You have been paying them in good faith, but now that you want to ask for a CCA and if they can't produce one, or if the one they produce isn't enforcable, then they have a problem - doesn't matter that you were paying them.

I agree with Enron. Please do not worry. I've had all those threatening letters with Bold letters and Final action written all over them but when I stayed firm on the truth (i.e. how much I can afford to pay them) they left me alone, passing the account back to NatWest. You do need to reply to their letters but be firm. In this case, you would refer to your recorder delivery letter and insist you they reply to that. Also, check out if you do indeed need to repay this amount, as Enron suggests - maybe the charges are unlawful.

Don't apologise for taking the loan. Most of us have been there and done that. Also, lending organisations invented this game, so they are aware of the risks. My opinion is that they do a very bad job at credit rating and take big risks - they should have known better. For exampe, I had banks keep offering me credit cards when I already had missed a number of payments and my credit rating was already affected. For advice on the matters you mention you can also visit: National Debtline – Free, Confidential Debt Advice – Call 0808 808 4000 CCCS - Free Debt Advice from the UK's Leading Debt Charity For example, taken from CCCS's FAQ page: What if they're threatening to send debt collectors to my house? It is important to understand that debt collectors are not the same as bailiffs. Unlike bailiffs, debt collectors cannot take any direct action against you other than asking you to pay. Few debts are recovered by debt collectors as it is expensive for the creditor. If a collector does call, make an offer of payment and give them a copy of your budget. Smaller regular payments are more effective than larger ones that you can't keep up. If the collector demands a higher payment than you can afford, be firm about the offer you've made. Ask the collector to accept payments by post if this would be better for you than paying at the door. My comment: avoid paying at the door and refuse to arrange a meeting at your home. If they contact your landlord or send a letter addressed "to the occupier" or some rubbish like that that your landloard may read, then you have to complain to the OFT. Insist that all your communication will be only in writing from now on as you want to keep an accurate record or what is said and done (plus it's your legal right).

Well done to your husband - he did the right thing! If they take you to court you will not be paying more than the 30 you say you can afford. However, as I've mentioned in these forums earlier, they might need to see an income and expenditure form (budget) and a list of creditors to believe what you say. Otherwise, they always try to squeeze as much as they can from you. Also, I would never deal on the phone with them - only in writing. By the way, even if you had another card and you were able to pay them with that before the incapacity benefit comes through, I would still not recommend it. And actually if they asked you to pay credit with credit, then you could report them to the OFT.

I don't know if this is possible, but assuming they are calling you from a number that is not withheld is it possible to automatically redirect their lines to another number like a voicemail number or directly to the OFT!

In my case Triton shows their ugly face only when my periodic updates to NatWest are due (i.e. once every year or every six months)... but yours is not due till October... maybe they are too eager to try their nasty stuff. Don't accept their calls and wait for a letter. Instuct whoever answers the phone to tell them to write instead.

Precisely, DUBLIN GAL. Some really disturbed people must work for those companies - with a lot of psychological problems! The only reason they do it is that it works. People that unfortunately don't know their legal rights, have no idea where to turn for help, and are not aware of these forums, end up getting pressured and pay more that they can afford to pay, ending up in even more trouble. They treat us like criminals, whereas they are behaving like criminals! Remember it is not a crime to owe money. It is how the credit industry works. Unfortunately, at times things get out of hand and we can't afford to pay as we'd like to for some period of time because of how our circumstances change... but that does not make us criminals! Also, remember how all these financial experts and institutions manage to screw up entire economies. So what if you mess up with one account of just 2000 or so? By the way, in my experience, the more you owe them the better! It's the ones I owe around 1K that are the most nasty and one account with 10K or so they have been very nice about - go figure! It's like someone famous one said (can't remember who): if you owe a bank 100 pounds it is your problem, if you owe them thousands it is their problem!!

(moving this also from the previous forum) ...and to continue from above, if you feel that they keep writing to you and calling you, without giving you time to respond write something to them as shown below. This would also apply in the case where they send you a letter saying "you have 10 days to reply" and then send you a further letter within 7 days, before waiting for your reply!!!! Do not accept this type of pressure. Contacting debtors frequently is an unfair practice according to the OFT Debt Collection Guidance section which states: “Putting pressure on debtors or third parties is considered to be oppressive.”

