If your site is a member of the BH & HPA then if there are a good number of owners who are not happy you all need to get together and contact their trade body. Make it clear that you are all afraid of reprisals and ask them to investigate. If you know of any other owners on other sites then try and get them involved as well and make sure anyone who is having the same problem contacts Trading Standards. Sooner or later the penny will drop and they'll do something. As soon as I get back home I will again be pushing this trade body for some answers and doing some more digging around to find out how else I can get this situation publicised. The owners of the site I was awarded a refund from are still ripping people off, still issuing a contract with an unfair term on it and the BH & HPA seem to be condoning the practice, even encouraging it.

Hi Valleywalker I followed the site instructions and raised a complaint with the BH & HPA and by doing this, although a bit long winded, and contacting Trading Standards this will show that you have made every effort to resolve the situation. I sold my static and the new buyer paid site fees for the period I had already paid for so the site had 2 fees for 1 pitch. I quoted the OFT guidance to unfair terms in holiday caravan agreements 2005 section 2 ( I think) paragraph 4.33 but judgement was given on the Unfair Terms in Consumer Contracts Regulations 1999 section 5 (1). If you have a look at that particular section via the OFT website, that particular paragraph is pretty damning for these greedy sites. The amount I wanted refunded was around £1200 which is below the £5000 threshold for small claims. However, although it may take a little longer, I would suggest that you try and actually go to court rather than do this online. It is not always easy to put into writing exactly what needs to be looked at, and facing a judge can help enormously. If the claim is made online the judge is not there to clarify any statement made and I found that the judge asked questions to clarify what was said. This culminated in him saying directly to the site owner within the first 10 mins of the hearing 'Don't you think that's a little unfair?' The site owner did try to waffle stating that I signed a contract to agree to forfeiting site fees, but the judge disagreed with that and ruled that this was an unfair term. Since my own case, there has been a further case against the same site and again the judgement was against the site. There is absolutely nothing to fear from going to court. In fact I would recommend it just to see the reaction of the site owner when they lose. The site stated in court that they had changed the contract, trouble was they didn't tell the owners so at the moment I am in very lengthy discussion with the BH & HPA relating to the contract itself and the extortionate commission charged when selling. My contact stated everywhere that the BUYER pays commission. However, when I followed the instructions on the contract and duly informed the site I wanted to sell, I was presented with a letter of appointment which changed the commission payment from BUYER to SELLER but owners were never told. I'm still waiting for the results of the investigations, that's if there ever has been any investigation, but I will keep pestering until I get a result preferably in my favour. It cost me over £3000 for this commission and I want most of that back. 15% is way above any estate agent fee and they did little or nothing for that. I'll pay a commission but at a reasonable rate not an extortionate rate and the OFT guidance clearly states it is open to challenge. How dare these money grabbing sites rip people off and get away with it. We need loads more people who have been and are being ripped off to make as many waves as possible then just maybe this industry and its trade associations will clean up their acts. There's plenty of profit to be made without ripping people off. Many of the owners affected have been forced to sell through no fault of their own in these hard financial times and these along with pensioners are the main target of these site owner sharks. They are easy prey who have little choice and these sharks are taking advantage of it. It needs to be stopped and soon.

Have a look through the whole post as the information I think is all on there. The cost for my case was around £230.00 which has to be paid up front and is refunded when the case is sorted although there are some circumstances where you can get the fees reduced but you would need to talk to your local County Court. The Unfair Terms of Consumer Contract regulations is the main act used. I am not at home at the moment but I will reply more fully over the weekend.

Holiday parks are not above and beyond the law. I took one to court last year to get a refund on pre-paid site fees and won and since found out that there have been at least 3 other cases against this same site so there must be a fair few other sites who have been sued and lost. Yes they are ruthless and yes they do think they are a law unto themselves but there are consumer and contract laws which can be and are applied to these vultures. Taking these vultures to court requires a lot of homework and a very very good knowledge of the OFT regs relating to agreements for holiday caravans, it is extremely useful. A good knowledge of contract law is also very useful and both of these guides can be downloaded from the OFT website and it is well worth doing. Even when you have signed their mostly biased terms and conditions all is not lost. It is when these vultures enforce these terms that the OFT guides really come into effect. These were the guides I used to get my refund, plus court costs, plus bailiff fees when they didn't pay up on time so regardless of what the salesman tells you if there's an unfair term in the agreement, and most of them have at least 1, it can be challenged. The 15% commission, according to the OFT can also be challenged. Outright extortion, just greedy site owners licence to grab more money for doing absolutely nothing.

