Good idea, thanks.

Thanks Papasmurf, I'm so glad I found this forum, there is no way I would have done any of this without these very helpful people - I can't spread enough reputation to show how appreciative I am!

Thanks Rhia, I'll read through those. I did do the CCCS budget sheet online and worked out through that how much was still available, but decided to carry on alone from there instead of asking CCCS to sort it out - will this count against me? Also I have now changed the figures slightly, as I'm offering Sainsburys Bank a much lower amount, added an extra £100 into our budget to cover various things like car repairs,services, dentist, vet etc., hence having less available to divide between my creditors, although this won't affect any company other than Sainsburys. Will this be frowned on at some point if I have to show these figures to someone or in court or something? After all, the figures I am now using weren't actually agreed with CCCS. Sorry, feel I'm asking stupid questions but don't want to do anything wrong which could land us in more trouble at a later date.

Thanks for your replies, Rhia and BD. I'm happy to just keep sending "nice" letters with payments once a month. I'm reluctant to send an I&E as I'm sure they'll just pick it apart despite the fact that it was OK'ed by CCCS. And I am sure it will make no difference, I'm guessing they're just sending out form letters. Rhia, can you tell me in what way they are in breach of the OFTs debt collection guidance and the banking/lending codes? I'll google the fos guidelines and write to the M&S boss. BD, when you say CCA the really awkward ones, do you mean the ones who won't accept the lower payment? i.e. Santander loans and HFC. The HFC one was taken out a year ago and the Santander loan is about 3 years old I think. There are no charges on either yet, so nothing to reclaim. The only charges on any of these will be occurring about now or any day now! For the Santander loan company, who have stated they won't accept my lower payment, should I keep sending that payment or should I offer a different amount, slightly higher? Thanks again!

I'd be very grateful for some more help. I've got a pile of letters that have built up this week. First of all, I have letters from MBNA and Santander Cards but they were clearly sent out before my last letters was received so I will continue to send payments with nice letters, thanking them for accepting our proposals as recommended above to MBNA - will that be ok, do you think? Santander Loans have sent a letter thanking for recent communication but without stating the date of my letter they are replying to! I have attached a copy. They say they'll not accept my proposal. What do I do now~? Offer more or continue to pay the same payment? They have been banking my cheques. They also sent a standard letter informing of missed payment and recommending we contact national Debt Line or CCCS!!! Hypocrits!! (sp?) Then I have 2 letters from the HFC bank, one is an arrears notice. The other is in reply to our letter (again not including the date of our letter), and ignoring it basically! ie. again requesting financial statement, I&E and payslips. What to do now? Then I have lots of letters from M&S Money! One is just standard "you failed to make a payment, we've charged you £12 ...". One is a statutory arrears notice, "as 2 of your payments for your M&S card have been missed". Another is informing us that our account is overdue by £7.06 (!!! very small amount, I think!) and requesting payment. Another is re. our letter dated 5th August, I've attached a copy. I'll be sending out payments with letters at the end of the month to all our creditors. Thank you for your help! santander loan 270810.PDF MBNA 270810.PDF M&S 270810.PDF santander cards 270810.PDF

That's fine BD. I didn't misunderstand your reply but just wanted to be sure I was posting in the right place.

Despite all our letters stating we wish to correspond in writing and do not wish to give further details re. our I&E, all these companies seem to do is write back, saying "Ring us urgently re. this matter"!!! M&S are one of the companies doing this - I addressed my last letter to head of Customer Services but got the same reply. As advised before here, I will send a letter to the Chief Executive's Office with copies of all my letters, stating basically the same. Santander Cards are the same - but their letter crossed in the post with ours addressed to the Chief Executive's Office, so I'll wait for further correspondence from them. Today in the post there were 3 (!) letters from M&S too, one is saying our account is overdue by £7.06 (!!!! - for this they have charged us £12 charges twice!) and they look forward to a payment by return and have reduced our credit limit~! Another is a statutory arrears notice to say 2 of our payments have been missed or were late (same shortfall of £7.06!!). And the third is a statement! What a waste of time, paper and money!! Also in today's post a letter from MBNA in reply to our earlier letter (not the one I have sent this morning as discussed in my previous post, obviously!), again just repeating that they need our income, expenditures, names of other creditors and balances owed with each and to call them! I guess these are all computer generated letters. Should I reply to MBNA with a letter saying no to all the things they requested addressed to the Chief Executive's Office, as was mentioned above? Any advice how I can get through to them that I am not going to ring them and not going to provide I&E? If I have to, I'll keep sending out basically the same letters in reply each time, plus a cheque to them for the lower payment every month!