(moved my 2nd post below to the correct forum http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/debt-collection-industry/214234-re-dublin-gal-triton.html - don't know how to delete this). ...and to continue from above, if you feel that they keep writing to you and calling you, without giving you time to respond write something to them as shown below. This would also apply in the case where they send you a letter saying "you have 10 days to reply" and then send you a further letter within 7 days, before waiting for your reply!!!! Do not accept this type of pressure. Contacting debtors frequently is an unfair practice according to the OFT Debt Collection Guidance section which states: “Putting pressure on debtors or third parties is considered to be oppressive.”

Do not alarm yourself by those bullies. They really use nasty tactics. I also never call any debt collectors - write to them instead (so you also have proof of what you said). On the phone they are trained to cause you maximum psychological pain. You are not doing anything illegal. If 150 pm is the maximum you can afford to pay, then pay them 140 pm, as you might need some money for something you haven't accounted for. If this goes to court (very unlikely) you will never be asked to pay more than you can afford. So here is a bit o law you may want to remind them about in your letter: "under the Office of Fair Trading (OFT) Debt Collection Guidance on harassment, creditors are warned that it is considered unfair pressuring a debtor to pay in full or in large instalments they cannot afford." If they continue report them to the OFT! Also, if you haven't done this already, please send them a CCA request letter (see forums for details or ask). Until they provide you with a true and valid copy of your credit agreement they are unable to pursue your debt any further. Check the forums, or go to the online websites of National Debtline, CCCS, etc. Your bank is probably NatWest or RBS - Triton is used (they are in the same building) as an ugly face of those companies. When they want to use questionable tactics they use Triton. However, every single time I had a letter from them I've managed to scare them off. So please do not worry. They are a barking dog chained by the law. They bark that they will do this or that, but in order to actually do those things you would have to have never offered them a monthy repayment, they would have taken you to court AND you would have failed to keep up with the court payments (of the amount you said you could afford to pay). Then only they could go further... BUT nothing as such has happened yet. You are offering them a REASONABLE amount monthly and they are just being bullies. Do not accept this. They should be the ones that cry when we call them because we know our legal rights! It is a shame I am currently travelling and don't have internet access all the time, but I'm sure others here can help. Also, when offering a monthly repayment is it usually only accepted if you've given them a budget sheet of income and expenditure and a list of all your creditors. Go also here: National Debtline – Free, Confidential Debt Advice – Call 0808 808 4000 for a full information pack on how to do this, sample letters, and email support. Or go to CCCS - Free Debt Advice from the UK's Leading Debt Charity to have them do this for you for free. If you feel you need more time, do send them a CCA request (gives you at least a couple of weeks time or forever if they can't find your agreement - it does happen!), AND you can also say that you need a couple of weeks to provide them with a financial evaluation.

I never call or answer calls by DCA. I always write to them and tell them that I want them to do the same. For example you might want to modify the following: It is my policy and legal right to never contact anyone regarding a financial matter by telephone, but instead communicate in writing. This is done in order to have an accurate copy of what has been stated by both parties. It is much easier to refer back to a letter than to an audio recording. Also if they pester you often, overwhelming you with calls and letters, before giving you a reasonable time to reply, then remind them: I am reminding you that contacting debtors frequently isan unfair practice according to the OFT Debt Collection Guidance section which states: “Putting pressure on debtors or third parties is considered to be oppressive.”

