV footage from a day before the alleged contravention occurred to prove the signs were defective and I was told that they no longer hold the footage as they delete all footage after 31 days. I then asked them for footage of the signage within the last 31 days which would also show the signs to be defective and they told me "The cameras used to enforce River Road are ‘LaneWatch cameras’ which capture contraventions only and not CCTV cameras. As such only the contravention is recorded and not the Bus Lane or the Signage." I then requested details of signage repairs and was told that TFL are responsible for them. TFL said they would get back to me with details within 20 days but they have failed to. Anyway, the council have responded to my formal representations and have rejected them, again without addressing any points I had made, other than that of the FoI. I now have 28 days to either make payment or make an application to an adjudicator. Any help or advice/comments on this? I think someone mentioned to ask for a oral hearing. Can I also request for the camera operative to be present? Should I send photocopies of all communications with the council to the adjudicator? Or should I just keep it very basic and have all the files ready for the actual hearing instead? Also the councils communications are addressed to the vehicle owner, where as im the named driver, will this cause an issue? Should I specify this to the adjudicator or is this of little importance? I have attached the notice of rejection to this post.

Heres the enforcement notice attached in a pdf document. What strikes me about this (I may have it wrong) is that the EN tells me how to pay in great deal and also tells me I can make formal representations, and gives me space to write the formal representations in but nowhere does it state where the formal appeal should be sent or forwarded to. Of course I just sent them recorded to the same address I sent the informal representations to. More of an update in the next post.

There is something wrong with this website. It automatically reduces the size of the images. Maybe an admin can contact me with an explanation. I can't post external links and the website reduces the image size.

Thank you king, some useful information there that I will incorporate. The cctv footage wasnt signed off by anyone im afraid. I just got an email with a link. I have attached the enforcement notice just incase someone can point out any further anomalies of note. Also as king requested, the original PCN. Im so tempted to give the council a tasteful lashing via the formal representation. Thank you King et al for all your help. Im also considering asking the council for details of the sginage repairs under the FIA

Just an update on the situation. Last week the council finally turned the sign the right way round. Me thinks they have been reading this forum. Hi you sponging xenophyophores Needless to say I didn’t pay off the PCN after they rejected my initial appeal. I had to request the contravention video evidence at least a dozen times and they finally provided it last week. The video is a 10 second clip, from a fixed position (no movement in video) and it does not show any signage, it does not show any road markings and all you can see is glare coming from the road surface, reflected off the headlights of all cars as it was raining. If this is the evidence they produced to me, then am I right to assume that this is all they will be allowed to use in front of an adjudicator (should the matter end up there)? I don’t even think there was a live person recording at the time. Secondly an interesting fact, their letter rejecting my initial appeal is dated 6th Feb, which I received on the 10th. In this they gave me 14 days to make the payment at reduced rate and 28 days in total, after which they said an enforcement notice was due. BUT I have received the enforcement notice on the 1st March. Letter is dated 28th Feb. So the enforcement notice was issued 22 days after their rejection letter and not 28 days or I received the enforcement notice 19 days after receiving their rejection letter. Is this lawful and normal? The enforcement notice appears to be on recycled paper with faint washed out ink. Are times really that hard for the council? They have given grounds for appeal and asked to tick which applies, but none of them do. So im planning on ignoring their little box to write my representations and sending them word processed documents. I am going to be writing my formal representations up soon so any points that may help are welcome. Also anyone know if I can get into trouble for insulting the council (verbal lashing without the use of profanities) in my appeal? So tempted. I think I actually want this to go before an adjudicator as crazy as it sounds Furthermore I have requested under the freedom of information act the statistics of pcns issued on that road between the date of my contravention and the date I last saw the sign was swivelled. Anyone know any channels to go down that may force the council to refund all the pcns that have been paid, should it be found that such enforcement is unlawful? Many thanks.

I wouldn't call 180 degrees 'slightly turned'. If the sign was facing towards approaching traffic I would have noticed it. I took the first left after entering River Road and heavy rain and glare off the road surface made it difficult to read any road marks (if indeed there were any). Also the bus lane surface wasnt red (I know it doesnt have to be, im simply pointing it out from the perspective of something else that would have alerted me of the bus lane, failing the signs and the PCN of course lol). I was in the bus lane. Have I been on the road before? Yes many time. Have I ever driven on the bus lane before? No. Did I gain advantage from being in the bus lane? No, there was no traffic. What was different this time? I didnt notice the sign. Hmm...Were you checking a hot blonde busty woman wearing a low cut top? No, the bus lane sign did not reflect back to me because its black matt posterior was welcoming me. The 'offence' is most likelihood would not have taken place if the council were as quick to rectify and maintain the signs. I have also requested the video evidence from their website over 5 times now. I keep getting a message that it "This web site enables you to view still images and video footage of alleged Parking & Traffic contraventions. To view details of your alleged contravention please enter your PCN number and vehicle registration mark and submit a viewing request. Your request for still images and video footage is now being prepared and should be ready for viewing within 24 hours." But it never materialises. Ive done this 3 days in a row now. Not to mention before my informal appeal.

