QUOTE All that is now required under the 'preliminary stage' is for the debtor to WRITE (or better still to email ) the enforcement company a 'Third Party Claim' (or claim to exempt goods etc). This procedure is comonplace for debts enforced by High Court Enforcement Officers and on a personal level, I have assisted with hundreds of these over the years and so far....not a single one has been rejected. In most cases the response to 'release the levy' with be made within just a day or so. Tomtubby, is there a standard format for this? John in the case over on pepipoo has provided sale receipt/copy of logbook etc to Marstons and STILL doesn't have his car back.

Thanks, tt. If you're using a different email now I think you could just set up a new account/username? df

tt, over on pepipoo - guy reporting that his car has been removed by bailiff for someone else's debt. son has blue badge which was displayed at the time. http://forums.pepipoo.com/index.php?showtopic=91091&st=0&gopid=970659entry970659 i know you're always busy, but wonder if you could look in on the thread. df

The request/response can be seen here: https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/bailiff#incoming-507274

wonkeydonkey - you'd think, huh? Don't forget that soon physical tax discs will be a thing of the past, so no help there. My friend's story: Blue Badge - check. Disabled tax disc - check. Showed TEC acknowledgement of OOT filing - check. Informed had cancer - check. Informed only form of income was benefits - check. Still clamped and threatened with tow truck if full payment not made. Bailiff actually REFUSED invite to enter house and do levy. Council - "not our problem - talk to the bailiff company". Complaint being prepared for LGO. Somehow I find it wishful thinking that on 6th April the bailiffs will magically understand what they can and can't do unless the people being visited KNOW their rights - and of course, the vast majority don't or are too intimidated (understandably) to stand up for themselves.

Thanks, tomtubby. but, sigh, yet another example of disjointed thinking - the blue badge guide published by the governmint, bless them, specifically says It must only be displayed if you are travelling in the vehicle as a driver or passenger, or if someone is collecting you or dropping you off and needs to park at the place where you are being collected or dropped. and I'm pretty sure I've seen advice to the effect of don't leave the badge on display when you're not using it because someone might nick it. And, it may be coming in to the regs, but both blue badge and disabled tax disc didn't stop a rossendales bailiff clamping a car and threatening to remove it a few months ago. I would suggest people print out the relevant bits of the regs and have to hand to quote to bailiff.

Tomtubby - do you have a link to this, please - the specific Blue Badge part? thanks df

Olaf - this is definitely a PRIVATE company ticket, not a council one? And, as others have said, a bailiff who seized a Motability vehicle is a very silly one.

What about a well-crafted tweet to Swindon Council? Not necessarily from OP. Nothing like as serious as this, but noticed today that in 2 matters, once questions asked on Twitter and thus public, my local council extracted its previously well-hidden digit.....

Question about the new complaints procedure - if you make a complaint April onwards, will it automatically be handled as per new rules, even if the event you are complaining about happened under the OLD rules? Ta.

Kenny, have a read of the TEC User Guide, one of the attachments in the answer here https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/out_of_time_witness_statements_c It specifically states that TEC can NOT register debts in Scotland and outlines the process the council should go through to do so. But Harrow, as we all know, have scant regard for the law. Although, one does wonder what TEC were doing registering the debt in the first place!

Lisa, fees regarding PCNs attached. HOWEVER - you do realise that while some PCNs are attached to the car, others are only served by post? You said " The council weren't interested and passed us from pillar to post" - exactly how? A PCN served by post, I believe also acts as an NTO, but after that comes the Charge Certificate BEFORE bailiffs get involved. What documentation did you receive, when and what did you do with it/text of replies?

Formal Complaint to CEO of council by email first thing tomorrow morning. If you can supply written evidence of your child's disability, so much the better. One thing to check - is the address on the car's V5 (logbook) correct/have you moved recently? All correspondence from council will be sent to address on V5.

tt, oh yes - he introduced himself as council litigation officer. About the only thing that was done correctly was that when he went back to the council he told the parking dept that judge had allowed application and then council told bailiff to refund the money. df

tt, we won. Court was running really late so ended up talking to the criminal solicitor sent by the council. Council had only given him their papers (which we never got a copy of in advance) that morning which said "oops - it appears that TEC may not have acted on our request to reissue warrant". I pointed out to him that council had been informed of that two months previously. Credit to the guy, he, without saying as much, did not seem impressed with council. Judge took about 3 minutes to grant application, telling council not to just tick boxes. Bailiffs refunded all monies about a week later. Council still refusing to respond to official complaint. They immediately reissued NTO, which we appealed - have yet to hear anything back. Have a feeling that a letter will arrive on Day 56.

Paul do NOT fill in a Form 4 - read tomtubby's posts on people who have ended up having to pay thousands to the bailiffs for their costs. df

Looney, Harrow are known for being "unhelpful", shall we say. Is your address correct (with post code) on V5? Have you asked Harrow for copy of PCN? And, have you/your neighbours ever complained to Royal Mail about post not being delivered? If you have proof of complaints to Royal Mail (ideally not just you but neighbours as well), that will help a tiny bit. Also check out pepipoo site forums and have a read through various threads there concerning Harrow and their PCNs.

kenny, yes that's the place - you want to use 0300 123 1059/ 01604 619450 or the email [email protected]. gov.uk They won't be able to access any records without the PCN number though, so make sure you have that to hand. And I am seriously impressed by your fightback against Harrow. Kudos to you.