Ooooh these caravan sites and their unfair trading. I had big problems with a caravan site when selling my 'van so I downloaded a copy of the OFT Guidance on Unfair Terms in Holiday Caravan Agreements, OFT 734 I think it is. If you have a look in there I'm sure it says somewhere that they can only charge disconnection fees at a reasonable rate, but that could mean anything. However, I'm pretty sure that if you sell your 'van off site then unless there is a substantial reason why the unit can't be accessed, I think you may have every right to challenge what they are charging and move it yourself i.e. by your own contractor, but you will have to have a look at the regulations to confirm that. If you do have to pay, which in some respects may be the best thing to do to save any problems in getting access to your 'van, keep a record of everything, get them to put everything in writing especially a breakdown of their charges. Then firstly once you have accessed your 'van, write and complain to the site. You know as well as anybody else who has had dealings with a site that the reply will be that they are right and you are wrong so the next step is to take them to court on the Small Claims track and get some of your money back. I got my pre-paid site fees back when I sold a 'van despite the site and the trade associations telling me that I had agreed to the terms and conditions. I proved unfair terms. Get quotes yourself if you can for disconnection and moving so that you can prove they are being unreasonable. Not too sure if any of this helps but it may be worth a go anyway. These sites do trade very unfairly and unfortunately because owners are mostly too wary about challenging them, they are getting away with charging what they like. Don't bother going to their trade associations, they just act for their members and seem to not only condone the overcharging but actively encourage it. There doesn't seem any way of being able to complain about these trade associations either when they are obviously not enforcing OFT regulations. The more people who make complaints to the OFT/Trading Standards about the unfair trading of caravan sites the better perhaps then we as consumers will be able to exercise our rights without any fear of reprisals.

Success Success Success The bailiffs went in and collected. Brilliant. 1 very upset greedy site owner played at their own game and beaten. Now all I have to sort out is whether I can challenge who pays the commission charges. It will take time but I'll get there Special thanks to Martin, you've been a great help and yes I have contacted Trading Standards. Strangely enough they sounded quite interested, can't imagine why.

Can anyone help with holiday caravan site agreements/ contracts queries please? I had a holiday caravan and signed an agreement with the site. The agreement very clearly says all through it that when the caravan is sold the commission of a massive 15% is to be paid by the buyer (new owner) However, when an owner goes to the site office as directed by this same agreement, tells the office the caravan is to be sold and just asks if the site office would kindly add it to their list of units for sale, the owner is then presented with a letter of appointment. This is to appoint the site as agent and owners are under the impression that this is what needs to be done. The letter of appointment then states that it is the seller who will be billed for the commission. Until that point there had never been any mention of any change to the original agreement. If an owner wants to sell the last thing they want to do is to argue with the site office about this change as there is always the fear of reprisals, difficulties in selling or even blocking of a sale. It has been known to go on although never openly admitted. Strangely, when an owner sells a caravan and doesn't appoint the site as agent they(the seller) are still charged the commission even though they have never signed anything to agree to any change and never signed a letter of appointment. Breach of contract?? I would really like to know whether it is legal to fundamentally change a contract without giving notice either verbally or in writing? What are the rulings on having one rule for one owner and one for another? Is this allowed? If the letter of appointment is signed can it be classed as signed under duress? Can or does the original agreement/contract over rule this letter of appointment bearing in mind that the changed terms on the letter were never communicated in any way to an owner? Complicated but desperately need some help on this one

Martin you are a gem, thank you but I have already issued a Warrant with the County Court so is there any way I can get this changed to High Court please? I don't care what the cost is as I know this will be refunded and these sites really must realise they are not above the law whatever they think. I reported all the issues to Consumer Direct who have said they will pass on the information to Trading Standards. However, they said there was no way they could help with getting the judgement enforced and getting my money back but I will call them again and see if I can get Trading Standards number, it isn't published on the website there's only a business contact number on there but I'll keep plugging at that one. As far as the other part of the contract is concerned, I'll do a separate thread for that. It looks like it could be contract law and a bit complex so any feedback or pointers as to how to find out whether there could be a good case or not would be a help. I'm not afraid of taking this lot to court again but I will have to be very sure of my ground on this subject, I was on the first one, pretty straightforward, but this is a little different. Really very grateful for your help

