nice one! Thanks for that.

Having received cca from egg with no T&Cs or cancellation rights, I wrote to Egg telling them I thought it was unenforceable. They have since written back asking why I think it is unenforceable. My question is this, do I carry on paying them and should I write to them and tell them why I think it is unenforceable?

Thanks for any advice you can give.

ok thanks - will do, thanks pinky

sorry to bump this one up again, but I received the application form which has credit agreement written across the top, and it does have interest rates and right to cancel. Is this enforceable do you think? It is a mothercare account, which has been passed to CL finance.

http://i829.photobucket.com/albums/zz211/clare007/mothercare006-1.jpg

Can anyone have a look at this document please? have CCAd CL Finance (Mothercare storecard) - and they have sent the instore application form, which has credit agreement written across the top. It has financial details with interest rate, and your right to cancel in small print at the bottom. does this application form constitute an enforceable credit agreement?

Thanks again -any help gratefully received (I am slowly trying to sort out the huge financial mess I am in , and it is all down to this forum so thanks again) x

I think the small print may be too small to read though

http://i829.photobucket.com/albums/zz211/clare007/mothercare006.jpg

Thanks huff and puff. I am a bit confused by the enclosing letter though. Abbey states that the

"state of account, total sum paid £919. Outstanding balance is 0.00..Total sum which has been payable under the agreement but unpaid by the client £0."

I know the balance is more like £2800, - do you think abbey has made a mistake or sold the account on? or could it be most of the balance comprised the excessive charges they levied and they have now removed them? is this just wishful thinking? Anyway I have composed a letter = does this sound ok?

Thank you for your prompt reply to my request for a true copy of my credit agreement.

I note that you state in your letter dated 17 September 2009, that the state of the account is as follows:

“The total sum paid £919.62 and the outstanding balance £0.00. Total sum which has become payable under the agreement but unpaid by the client - £0.00.”

I would be most grateful if you could now confirm that this account is satisfied, or whether you have indeed passed this account to a 3rd party, and if so, please provide details

I would appreciate your prompt response

Yours sincerely

Thankyou!! I believe I received my first next directory about 5 years ago - maybe more. Have always paid my debts but then things spiralled out of control once i had children, now am trying to sort myself out. I don't believe I ever signed for it, can't remember.

Its really nice to know that fellow caggers are around to advise. you sort of don't feel as desperate!

Hi again to everyone - Abbey have replied to my request

The agreement is very difficult to read - doesn't appear to have many of the prescribed T&Cs. Can anyone have a look for me please?

Also, very strangely, abbey (santander) have said in their letter that the state of the account is nil outstanding, and nil unpaid. Does this mean they have sold the account to a 3rd party? At my reckoning there was approx £2000 o/s.

http://i829.photobucket.com/albums/zz211/clare007/abbey1.jpg

Hi, have been reading threads on Next Directory. Have just CCA'd Moorcroft (who now have the debt - I have a DMP).

Next have sent me a letter saying the true copy does not need to be exact. ''this means that it does not need to have non-statutory information which was included for the creditor's own benefit or signature boxes. Therefore Next are not required to provide you with a signed copy of the agreement and this is made clear in Section 3(2) of the Consumer credit (cancellation notices and copies of documents) regulations"

Is the absence of a signed CCA in this case make this unenforceable? As Next state - "in the absence of any evidence to suggest that you did not order and /or receive the goods delivered.. it is noted you have neither denied ordering or receiving Next goods"

I don't have any idea what charges for late payments/missed payments have been made. Should I get a subject access report?

Many thanks

brilliant, thanks again

can anyone help please. have received a cca from CL finance in respect of frasercard, it appears to be an application form but with the consumer credit agreement title across the top. Is this enforceable?

http://i829.photobucket.com/albums/zz211/clare007/frasercard.jpg

It was a postal application .

hi, have just received CCA from COOP and it has PPI on it. It is my husbands loan account, but he can't remember the bank explaining anything about ppi. He has signed a box which says 'I wish to purchase PPI'. Normally I advise him not to take out PPI as I always felt it was a waste of money. The loan agreement looks enforceable. Could anyone tell me whether we can try to claim the ppi back? I have a feeling the bank may have implied his loan would be considered more favourably with PPI

thank you

Thanks everyone

Hi, Have had 2 loans from HSBC for £1500 and £6000. Struggled to make payments, and now have debt mgt plan so paying reduced amount. HSBC passed to CL Finance and Link. I requested CCAs and have had replies from bothe Link and CL Finance to say that the account numbers do not represent loan accounts but bank accounts and therefore do not fall within Consumer credit act. I know that my bank account with the HSBC did not have a closing balance of £5500, can the HSBC transfer the loan amount into the bank account in this way? Shall I request a subject access report?

Thank you for any advice.

Hi, Thanks for that - the only thing is I feel awful - I mean, they have sent me a signed copy of an agreement - it has just got bits missing. They might just laugh me all the way to court and i will have to pay court costs etc what will their next move be do you think?

