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  1. I have two questions, which I will ask after a brief explanation. I sold a house in London on the 18th of Feb last year and notified the council that there were new owners, and to bill the new occupier. I received a bill for the current tax year about two months ago. I wrote to them explaining again and asked them to confirm that it had been actioned. No reply, but another bill turned up this week. 1) What is the best way to nip this in the bud and can I threaten them with some legal recourse for harassment, when it is clearly marked on the Land Registry that it was sold on that date. 2) Whilst I did own the house in 2013, whilst doing it up for sale after a long rental period, I wrote to them and asked for a month's discount due to the month it was empty, plus the single person's discount and this obviously happened later, the fact that I was not the occupier/owner for the full year. Some how, they managed to take me to court without issuing a LBA and there was no summons from the county court, I certainly would have attended and put my quite strong case forward. The first I knew was just after we sold the house in Feb 2014, was a bailiff's demand, the county court ones, but I think they were called HCEO but the names keep changing and I know bailiffs has been replaced, but hopefully you understand what I mean. Shortly afterwards I had my stroke, spent two months in hospital and never got around to dealing with it. The bailiffs gave up, as I don't have a car at the moment, I'm well off territory living in the Midlands and I don't leave doors or windows open. It was also interesting that the court case was something like August 2013 but the bailiffs didn't write to me until Feb 2014, so probably any time limit on going back to the court had expired. I don't want to keep sending letters, and find they've managed to take me to court without an LBA or summons again, how can I make sure this doesn't happen. The only good thing, is that they can only put a charge on the actual property not other property owned by the individual (i.e. my home) also because I am still recovering, I am not in employment or on benefits, just doing a few cash in hand jobs ad hoc which doesn't even take me anywhere near my tax allowance, so they can't do an attachment of earnings.
  2. Well, I turned up in good time before I had checked which court number I was in or announced myself to the usher, the opposition solicitor pounced, and called me into a room. Under the pretence that as I was a LIP, he had a duty to inform me of the proceedings and what happens (I'm not so sure). He then gleefully took the opportunity to offer me a Tomlin order, all nice and agreed, no one else gets to know, no CCJ, no HCEO (bailiffs). I said, how much were they looking for, "oh, the full amount" and he didn't mention it at the time, thinking I would just be confused and want to leave court, probably his fee neatly wrapped up in this Tomlin order. I said, well there is nothing in it for me then, "but no CCJ", I said, I don't care about a CCJ, I don't use credit any more - you should have seen his face, I wish I had a camera. I said, I'll take my chances in court, "but it's an open and shut case". I said, so what,you haven't brought anything to the table, no negotiation, it will be the same whether I go to court or not and I'm here now. I don't think he was impressed with my blase attitude or had many too many like me. So in we went. The problem for me, right from the start was, they had copies of the original documents from 1992, I did admit in my defence that I had banked with Abbey/Santander (I couldn't really deny it) and therefore in the end, the overdraft plus some other money I had racked up was payable, I could see which way it was going. The word technical was used a lot, technical defence this, technical that. It very much centred around a terms and conditions booklet on current account and associated facilities including a section on overdrafts. I did try to argue that they hadn't supplied a copy of the original overdraft taken out after the current account had been in use for some time, and surely that was required. The statutory demand came up and took a fair bit of time. It was argued that one was not needed for an overdraft, as the conditions say the facility could be withdrawn at any time. The judge said, presumably that one could still be issued if needed. I don't think the judge was fully conversant on the matter and I certainly wasn't, so in the end it was let go as not required by law. We came to the charges, the judge thought they were unfair, anyone with half a brain, could see at this point, he was looking to award to the claimant, but remove the penalty charges. Most would have accepted, but not mister solicitor, so he was given leave to phone the client and came back and said no, they wanted all the charges as well. You could see the judge starting to get exasperated at this point, with his hint, I'll award you the claim, but let go of the charges until it got to the point where he said, "Then we will adjourn to a later date, you will need a copy of the default notice, the original overdraft and we will go through it with a fine tooth combe, i.e. if you're going to be difficult, so can I, and it might be a different judgement next time. Lawyer man was still wanting to argue it out, but bit his lip very hard to stop himself saying anything. Judge did his summing up, awarding to the claimant, penalty charges to the defendant. Lawyer went through balance of debt, court costs and allowed court interest. And then wanted over £200 for his time. Judge asked why, "for bringing a waste of time defenceless case to court" - he didn't say those words, but that is what it equated to. Judge said that he didn't see it as a wasted case and under the conditions and technicalities of the case, Mr.RMS had defended quite well and put forward some interesting objections, costs denied. I really don't know why they think a Tomlin order with no reduction in debt, would be of so much interest to people. Yes, okay, I now have a CCJ, but saved about £800 in costs plus over £200 in solicitor's fees, so I am about £1,000 better off, and the look on the lawyer's face when I said I don't care about a CCJ, will stay with me to my dying day. Now, can somebody tell me what happens next when you can't pay it all, and pitiful monthly payments? Who sets the payment levels? If it is the claimant and they are too high, who do I go to to be the arbiter of that decisions. Are there any organisations that help people out, take it on and make it almost impossible to go down the bailiffs route? Also if it did go that way, I think I would fall into the vulnerable category, because I had a stroke last year and my liver almost collapsed. I see people at the stroke rehab, the liver specialist (hepatologist) at the local hospital, the hospital dietician, because I have to eat in a certain way, because my liver doesn't process food like others, my GP regularly for check ups and blood tests. They even keep asking me to come in for my free flu jab because I am on the at risk category. I also take 8 prescription medicines a day, and I don't mean vitamin C, I mean some real serious ones. Any help with regards to the latter part would be helpful. I will also try and answer any questions on parts I may have missed out on the case or questions people have as to where something else might have worked. All I would say, they have original copies going back a long time, in my case 1992 and they don't really want to compromise, they don't even like settling for an 85% win, they see that as a 15% loss in revenue. I hope people appreciate, that as hard as it was for me, that I didn't get the result I wanted, I didn't just disappear, never to post again, I came back and told my story.
