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Posts posted by Massamum

  1. Don’t know if this is relevant or not as I’m not that “up” on these things but at the top of the t&c’s it says “These conditions are effective from 1 October 2002” but at the bottom is says “Lloyds TSB Bank plc registered office

    To 27 March 2003 – 71 Lombard Street From

    28 March 2003 – 25 Gresham Street”


    Can they see into the future??? :D

  2. the reason they dont send a legible copy is 95% because they dont have one@


    if they had an orginal it would be a simple matter to photocopy it- if they cant photocopy it then the orignal would be unreadable (and useless) too!


    the real reason you have an unreadable copy is because it is a copy of a microfiche.(which itself is a copy)



  3. i wouldnt have written it if i didnt think it was appropriate however:-



    it is the FEAR of proceedings that these people rely on


    at some point you must make a decision- do i trust my own beleif that there is no agreement/Dn etc or do i cave in to the pressure!


    only you in your circumstances can decide


    however, if it is the former- you will get all the support you need on this forum to tackle them in court (if they ever carry out the threat, that is)


    have just seen the first line of your post - sorry I wasn't referring to the letter you wrote as being appropriate (I'm really grateful you took the time to do that for me), I meant the one I'd underlined as a hyperlink ("this") in my post above

  4. Yes you are absolutely right, its definitely the fear factor that they rely on.


    I think the DN is a bit naff on dates, the first page of cca looks ok but the t&c's are unreadable so I can't check, of course Lloyds won't send a legible copy and so it goes on.


    Part of me thinks 'for goodness sake just take me to court and get it over and done with'. But then I ask myself why haven't they done so so far, perhaps they know they're in the wrong.


    I will go ahead and send both letters and see what happens.


    Thanks DD.

  5. You could try a letter something like the one below.




    xxxxxxxxxxxxx 2009.


    Dear xxxxxxx,


    Re account no xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx


    I am in receipt of your letter date xxxxxxxxxxxxxx and note its contents.



    I note, that xxxxxxxx are still in breach of supplying the documentation that I have previously requested under s78 of the Consumer Credit Act 1974, in that xxxxxx have yet to supply a legible executed agreement. To date, all that you have supplied under this request, is an illegible copy of a reconstructed application form. As you are aware, application forms do not satisfy the criteria laid down for an agreement.


    In relation to what constitutes a true copy, please read the details below. In a recent letter from the enforcement department of the OFT, the text below was quoted, explaining what is required.


    “The copy of the executed agreement need not be an exact copy but it must be a ‘true copy’ and not some reconstruction of what the original might have been and it must contain the same terms as the original. Where the terms have been varied as provided for within the agreement, the copy of the original agreement must be accompanied by a document setting out the current terms, as varied. Certain details may be omitted from the original agreement eg the signature but the debtor must be in no doubt as to the true nature of his obligations under the loan.


    Should no original agreement be in existence it is very hard to say that the copy the creditor offers to the debtor is, in fact, a true copy as there would be no original with which to compare it. In our view the onus of proof would be on the creditor to show that the copy is a true one and where none existed he may have difficulty discharging this. Neither should creditors suggest that a consumer has signed a credit agreement where they are unable to provide evidence to support this — to do so is likely to be a misleading action under Regulation 5 of the Consumer Protection from Unfair Trading Regulations 2008 (the CPRs) and would also constitute an unfair or improper business practice.”


    I am now granting to you a further 7 days to produce a true copy of any executableagreement.After that I will consider that the above matter is closed and that you will no longer pursue the alleged debt.If you are insisting that the non enforceable reconstructed Application form with added Terms and Conditions that you have supplied, is the only alleged agreement in your possession, then I would suggest that the best course of action would be to immediately set the balance of the above account number to zero.


    You must also consider this letter as notice under s10 of the Data Protection Act, to cease processing my data. All entries which refer to missed payments be removed from my credit file All collection activities cease with immediate effect until you comply with my request from xxxxxxxxx or such time as a court makes an enforcement order.


    I would take this opportunity to remind you, that you have yet to supply any documentation in relation to my Subject Access Request.


    Yours sincerely


    I sent this letter off to Lloyds a while ago but their response was the same, they won't budge and advised me to contact the FOS if I'm not happy with it. Now Westcott are sending me final notices on red paper and their sols Nelson Guest say that if I don't offer payment within 10 days of date of letter (28th Oct) then they will advise their clients to issue court proceedings. All the while Lloyds are in default of their CCA obligations by not sending a legible copy. Any ideas of where I should go now folks please?

  6. Hi guys im back again - I requested my CCA from M & S and was sent very blurred copy of an account card application form it has 2 pages on the first is my signature on part 12 DATA POLICY but underneath it there is a part that says signed for and on bealf of M & S financial services but this is NOT signed


    A Limit is ticked at £500 but was obviously increased over time as the o/s balance stands at £1838.42 according to m & S but rockwell say it is £2293 (I think this may have beed CCJ June 06 but I have never responded to it)


    The number at the side of the form and on the account number does not correspond with anything I have been sent regarding the debt


    Is this enforceable? What do I do if it has gone to CCJ already and if not what shall I do next?