Have drafted up those letters and will discuss with OH later. Can't tell you how satisfying it was!!!

Thanks BD, makes sense to me. We'll get some letters put together. Rhia, thanks also for your advice. I'm really grateful to you for taking the time to read my messages and help me. By the way, am I posting in the right place or should I be starting a new thread? I've been posting here so that you can see the background as well.

Ah, BD, you are a star! Thanks for the reply. I worked out the payments to be made to our creditors on a pro-rata basis as suggested by CCCS, and the payment of £144 was for the company I owe most to. Do you not agree with a pro-rata payment, or do you just think I should lower the amount I have available to pay them in order to pay for these one off problems like new tyres, vet bills and also to give myself a chance to save more? How are the companies going to react if I change the amount I pay them now though? I'll sit down with my OH tonight and put together a letter to the Indian company and to MBNA. Another payment isn't due til 1st September if I'm making monthly payments, but that is only just over a week away anyway. One more question (for now! ): Should I make all payments by cheque? The reason I ask is I opened a new bank account without cheques from the Co-op (as suggested earlier, as I have large overdraft with my other current account) so if I send a cheque it has to come from my old current account which is overdrawn. Not a huge problem as I just transfer money across from the Co-op account to the other one, but I could be making direct bank transfers online from the Co-op account in payment to my creditors. I realise that means I don't get to send a letter to them though, that I can show if necessary in future.

Thanks guys! I'm very grateful for your help. Will wait to hear from you tomorrow, BD.

Can I ask for some more advice? Re. our debt on a MBNA credit card, we have now received the following letter from Aegis Limited, who are it seems a debt collection company. We have also received at least one call a day from them, but I am refusing to discuss the matter on the phone with them, telling them we have written to MBNA and to put anything they have to say in writing. We have only written to MBNA twice, telling them we can't pay, requesting they freeze charges and interest and offering them a lower monthly payment. They replied to the first letter saying they need to see our income and expenditures and names and amounts re. other creditors. They cashed our lower payment cheque, despite our request that they only cash it if they accept our terms to freeze charges and interest!! As have all other creditors bar one done too! We wrote back and told them we have verified our figures with CCCS and it was therefore unnecessarily intrusive to demand more detailed information. Following that we have now received a letter from Aegis ... copy attached. Not sure how to handle this. Do I correspond with MBNA or Aegis or both? Can they even do that? Thank you very much in advance. I feel like we're getting nowhere, the situation doesn't seem to improve, I'm trying hard to save the money we're not spending on mortgage, but my husband's car needed its MOT, my car needed a new tyre, soon needs another and my husband's needs two tyres! On top of that my dog is ill and the vet is costing me a fortune! I'm feeling so stressed and back to not sleeping, I wish these companies would just accept the lower payments for now and let us get on with it! aegis letter mbna 1.PDF

Thanks Rhia. That's a great idea. I had presumed they weren't computer generated letters, as they knew of my letter and request, but yes they seem unable to act on it.