It does not appear to have the cancellation rights.

 

If an agreement is not properly executed it can only be enforced by court order (s65 of the CCA 1974). A court is not allowd to enforce such an agreement under certain circumstances:

 

 

2. If it is a cancellable agreement and the requirements about cancellation rights have not been complied with (s127(4))

Hi Guys! Would appreciate some help if possible - am sending this letter to Egg in response to the CCA I received - It has a signature, but no cancellation or prescribed terms and conditions within the actual signed agreement.

Could you please check this letter to see if its ok - do I need to add anything?

Thank you for your response to my request under the Consumer Credit Act section 78. In your response you confirm this as a true copy of the original agreement executed by yourselves on the 24/05/06.

As you must realise this agreement does not conform to sections 60(1) and 61(1) of the Consumer Credit Act 1974 and would therefore only be enforceable by a court under s65. However, the absence of any prescribed terms means that a court would be prevented from enforcing it under s127(3

I am granting to you a further 21 days to produce a copy of an executable agreement. After that I will consider that the above account is closed and that you will no longer pursue the alleged debt. After this period you should close the file and cease processing all personal data relating to me on this matter.

yours sincerely xxx

Will this do?

Thanks

I have just found Vint's letter - check this out

Re: my request under the Consumer Credit Act 1974

Thank you for your recent letter sent to me, the contents of which are noted. I appreciate your quick response to my original letter. However, the reply received by me does not fulfil your requirements under the Consumer Credit Act 1974.

The Act demands that I be supplied with a true copy of any properly executed credit agreement that exists in relation to the above account. I may ask for this on demand providing that a fee of £1.00 is paid. This fee was sent with my original letter.

My request remains outstanding. The items you sent in your reply, does not constitute a true copy of any credit agreement that may or may not have been signed by me on the opening of this account. It neither confirms that I am liable for any alleged debt to you, nor gives me any chance to evaluate whether any original agreement was ‘properly executed’.

I still require you to send me a true copy of the original credit agreement that you allege exists. As you will know, under the Consumer Credit Act 1974, a judge is not permitted to make any enforcement order unless the creditor can provide a true signed copy of the original credit agreement. This means that unless you can produce such an agreement, this alleged debt is not enforceable in law.

You had until XX/XX/2008 to provide me with the true copy I requested. You are now in default of my request. Any account I hold with you is now in legal dispute. Whilst the account remains in dispute, you are not permitted to ask for any payment, nor am I obliged to offer any payment to you. Furthermore, whilst the dispute remains, you are not entitled to charge any interest on the account, nor make any further charges to the account. Additionally, you are not entitled to register any information on this account with any credit reference agency.

To register information with a credit reference agency, you must have written consent from the customer to collate and share such information. This consent is given in the form of a signed credit agreement, so until you produce such an agreement, you may not do this.

The requirement for consent to share data is a clear requirement of the Data Protection Act 1998. any such attempts to share my data without my consent will be met with a complaint to the Information Commissioners Office

To sum up, I will not be making any further payments to you until you provide me with the document I have requested. Whilst you remain in default of my request, you are not permitted to take any action against this account. This includes adding further charges and passing any information to the credit reference agencies.

Should you not have any signed credit agreement in relation to this alleged debt, please confirm this in writing to me.

I look forward to your reply.

Yours faithfully

Print name do not sign

**amend to suit your circumstances.**

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Hi sharmar - Is this agreement signed by you? if not, then it is most definately not enforceable. though I am not an expert -

good luck

Actually - have just noticed a reference number printed on the side of the terms and conditions EP/1686 01/09 mmmm!!

does this mean this document originated in Jan 09??? crafty and the reference number is in a different colour which means it won't show through on the scan.

My Egg agreement does not mention cancellation rights, but they also sent me a copy of generic terms and conditions that does mention cancellation rights - we have no way of knowing whether we ever received this extra document (and to be honest it looks pretty recent - you can tell by the design etc) at the start of the loan. I don't think there is any way of proving either way whether they sent this document or not. I think Egg sent this to cover their tracks quite frankly.

many thanks - sorry for being a bit stupid.

originally it was Abbey credit card. the account number is the one to which payments are made (via debt management plan with Payplan)

I got the address from Payplan and sent it to Santander at Chester.

MBMA wrote back saying the account is not a valid MBMA account number.

I think that I may miss a payment or 2 to see if that will generate a letter from them with an account number. Or should I send a subject access letter do you think?

I sent a CCA request to Santander and it has been returned with the postal order quote "i am returning your letter as the account number you have provided is not showing as a valid MBNA account. Please re-submit your request with the correct details"

the address I sent the request to was santander, chester business park, chester. Does anyone have an alternative address?

thanks

Thanks for your time vint1954 - you are surely very busy trying to sort us all out. Much appreciated.