Latest update on caravan sites. Case number 1AS00899 Canterbury County Court Judge Ashley 22nd September 2011 Mrs. Lynn Cluer v Two Chimneys Ltd Caravan Site, Shottendane Road, Birchington, Kent CT7 0HD Although I got the judgement, guess what - they haven't paid up. What a surprise. Never mind, I've requested a Warrant for Execution through the Court. More cost but let the bailiffs handle that bit now. I've also contacted the trade associations NCC and BH & HPA telling them about this case and having a go at them for condoning these sites. Also asking them to clarify why contracts can be suddenly changed without telling anybody. I really don't know what they are employing in these places, they don't seem to have any grasp of facts half the time. Martin, help please if you can. Is there any way this case can be publicised so that this caravan site and the trade associations can be shown The trade associations seem to think that reading only half the OFT guidance and picking out the bits they want to use is all they need to do and don't think anyone should have the ordacity to challenge these terms. Desperately need some input. TV, radio, newspaper anything. I want my money back and I want to see these sites stopped in their tracks right now. HELP pretty please

Anybody got any information about changing of agreements or contracts please? The agreement with this site states clearly who is to pay commission on sales which has apparently been changed but no notification has been given. Any ideas anybody?

Added to previous posts, there is nothing to stop anyone using my case as an example. The legal bods out there will know how to get all the information so lets hope that more and more caravan owners will go down the same route. I have contacted Consumer Direct, told them what happened, as it was they amongst others who told me to do a small claim. I queried other terms in this contract, they were very interested and are passing the information on to Kent Trading Standards to investigate whether there may be other terms in these contracts that are unfair and misleading. The site I claimed against had already had a claim against them in April 2007 at Margate which they lost. They had to declare that in court. There have got to be more of them and if I can find out about more cases then it leaves a wide open route to bring a super complaint to get this stopped once and for all. I am also going to contact the OFT as there are some quite blatant abuses of their Guidance published in 2005 so if anybody can add weight to these complaints, any other known cases please let me know. I have no hesitation in taking something like this on to help stop these rip offs. Any information would be very gratefully received and will just add fuel to the fire. Come on people. I know owners feel intimidated by site owners and there is a fear of reprisal but this again MUST be stopped. The more owners who are prepared to even just give over information would be a tremendous help. This whole industry is long overdue for review. If anyone wants any help let me know, I'd be only too pleased to stitch up another money grabbing site owner.

What details would you like? I haven't received the paperwork from the court yet as the case was only sorted on Thursday but in short I sold a holiday caravan in July 2010. The agreement has a term that states a sliding scale but no refund after the end of June in any year but the buyer then paid the site fees from July to December 2010 that I had already paid. I quoted the OFT guidance to unfair terms in holiday caravan agreements 2005 section 2 ( I think) paragraph 4.33 and also Unfair Terms in Consumer Contracts Regulations 1999 section 5 (1). The case was heard at Canterbury County Court on 22nd September 2011 judgement given in my favour with a refund of fees from 1st August 2010 to 31st December 2010 as the licence stated 'Annual Site Fees'. When the judge heard that the buyer had paid site fees from mid July to December 2010, one I had already paid, he asked the site owner 'don't you think that's a little unfair'. The site owner's face was a picture. Worth doing it just for that. As soon as I have all the paperwork from the court I can post all the details on here so that everybody can use it to get their fees back, even those who have already sold and lost out. I understand that claims can be made as long as it is within the last 6 years. It's about time these sites were stopped from ripping people off.

I claimed my pre-paid pitch fee back and got it. What's more the judgement against the site stated that the term in the contract for the sliding scale of fee refunds was an unfair term under the Unfair Terms of Consumer Contracts Act 1999. Any site now using this model contract or variations of it with that term in it will have to think again about how to rip people off. That loophole has now been closed. And I was awarded all my court fees. Really enjoyed seeing the expression on the site owners face when the Judge asked if the site owner considered it unfair not to make a refund when the site had already received site fees from the buyer for the period already paid by the seller. Brilliant. Result!!

Message to all holiday caravan and lodge owners past and present check your contracts If your site is using the model contract as produced by the BH & HPA and the NCC then there is a proved by judgement unfair term relating to selling your caravan or lodge. The term stating that refunds are given on a sliding scale for pre-paid site fees has been judged unfair by a Judge in the County Court. If you sell your caravan or lodge and your buyer takes immediate possession they will therefore be paying site/pitch fees for the remainder of the year or season depending whether your contract differentiates between the two. AS PER THE JUDGEMENT ON 22nd SEPTEMBER 2011 YOU ARE ENTITLED TO A FULL REFUND OF YOUR PRE-PAID SITE/PITCH FEE FROM THE DATE OF COMPLETION OF THE SALE TO THE END OF THE LICENCE PERIOD FOR WHICH THE PRE-PAYMENT WAS MADE. If you have already sold your unit and if your agreement had the sliding scale for refund on it, that was an unfair term and can be challenged. If you have lost money through forfeiting any pre-paid fees, claim it back. I challenged it and the Judge agreed it was an unfair term under the Unfair Terms of Consumer Contracts Regulations 1999 and I was awarded all the pre-paid site fees from the time of sale to the end of the licence period. Result!!!!!! I bet when caravan site owners see this they'll want the post removed double quick so they can carry on ripping people off!!!