We received this letter from the HFC. I'll send a letter, similar to the others, reiterating that is all I can afford on a pro rata basis, and that I won't be sending I&E as unnecessary intrusion .... etc. Should I be continuing to pay these companies the lower payment I offered even though they haven't accepted my terms yet, or should I pay nothing until an agreement has been reached? Thank you!! HFC5810.PDF

Here's the next letter we've received, from Sainsburys loan people. This is my letter they were replying to: " I wrote to you on 5th July 2010, requesting that you freeze interest and other charges on my account and offering a monthly payment of £144.45. The letter stipulated “For the avoidance of doubt the enclosed cheque no. 102146 should only be banked if you are accepting my proposal and in all other circumstances it should be returned to me without being banked”. You have taken the payment. Please confirm in writing that you have accepted my proposals.My other creditors have accepted my realistic offer. I am making a genuine attempt to sort this out and I am sure you are aware that there would be little point in offering an amount I cannot maintain.I feel your demands for more detailed personal information are unnecessarily intrusive when I have already verified the figures with CCCS.As stated in my letter dated 5th July 2010 (copy enclosed), the amount I have to make repayments to my creditors is £321. On a pro-rata basis, I am therefore able to pay you a regular amount of £144.45 per month on the condition that you agree to freeze interest and other charges on my account, to give me a realistic chance of reducing this debt. This is the most I can offer in my present circumstances." I know I don't have to supply I&Es, shall I just write and say the same again, more or less? i.e. "I feel your demands for more detailed personal information are unnecessarily intrusive when I have already verified the figures with CCCS.As stated in my letter dated xxx (copy enclosed), the amount I have to make repayments to my creditors is £321. On a pro-rata basis, I am therefore able to pay you a regular amount of £144.45 per month on the condition that you agree to freeze interest and other charges on my account, to give me a realistic chance of reducing this debt. This is the most I can offer in my present circumstances." The letter was dated 29th July 2010, so hold on agreement will be until 8th August. Thank you very much for your help. One more letter coming up .... !! sainsburysloan5810.PDF

Received another letter from M&S. It seems they are just ignoring everything I said in my last letter, see my letter of 22/7/10 below: (" I wrote to you on 23rd June 2010, requesting that you freeze interest and other charges on my account and offering a monthly payment of £8. The letter stipulated “For the avoidance of doubt the enclosed cheque no. 102143 should only be banked if you are accepting my proposal and in all other circumstances it should be returned to me without being banked”.You have taken the payment but declined to accept the terms stipulated in my letter. My other creditors have accepted my realistic offer. I am making a genuine attempt to sort this out and I am sure you are aware that there would be little point in offering an amount I cannot maintain.I feel your demands for more detailed personal information are unnecessarily intrusive when I have already verified the figures with CCCS.As stated in my letter dated 23rd June 2010 (copy enclosed), the amount I have to make repayments to my creditors is £321. On a pro-rata basis, I am therefore able to pay you a regular amount of £8 per month on the condition that you agree to freeze interest and other charges on my account, to give me a realistic chance of reducing this debt. This is the most I can offer in my present circumstances.") Can I just write back again and say "as previously stated we have contacted CCCS to complete their I&E form and worked out how much is available to pay our creditors. On a pro-rata basis therefore we can pay you .... bla bla bla ... " Should I say something about it not being my fault that their system is rubbish, that they cash in cheques without reading the correspondence that goes with it!!! Or do I just accept that they have cashed the cheque but aren't prepared to accept my terms? Should I pay them £8 a month as they state, even though they haven't accepted my terms and I'm not happy to fill in their I&E form? Tbh we're talking £480 here! I could pay it off now with the money accumulated in my account if needs be! More letters to follow in a bit, just need to scan them too! Thanks for the help! marksandspencer5810.PDF

That sounds good, thanks Elsa! I'll cobble together a letter today and get it sent off.

OK, thanks for that. I will write to them again, don't mind repeating myself if I get somewhere in the end! On the plus side, the first positive experience is that Next have emailed me to say they will accept the lower payment and freeze interest and charges as long as we make payment by the date stated in the statement. Hurrah! One down ....

