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  1. Hi I was recently in Court to defend in person the Banks attempt to rail road thru a recovery action against me on my overdraft. I was defending on the grounds that an overdraft was a running account and not exempt from part V of the CCA 1974. Also that the Bank had not followed all of the procedures in opening the account - in particular the "offer Letter" The judge said in his summation "The claimant says that at the material time the defendants would have been sent an offer letter confirming that the account was opened and sending them a terms and conditions and tariffs and charges leaflet, but there is no evidence before the court that that documentation exists In the circumstances, the claimants say that they have complied with condition (2)(b) by providing the material information required by that condition in writing. The Defendant says they have not complied with it. In my judgment, they have complied with it and the reasons that I say they have complied with it are quite simply these. The purpose clearly is that the information is given in writing as opposed to orally and is confirmed in writing. The confirmation in writing has to be provided at the time the agreement is concluded or before the agreement is concluded. The information in this case, in my judgment, was clearly provided before the agreement was concluded. It is provided in writing in the form of the application. The form of the application says, as I have already read, that “a minimum overdraft facility of £??? will automatically be allocated when your account is opened”. That is the credit limit. The defendants, when making the application, confirmed that they “agree to be bound by the claimants’ terms and conditions as varied from time to time, a copy of which has been provided to us”. Therefore, the terms and conditions were provided and confirmed in writing and acknowledged by defendants by their signing of this application form" How does this now stand under contract law as my argument is 1) An application form is an offer of services to open and administer a bank account ? 2) An "Offer Letter" must to be sent out by the Bank to confirm that the application has been successful and the account is opened with T&C's etc ?? 3) In order for a contract to be crystalised - the "Offer Letter" must be accepted. The Bank is saying that by me signing and ticking the box on the application form - that I would be bound by the terms , this meets their obligations under OFT Determination s74. However in the the application form the Bank says that if I am successful, I will be sent and "Offer Letter" and also how to terminate the account. Despite "SAR" request. Neither of these letters ever surfaced ? So my question is - Without the "Offer Letter being entered into Court as evidence -was the account opened correctly under Contract Law and therefore enforceable. I am sure that this might have implications for other Forum folks in a similar position. Tx
  2. Hi Andy Thanks for your message. My wife has her original divorce papers and thankfully our marriage certificate !! Not sure where they or we go with this. Save to Court if thats what they wish. I am sure that they without my wife's legal name on an account application form it cannot be enforceable. Same way that your question stands. Anyone could change their name or forge a divorce certificate or even just use their birth certificate. They still have to provide 3 forms of identity "Utility Bill" etc etc .
  3. Hi have been in in correspondence with Lloyd for the past 6 months re a copy of my CCA. They have supplied a poor photcopy of an application form , for a Trustcard in my previous married name in 88. I remarried in 89 and took my my Husbands name - My question is Can the bank use this application form as proof of me opening my account. All of my statements have shown my married name. Surely, if they attempt to take me to court and rely on a document that is not legally my name and has not been for the past 23 yrs. Oh - Lloyds suggest in their latest letter that s78 of the Act does not give me the right the access a copy of my application form. ? Lloyds are suggesting if I am not happy to complain to the FOS Can anyone shed some light on my potential legal position Tx in advance
  4. Interesting points you raise. Now - I have not have any correspondence from Citi - No default notices or Termination letter. Cabot's letter says that they have brought the account so presumably and legally - Citi would have had to contractually terminate my account with me in order to allow Cabot to take it on. So - does that mean that Citi have unlawfully rescinded my account .
  5. HI - I have been watching this thread with interest. I sent a CCA request following a letter received last week . Interesting reply received today (attached). If Cabot don't hold my details to fulfill my CCA request - how can they legitimately hold the assignment. They are asking me to contact Citicard directly with this request. Returned my £1 postal order. Any one have any thoughts and comments on a response to them.Cabot1.pdf
  6. HI - have been following this thread with interest as have had the same Cabot (standard) letter with a spurious copy of an assignment to them. Can anyone clarify the legal deficient points in the purported Citicard Assignment letter as I want to nip this is the bud with Cabot. Should Citicard have written to me separately to inform me that Cabot had brought my account and that they were officially assigning it to them. Thanks
  7. Hi Could it be that the doc was not executed correctly. I received a letter today with a copy of the agreement purporting to bare my signature. The T&Cs state YOUR RIGHT TO CANCEL - Once you have signed this Agreement, you will have a short time in which to cancel it. The Creditor will send to you exact details of how and when you can do this - I have not received any copy information on this from Amex. It also state - ADDITIONAL RIGHT TO CANCEL - Once this Agreement is made you will have the right to cancel it before whichever is the later of either (a) 14 days after you receive your card, or (b 14 after the day on which you receive a copy of the agreement signed by us) The Agreement that I have been sent only purportedly bares my signature. The "Official Use Only" box underneath my purported signature is empty. This is all framed in one box. However, this copy document is stamped - dated 17 Feb 2008 with; what looks like a signature underneath. It looks like a pre cut rubber stamp job. Am I right in thinking that to execute this document correctly, both mine and the authorised Amex representative signature, must be within one framed box on the left hand side of the Agreement. SLD