  3. Sorry for not coming back yesterday, I was fairly fatigued, the stroke does that to you sometimes, both mentally and physically. Just the very brief details tonight and then the in depth tomorrow, I'm still tired and thinking hurts. Lost the claim, I'll go into detail tomorrow, they did offer me a Tomlin order beforehand at full money. I got about £800 in charges knocked off, I had incorrectly estimated it a bit higher (some where just debits back from credits paid for DDs then cancelled). Their lawyer tried to claim over £200 for his time for a time wasting case brought before the court, which was denied, as the judge said Mr.RMS put up a fairly robust defence on a very technical case. I must have given them a run for the money, the whole case took 1:45 minutes. Which is a long time up against a lawyer when you're not used to or have any experience in the field. As well as going through it in depth, I have a couple of questions about the case and also about my best course of action following on. And Sham, thanks for your help at short notice.
  4. It's a T&C booklet , pretty much standard from about 25 years ago, for current account, cheque guarantee card and Abbeylink card (cash card). The bit about overdrafts. Not a good plan, I never expected them to have copies of original stuff from pre-computer days. I don't really know what to do, but if I don't turn up then it is a summary judgement, and that won't be any better. [ATTACH=CONFIG]59592[/ATTACH]
  5. Let me know the email address soon, because I have to be up by 5:30am.
  6. Post 86 is SLWY. From memory (I'm pretty sure on this one), the original request for an overdraft was one or two years after opening the account, and it was for £1,000. There is no copy of that in the WS. The application for the £2,000 was the document you see, in 98, so about 5 years after the original overdraft. There was no letter, about terminating the overdraft (or not that I got, otherwise I would have been straight on the phone), but apparently it was a standard one sent to most customers. It was nothing about how you had kept your account with in good standing. They went out about May 2009 apparently with one month's notice. I should imagine the Santander still have a copy of it somewhere on file. Again, that is not included in the WS. Just a by the way, the solicitor sent their WS right at the last minute, it was dated the 14th, but there was no way it was sent that day, and impossible for it to arrive two weeks before the 23rd even if it was.
  7. Yes please, do you need them all emailed, if not, let me know the ones you need.
  8. I think the paragraph 12 you mean (there is more than one), refers to these. [ATTACH=CONFIG]59590[/ATTACH] [ATTACH=CONFIG]59591[/ATTACH]
  9. I went over the limit, because they removed the overdraft, thereby making it an unauthorised overdraft, rather than an authorised overdraft that was within limit. Overdraft extension document is listed, post 80 number 6, top line, one on the right. default notice [ATTACH=CONFIG]59589[/ATTACH]
  10. I'm not so good with stuff like that. I had a stroke last year and it isn't so easy any more. I bought a new printer scanner today, but it took over two hours to get going, and that wasn't just me, it was a nightmare. Anyway, it is tomorrow morning, so I presently am just try to make sure I have all my paperwork in place and then maybe concentrate on getting a good night's sleep. Anything you can suggest from the muddle you see, or particular points that you think I should be raising, please free to add them. I'll look here again tonight and first thing morning (it will be early, as I will get a lift and the person starts work at 7:00am, so I have to fit in with them. Living in a village is a nightmare and I just couldn't rely on public transport to guarantee me arriving on time). And the last thing I want to do is give them a summary judgement.
  11. I sent you a PM, let me know if for any reason you don't get it. If answering my question, please do it by PM, not on the main board. I'm sure you'll understand why.
  12. None, I think it was back in the recession in 2009 and financial institutions withdrew a lot of 'load' facilities. WS does not refer to it. I am busy scanning WS now, it's a slow process but will be posted later. Meanwhile, I have one question about the outcome, that I would like to ask by PM, I do not want it on the forum. It anybody would be happy to try and help with that one, it would be much appreciated. It's a short question.
  13. The account was active and at the time of removal, it was running at 50% of authorised limit and was not going over the authorised limit.
  14. They called in, almost all overdrafts, telling the customer that the overdraft was being withdrawn, regardless, or whether the account was being managed and within limit or not. There was supposed to be notification, but the same happened with my wife. My wife was able to negotiate hers 's back to half what it was, but I was left overdrawn in a now unauthorised position. I'll try to get a copy posted up tomorrow of the relevant pages of their WS.
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