Thanks Rhia. That sounds like a good plan to me. Do you think I should wait before sending CCA letter to any of the companies? (M&S have also replied, requesting we fill in an I&E form and call to discuss arrangements, so I could also send them a letter saying we'd rather keep things in writing due to number of creditors, difficult to keep on top of details etc. etc. Santander had already written to us, stating that we should contact them to discuss arrangements and requesting we fill in an I&E form. I haven't replied to that letter yet.

Below are the letters received over the weekend. Shall I just write back, pointing out that we have given them the information they require, we don't intend to phone them or give them I&E? Shall I request CCA? (bearing in mind Sainsburys loan - the first one - taken out about a year ago, Santander taken out early this year). Thanks. sainsburys 1.PDF santander 3.PDF

When I got back from a weekend away last night, there were several letters, from companies we've sent letters re lower payments/freeze interest etc and cheques to. I have to work now, but will scan them in later or tomorrow for advice. However, basically they are sort of ignoring the terms that we offered lower payments under and requesting the rest of the payment owed, threatening with late payment charges etc. I guess I'm going to have to send the above CCA letter, which also reminds of the terms we sent the lower payment under, to all of them.

Arghhh! can't believe I missed that - thanks Elsa, I'll change it.

Would the letter below be ok to send to M&S following their letter requesting I&E etc (see above pdf file): "This letter is a formal request pursuant to s.78(1) of the Consumer Credit Act 1974. I require you to provide me with a true copy of the credit agreement relating to the above account, together with any other documentation the Act requires you to provide. I expect you to comply fully and properly with this request, within the statutory time limit. You are reminded that should you fail to comply with my request, the provisions of s.77(6) will apply. Your attention is drawn to ss.5(2), 3(b),6 and 7 of the Consumer Protection from Unfair Trading Regulations 2008 (CPUTR). I enclose a postal order in the sum of £1.00, which is the statutory fee. Note that these funds are not to be used for any other purpose. If you are unable to comply fully and properly with this request, you should confirm this in writing at the earliest opportunity, and certainly within the statutory time limit for compliance, and return the fee. I wrote to you on 23rd June 2010, requesting that you freeze interest and other charges on my account and offering a monthly payment of £y. The letter stipulated “For the avoidance of doubt the enclosed cheque no. xxxxxx should only be banked if you are accepting my proposal and in all other circumstances it should be returned to me without being banked.” However, you have taken the payment but declined to accept the terms stipulated in my letter. I am not obliged to provide you with my income and expenditure details. As stated in my letter dated 23rd June 2010, the amount I have to make repayments to all my creditors is £x. On a pro-rata basis, I am therefore able to pay you a regular amount of £y per month on the condition that you agree to freeze interest and other charges on my account, to give me a realistic chance of reducing this debt. This is the most I can offer in my present circumstances. I look forward to hearing from you. Yours faithfully". Thanks for your help.

Thanks for your reply BD. Hubbie and I discussed last night and agree re stopping payments and CCA'ing the ones who have taken cheques but not accepted our tersm. I'll put together a CCA letter using the template here and post a draft here before sending - can I include something along the lines of "Further to our previous letter, you were asked to only cash the cheque if you accept the terms in our letter. Also, we have informed you of the amount we can afford. We are not legally obliged to inform you of our I&E ... " etc. Congratulations on writing off more of your debt, that's great news! Silly them for not accepting 50% in the first place! I'm trying to keep the faith, just get a little scared sometimes, especially when the letters come through. At least the telephone calls have stopped for now, although I know it's only a matter of time before they start again!

Thanks Elsa. The M&S card was opened a while ago, haven't found the first documents yet but the earliest statement I can find is dated 18 March 2007, however it has been used until a couple of months ago for purchases and balance transfers initially. Will keep looking for the original agreements which I must have somewhere. The Santander card is from February of this year. I'll have a chat with hubbie but think I'd prefer to stop payment and CCA them. I am however very worried they will take me to court. How likely is this, does anyone know? And how soon do they go down that route? I know it is likely to differ from case to case, would just like a general idea. Thanks for your help.