  8. HI The card was offered to me in late 2007 / early 2008 - not sure of the exact date. Application form was on line. Never any paperwork. Had to stop paying the card off in mid 2009 due to work drying up. Offered £150 through a DCA. That DCA was changed by Amex to someone else. Excess charges were mounting up. Decided to request a CCA after finding this forum in April and new DCA contacting me regarding the account. Following a series of letters and requests - the DCA will not send me the info to see if the online form exists in hard copy. I think will no signature, it is not enforceable. I did read that the Act had been updated to reflect Internet forms ?? Hope that this helps
  9. Hi Thanks for the heads up. I am a bit concerned that if I do not reply it could be deemed as refusing their offer and possibly opening the gate for Amex to have a crack at me again. Clearly - there must not an enforceable agreement if they are offering any discount. Should I send Amex a copy of the letter that I sent to Allied, stating my position in relation to actions of Allied and them placing the account into an unenforceable position. At some point I want to get rid of this default on my credit assessment. Is there a template letter in the library that I could use that sets the record in place from a legal position if Amex get heavy. SLD
  10. Hi Firstly, I hope that the attached letter helps anyone who is in a similar position. Background I sent a CCA request to Allied Int'l (DCA) who were chasing the account in May 2K10. No reply but confirmed as received by Royal Mail. AND they cashed the postal order.!! Follow up letter after 12 days and again after 30 days - No reply to either but Royal Mail confirmed as received. Basically the account became unenforceable on July 15th 2K10 as they did not respond to any correspondence regarding the CCA. Received a standard letter from Allied Int'l on 21st July threatening legal action so fired off a letter requesting info under Pre Action Practice Directions. Received a reply, suggesting that Allied wanted to settle amicably without recourse to the courts on 3rd August. I followed this up with the attached letter which was confirmed received by Royal Mail Tracking Service. Today Received a letter from Amex suggesting that they had been contacted by an outside debt collection agency - interesting that Amex have not confirmed that they instructed Allied Int'l. Bottom line is that I have been offered a 21% reduction on my account to settle. IS THIS A TACTIC ? 1) Given that the account is clearly in dispute by the actions of Allied, the agreement is now unenforceable. ( I accept that the debt is still on the book but not recoverable by Amex) Q - Is there a standard template letter that I should use to reply to their offer ? Q - What should be my opening counter offer and final offer in % terms off of the account. I have to say that without sight of any statements, I cannot assess how much interest and charges have been applied. They just won't send to me this information. Again hope the letter helps and look forward to comments and suggestions SLDAllied-AmEX .doc
  11. Hi I have now received the SAR documents and I have posted the copy of my CCA that HSBC purport to be the original ? It does not bare any stamp to present this document as the original. Interesting point of reference is that I did not date this document. It looks like my signature on it. However the person that signed on behalf of the HSBC also dated my section. No T&C's contained in this document and cooling off period shown. Infact - No T&C;s enclosed with the SAR pack. How do I ensure that this is the correct document ie, the original. Is the debt enforceable with the current info sent to me. Welcome thoughts and comments HSBC1.pdf HSBC2.pdf
  12. Hi Thanks, We will compose the letter and send off to the bank. The local branch is aware of my Brother in Laws condition. However, this does not translate to Lloyd HQ. For good order and clarity - It was the Lloyd Bank local branch who suggested this approach to managing the account given that there are only 6 payments per month coming into the account, and all Disability Living Allowances. Poorly trained or devious in their training program to grab any and all funds where possible. I will come back with any answers received
  13. Many thanks for your replies. No - my and father in law have not informed the bank that they are trustees of the account. I will write to the CEO of Lloyds to inform him of how shallow his bank is, to use such underhand, deceitful and dreadful tactics. He should be ashamed of his bank. Can anyone suggest a use template to use.
  14. Hi My wife received a letter today from Lloyds advising her that as she had missed her minimum payment on her credit card they have taken it from my brother in law's Lloyd TSB account. He registered disabled, following a stroke and my wife and father in law administer as signatories on his account, to pay for his disability carers etc. In a despicable attempted to up the Anti on my wife and embarasse her, I quote from the letter as follows: "IF THE ACCOUNT THAT WE HAVE TRANSFERRED FUNDS FROM IS HELD JOINTLY, AND A QUERY IS RECEIVED FROM YOUR JOINT ACCOUNT HOLDER ABOUT THIS PAYMENT, WE WILL BE REQUIRED TO EXPLAIN THAT THE FUNDS HAVE BEEN TRANSFERRED INTO THIS LOAN ACCOUNT. HOWEVER TO MAINTAIN YOUR PRIVACY NO FURTHER DETAILS ABOUT THIS ACCOUNT WILL BE SUPPLIED As she is named on the bank account with my Father in Law, given his level of disability that the local branch is aware that my brother in law in registered disabled, the bank is abusing its T&C's. Q - How should I address this with bank to ensure that it does not happen again. Many thanks
  15. I have looked through all of the paperwork supplied by the bank. They replied to me on June 22nd and I quote:- "Please be aware that overdrafts are exempt from the section of the Consumer Credit Act dealing with the form and executions of agreements. The agreement with you does not, therefore, take the form of a single document signed by both parties. It comprises the application form and the account Terms & Conditions, of which you now have two copies." A) Does section 76(8) now come into play ? B) The bank has not supplied any letters or correspondence to me, following the opening of the account, confirming the original overdraft, T&C's as required in the OFT's Determination. C ) The original account agreement does not refer to any overdraft facility. The bank is relying on this agreement as my confirmation of accepting the overdraft and its interest rate. CD
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