lolball Have you had any luck with any contacts or any help or info on this subject of rip off caravan sites? I have been trying for ages to get more info but it seems that everybody just clams up. I would be more than willing to swap any info I have re trying to get a fair deal, money back etc. If it is OK to give you a call I am more than willing to do that, I have the numbers off the post.

I have had the same problem in dealing with a caravan site when selling a holiday home. I am at the moment trying to claim back site fees paid in advance and not refunded but I have been looking for any information on previous cases as this would help enormously, not only for me but for everybody else who has had, is having and will definitely have in the future, problems with getting justified refunds whatever the terms and conditions of these sites state. The standard contract used by caravan sites has numerous unfair terms under the Unfair Terms of Consumer Contracts Regulations 1999 so there must be someone, somewhere who has taken action against such unfair practices. These sites continually quote terms and conditions which are signed when buying a caravan. What they seem to forget is that in a good many cases these terms and conditions are not made available until a unit is paid for and a good many of the important terms such as the refunds policies are certainly not brought to the attention of a buyer. Really would appreciate some help on this to at least try and prevent any more caravan owners being ripped off by these sites. They charge 15% commission on any sale and all sales transactions have to go via the site office. Then they have a very unfair sliding scale of refunding site fees paid in advance which in most cases means that sellers receive no refund at all. The new occupant then pays a pro-rata site fee when the unit is sold during the season therefore the site is actually charging twice for the same pitch. The seller is still then paying for a service they cannot use i.e. pitch fee, as they no longer own the unit on that pitch. Grossly unfair and really needs to be stopped.

Hello and thank you so much for your reply It is an independent site and like you I am determined to get my cash back. I earned it and I want it back. Have you used and/or quoted any reference to the OFT regs? And have you used any consumer laws? I will pay for a solicitor as long as I am pretty sure I will get my money back but like most other owners in the same position we are not made of money. There are other owners on the same site who have had the same problem but in the main are intimidated by the owners and this should not be happening or allowed and anything we can do to clean up the industry can only help so thanks for your input and please keep in touch and let me know how you get on

Just read through all the posts on this thread. I have posted a thread on a consumer forum about a site that will not refund my site fee after I sold the static. They charged the new owner pro rata fees so they are in effect receiving 2 payments for 1 pitch. I know this happens a lot, the agreements are mostly in breech of the OFT regulations as the retention of the advance payment is considered a penalty. I would like to know if anyone has ever taken these sites on. They are a law unto themselves and, in my case, try to intimidate owners/consumers into just accepting what they want. If more people come forward then we have more chance of getting refunds and not being penalised. Please, please, please if you have been affected by not having a refund of pitch fees after you have sold your unit, post on here. If you have taken a site to court to get a refund please please let me know. The more people speak out the quicker the problem will be solved. Just because you sign an agreement does not mean that it is compliant with rules and regs neither does it give the site the right to penalise the consumer when they themselves are profiteering

Briefly I bought a holiday home static caravan last November, paid the pro-rata site fees to end of December and paid 2010 site fees before the end of December 2009 as requested by the site owner. Sold the unit in early July, but had to sell through the site (their conditions) and pay them 15 percent of the sale price for doing absolutely nothing. The new buyer confirmed with the site office that I wold get a refund of the advance payment of site fees to end of December 2010 as the new owner had paid pro rata fees from early July to end of December. That is 2 fees for 1 pitch. The sale proceeds were paid to the site who then forwarded the cheque to me 2 weeks after the sale but no refund for the site fees. The site said I had signed an agreement to say that the site fees would not be refunded if the unit was sold after the end of June. I know this is an unfair term of contract or agreement but has anybody else had the same problem. I would love to hear from anyone else who has taken a site to the Small Claims Court to get their refund. I have already written to the BH & HPA giving them details of this grossly unfair practice and I know there are other holiday home owners who have taken sites to court so I would love to hear from you to see how you went about things and what the outcome was. The OFT regs are pretty clear so I really want to know if they can be enforced against these rip off merchants. Thanks to anyone who can help