    Any advice welcome


    I have scanned the document on here


    Sorry I can't be of any help enforceability wise but your name, address and account numbers are all visible on here, best to remove. Good luck.

  7. then you have not got all the logs


    Nope. They've mucked up again (am thinking its on purpose tbh). Blow it, I'm not going to give them another chance, I'm not going to bother writing to them again, this time I am going to report them to the IFO, I've had enough of their faffing around.

  8. You might feel more enlightened if you read the thread http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/show-post/post-2406581.html

    it's a long thread, and PT who works for a solicitor's firm is an expert on these forums has argued this point continuously in this thread (not without challenges). The most important article to read for this issue that PT has posted up elsewhere is page 1 http://i990.photobucket.com/albums/af28/Redfish_bucket/BSandALarticle1.jpg and page 2 http://i990.photobucket.com/albums/af28/Redfish_bucket/BSandALarticle2.jpg


    OMG, can't believe the size of this thread :eek:, will be reading forever more!!! Thanks.

  9. you are looking for the date the DN (defaulted) was issued, and after that any reference to the account being closed or zero's or the amount owing being moved to somwhere else

    have just finished looking through but can find absolutely nothing relating to the loan account (grrr). So annoying.

  10. if the DN was posted 2nd class (as is likely) it is defective as they did not give you sufficient time to remedy the alleged breach (quote apart from what redfish is saying)


    now then, i dont suppose you kept the envelope?


    if not get a SAR off the them right away so that we can see what their comms logs have to offer


    in the meantime, if they are threatening legal action - just sit back and wait.


    ill get in touch with you later about your I & E's

    Thanks very much DD, all sounds good. No I didn't keep the envelope (that was back in the days before I discovered CAG).


    I have (finally) had my SAR back from them but no paperwork relating to the loan (what a surprise). I will be writing to them again shortly asking for this. I'll have a look at the comms log now - what am I supposed to be looking for? (I have about 30 years worth of stuff to sift through!!!)

  11. Massamum


    This may give you some hope. Look at your agreement carefully. There is no term stating the 'Amount of Credit'. These words must be used. Instead you have 'loan amount', 'loan for loan protection insurance', 'total loan'. You have no figure which is definitively labelled 'amount of credit'.


    We have challenged a loan on the basis that the term used was 'cash advance' instead of 'amount of credit. The loan company (MBNA) must have realised we have a strong enough case to argue, because they are now trying to offer a full and final settlement of 50% (we are not taking it up though). You are in a better position than us as we did not even have PPI added to the credit amount, we only had one figure for 'cash advance'.


    I wouldn't pay the £1 anyway, you will never have the debt become statute barred - it's best to stop paying and let them take you to court. I will post you the wording of our letter if you want to take the route we did.

    Thanks for that Redfish, sounds interesting - anyone else have any thoughts on this?

  12. your bargaining position is a lot stronger than you think- ill have a look at the DN tomorrow then i think we need to look (privately if you wish) at your total I & E and work out your disposable income and what the threats to your assets are- but it looks favourable at the moment from where i am looking



    really? that'd be great. DN very nearly uploaded so will be on here for tomorrow. I won't be online til the afternoon as I have an appointment early part of the day. Thanks for all your help tonight Dick, most appreciated.

  13. Thanks. Sadly I'm not in a position to offer more than the £1 as I'm on benefits. The debt is increasing but only by a very small amount, I think as they are now demanding the full balance there isn't much point in restarting the £1. I agree it does look bad going down the PPI reclaim route but I really don't know what else I can do, the agreement's enforceable and I have no way of paying it until I can get back to work. DN on its way.

  14. I have looked at your agreement,


    i am more versed with credit cards than fixed loans, however IMO whilst i accept that the pages one and two should be front and reverse i t is my feeling that this would be accepted by a court as a binding agreement.


    are you in arrears?


    Thanks DD, sadly I think you're right that a court would enforce it. I would like to reclaim the PPI but as I made a claim on it (and Lloyds paid out), I'm not sure where I would stand. I still have an awful lot of reading to do!!!


    I am seriously in arrears and have been since about July 08, they issued DN October 08, I'm very very surprised they haven't taken action sooner to be honest.

  15. dont forget that you can take a "buddy" to court and in most cases if you ask the court and tell them you are nervous they will allow your buddy to speak for you


    there are buddies on this forum who will go with you to curt (including myself) if you are nearby=- click on the buddies link


    That is most reassuring DD, I would certainly like to take you up on that offer (or another CAG buddy if you're too far away), if I do have to go to court. Thank you.

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