Can you get something in writing from Royal Mail confirming the problems with the post and the length of time they have been going on for? That would count for more than just you saying there were problems. Have neighbours had similar problems? fyi - TEC "secret rules" for assessing whether or not to grant an OOT below. Unfortunately, as Tomtubby said, 9 times out of 10 they just do what the council want them to do. Purpose – to grant / refuse permission for the respondent to file their stat dec / witness statement late. You are not looking for anything else e.g. whether the penalty charge is valid etc. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Begin by reading the respondent’s reason on the OOT for not responding within the time limit. Tip: If they do not answer the question (they refer to the original contravention only or write about payments made etc), refuse the application. Tip: If the respondent has provided a valid reason why they could not make the deadline and were unable to apply for a time extension and they provide proof (holiday tickets / hospital letter etc), grant the application. If the respondent has provided a valid reason why they could not make the deadline and were unable to apply for a time extension, but you are still unsure of their reasons (no proof enclosed), read the statement provided by the LA to make the decision. Tip: If the LA do not send a full statement but simply advise they reject the application, automatically grant the application. If the respondent states that they moved addresses, check the system details for the date of the move …. Tip: If the respondent has stated in their OOT that they have moved address before the notice to owner (NTO) was served or provided dates of when they moved so we can see the NTO was not served, the COO should be accepted. If the LA state in their rejection that they obtained the address from the DVLA but the respondent moved before NTO, the COO would still be accepted. If they have only stated that they moved address and have provided no details, the COO would be refused. If the respondent admits that they did not notify the DVLA of their address change, the COO would be refused.

And isn't there a Data Protection issue over seizing things like laptops?

tomtubby - VAT receipt, eh? never got one of those and yet was charged it........ all the more ammunition for the LGO. If possible, would very much appreciate a copy of the Briefing Papers. Thanks df

It might be this one: http://www.lgo.org.uk/decisions/benefits-and-tax/council-tax/slough-borough-council-10-007-469 LGO said "A bailiff may make an arrangement with a debtor without having levied on anything" - although the main thrust of this case was the bailiff charging £230 for levying on a doormat!

for PCNs see below Appendix - The Enforcement of Road Traffic Debts (Certificated Bailiffs) Regulations 1993 SI 2072 (as amended) SCHEDULE 1 TABLE OF FEES CHARGES AND EXPENSES (excluding Value Added Tax) 1 For preparing and sending a letter advising the debtor that a warrant is with the bailiff and requesting the total sum due £11.20 Note: The fee under paragraph 1 can only be recovered if the letter is sent before a first visit is made to the debtor’s premises. 2 For levying distress— (i)Where the sum demanded and due does not exceed £100 £28.00 (ii)Where the sum demanded and exceeds £100 28% on the first £200; due 5.5% on any additional sum over £200 3 For attending to levy distress but where the levy is not made, the reasonable costs and charges for attending to levy. The costs and charges are not to exceed the fees and charges which would have been due under paragraph 2 above if the distress had been levied. The costs and charges are subject to detailed assessment under rule 11. Note: The aggregate costs and charges payable under paragraphs 2 and 3 are not to exceed the costs and charges allowed for three attendances to levy distress. 4 For taking possession— (i)Where a person is left in physical possession (close possession) £5.60 each day (ii)Where walking possession is agreed 55p each day for the first 14 days; 5p each day thereafter. Notes: The charge for walking possession is payable only if a walking possession agreement has been made using Form 8. A person left in physical possession (close possession) must provide his or her own board in every case. The possession fee is payable in respect of the day on which distress is levied, but a fee for physical possession must not be charged where a walking possession agreement is signed at the time when distress is levied. 5 For appraising (valuing) goods, the reasonable fees, charges, and expenses of the broker. The fees, charges and expenses are subject to detailed assessment under rule 11. Note: An appraisal (valuation) shall take place only on the written request of the debtor. 6 For removing goods, or attending to remove goods where no goods are removed, reasonable costs and charges. The costs and charges are subject to detailed assessment under rule 11. 7 For sale— (i)Where the sale is held on the auctioneer’s premises, 15% of the sum realised to cover the auctioneer’s commission and out-of-pocket expenses, plus the reasonable cost of advertising, removal and storage. (ii)Where the sale is held on the debtor’s premises, 7½% of the sum realised for the auctioneer’s commission, plus out-of-pocket expenses actually and reasonably incurred. The fees, expenses, charges and costs to be subject to detailed assessment under rule 11. 8 Where distress is withdrawn or where no sale takes place, reasonable fees, charges and expenses, subject to detailed assessment under rule 11. 9 For the purpose of calculating any percentage charges, the fraction of £1 is to be reckoned as £1. Any fraction of a penny is to be disregarded. 10 In addition to any amount authorised by this Table, the amount of value added tax payable may be passed on to the debtor by adding an equivalent amount to the sum due.

Ian, complaint is in with council. What I would like to find, as with hallowitch, is some reference, ideally from a judge, that sets out what is and isn't allowed. Councils, as is beginning to become very apparent, all too often say and do just what their bailiffs tell them to.

I'd like an answer to that one - but in relation to road traffic debt bailiff enforcement.