Hi liverbird. I drove past it today and the sign is still swivelled. Enter River Road from the A13 or Movers Lane and its the first sign on approach. I have noticed the sign to be swivelled for at least 8 weeks now. Look forward to hearing your comments tomorrow hopefully. I hope to see the cctv footage soon, hopefully it will be enough to nip this situation in the bud.

[ATTACH=CONFIG]49335[/ATTACH][ATTACH=CONFIG]49336[/ATTACH][ATTACH=CONFIG]49337[/ATTACH] They are automatically reduced in size by the website

Hi Sam, not sure why the website has shrunk the images. My original images that I uploaded were much larger. Ill see if I can upload them again. Street view is outdated and doesnt even show that the bus lane exists (it was in construction lol). But it was on River Road in Barking URL removed due to low post count I didnt know at the time of appeal that the sinage was the culprit so I appealed on other bus lane regulations and compassionate grounds, and they were rejected.

Hello again Sailor Sam. I have attached the pictures to the opening post of this thread as attachments. Would these pictures be good enough?

Thank you Sailor Sam I have again just put in the request to view the video evidence. Hopefully I will get to see it this time round. What im afraid of is that the CCTV video might not pick up the sign and/or the beginning of the bus lane. I dont know how else to provide evidence for it. The sign, 8 weeks on is still swivelled away from approaching traffic. Also I have only a few days left to pay the pcn off at the lower rate. Beyond the 14 days of their rejection to my informal appeal, the council say I lose my right to pay the reduced charge altogether. I want to know if a swivelled sign at the start of the bus lane is enough or a valid reason for the PCN to be cancelled if it ends up before an adjudicator? Thank you for replying

Hi guys, new here so I hope I conform to set posting standards. Any issues, please point them out. Anyway, I got a PCN by the council through the post for "BEING IN A BUS LANE". I think the PCN itself didnt contain any errors which would make it invalid. The photographic pictures show that I did indeed briefly use the bus lane. I was surprised at myself that I would drive in a bus lane without realising it, so at the time I put it down to it being dark and raining heavily, causing glare off the road surface. I appealed the ticket on many grounds, including compassionate, highlighting the set of circumstances which caused the offence to take place as well as many bus regulations which I believed wernt met. I expressed the fact that there was no traffic in either lanes, so no advantage was gained or buses obstructed in the use of the bus lane (which I must have used for a max of approx 50 metres before I turned left). I really didnt think it would get rejected, but the council have said there are no grounds on which it can be cancelled. The next procedure they say is that I can either pay it at half price (£65) within 14 days or pay the full within day 15-28 and if im not happy with their decision and want to make a formal representation to the council I should not pay them at all and wait for an enforcement notice. If they do not accept my formal representations then I can take it to an independent adjudicator, but I lose the right to pay half price after this current point. Anyway, the following is the reason why im posting on here: I have 3 grounds of complaint with the council- 1) There was not enough space on their website to make my informal appeal (I ran out of characters and had to therefore print out the letter and post it recorded the next day. I would have been screwed if I was attempting to submit my appeal on the last day on their website) 2) I requested video evidence from their website, which highlighted that they would email me with a link or something of it within 24 hours. This didnt happen. 3) I realised after I sent my letter of appeal that the bus lane signage was not correctly displayed-which I now believe was most likely the reason why I failed to realise I was in the bus lane to begin with. Basically the camera enforcement sign is there, as is the time plate which states 'at any time' but the main big sign which is supposed to show the restrictions and limitations of the lane to include only buses, motorbikes and taxis is turned 180 degrees to face the oncoming traffic, so would not be seen by the motorists approaching the bus lane. Would this be a valid ground on which to resist making payment? If its not a valid argument that will overturn the ticket then ill just make the payment but I suspect a lot of people have been caught out by this. I have noticed the sign to have been like that for a few weeks now, so believe it must have been this way at the time of enforcement too. I have taken pictures so you can see what I mean. In any case, the signs are right at the start of the bus lane and not 30 metres beforehand, which I recall reading somewhere that they should be. Do I have good grounds to resist or do I not have a chance in hell and should just pay up? Does it matter that I didnt mention this issue in my original appeal? Should I write back to them now or should I ride it out and follow their set procedure? If I do have a case, what should I say/cite? Any drafts would be appreciated. Many thanks guys. You have a great community here, where everyone is pulling together to help the common man against what seem like unscrupulous capitalist councils.