Hi to all, I've been away for over a month and I see a lot of activity in this (Triton) forum! Well, I sent a formal complaint to them, listing about a dozen things they've done or said in their letters that could be considered harassment (e.g. sending letters too frequently, threatening actions that do not apply, or would only apply after a court order AND if I failed to keep up with court repayments – whereas my repayments are monthly and regular for the last two years -, giving a premium number to call them, encouraging to pay the full balance with credit!, etc. etc.) They did not reply to my letter; instead it went back to NatWest – i.e. the office next-door – who said that they are forwarding my letters to yet another agency AIC! Anyone dealing with them? (I’ll check the forums later). So my accounts (loan and overdraft) are passed around like hot-potatoes. AIC wrote to me a very nice letter, followed by a nasty one a week later! I did not have time to reply to either; as I said above, I was away for a month. In any case, I had already sent before I left an update repayment offer to all my creditors including Triton/NatWest based on my latest circumstances, but a second recent letter from NatWest says that they have also just forwarded this to AIC. My guess (judging from the dates on the letters by NatWest) is that AIC had not yet received my new offers when they wrote their letters. Just to be safe, however, I will write a reply now. Meanwhile, NatWest was the only creditor that did not agree to freeze interest on my overdraft account, only the loan; this makes them the only creditor (out of 10!) that keep charging me interest for over two years of repayments. In fact, this made my debt continue to grow with them. I don’t know what the situation with overdraft interest is; however, this is unfair to the other creditors, as each time I do a revaluation of my situation and offer updated repayments, NatWest keeps getting a bigger share of the money (as I use the standard pro-rata calculation recommended by CCCS, NationalDebtLine, etc.), yet the other creditors, which have been decent, end up getting less and less repayments with each revaluation! I find this unfair, so I am wondering if I can claim all the interest back – maybe I will start another thread for this topic. Good news though is that AIC claims that they’ve stopped all interest in their first (nice) letter but not in the second one that talks about legal action and all that jazz. Best regards to all.

Magda hi, All my debts are pre-2006... I'm now CCA'ing all my creditors (before had only done this with the ones giving me trouble, i.e. Link, etc.). How do I know if an agreement is enforcable? Can you suggest the best place to start out. I've seen a couple of threads here but I find this bit quite confusing. Or, where can I find the relevant bits of the 'Act' regarding this? Many thanks, Harry

As a first step to resolving this, National Debtline offers the following example of a letter to creditors refusing your offer. 1 High Street, Newtown, Kent R21 4RH July 7, 2009 The Loan Company Company House, Church Street, Newtown, Kent, R1 7HG Dear Sir/Madam Account No: 4563210025897412 Thank you for your letter of 01-01-2002 concerning the above account. We are are sorry that you feel unable to accept the offer which we have made. The majority of our other creditors have accepted the offers made to them and we have commenced payments. We cannot offer you more because we can only afford £775 per month between all our other creditors, and it would be wrong to cease or reduce payments to our other creditors in favour of your company. The offer made to you is on a pro rata basis, as used by the county court. In the light of the other creditors agreeing to our repayment plan, please would you reconsider our offer. We will be making the payments in line with the offer to your company, on a weekly basis, as a gesture of goodwill. We look forward to hearing from you as soon as possible. Yours faithfully Mr A N Other (Note: personally, I don't like weekly repayments, only monthly ones, so you might modify that bit.)

Great! Keep us all posted when they reply to your CCA request letter. Best wishes, diharry

Glad I was able to help. Best regards, diharry

spurs71, please do not worry and take one step at a time. Triton's letters are scary but you are a human being with rights. Entire economies and countries mess up their finances. Zillions of projects go overbudget, fail, or companies go bankrupt. And they are all supposed to be overseen by financial experts! You are a decent woman that encountered life's difficulties. It happened to all of us. No one can blame you or treat you like a criminal, which is what some of the debt collectors appear to do. Remember, they cannot make you pay more than you can afford to pay and that's that! CCCS says so, National Debtline says so, CAG forums say so, and even the courts agree with this as well, ok, so no need to worry. So here are some steps: First, I'd recommend you send a CCA request letter, as in my earlier post above with the sample letter. This will buy you some time, as they can't do anything to you until they've satisfied your Credit Agreement Copy request. What's more, they might even be unable to provide a valid agreement anyway, in which case you will owe nothing. After they're provided a valid Copy of your Credit Agreement, then you can prepare a simple income and expenditure budget form which will demonstrate to them how much you can afford to repay them. This budget will include a list of all your creditors and the offers or repayments will be based on the amount you can afford to repay, divided in a pro rata fashion between your creditors. If you want more help with this step let me know. Offering Triton what you think you can afford (e.g. £5 a week) without a budget and a list of all your creditors will probably not convince them. Creditors need to see a picture of your situation to be empathetic. Then, if indeed you can only afford that amount, they can't force you to pay more. Even if they were to take you to court (if you do the above, I doubt it), the court would ask you to do the same thing. Even if you can only afford token payments, that's fine... but they need to have an idea of your income and expenditure. CCCS can even do the above for you for free. National Debtline provides a guide that explains everything, including sample budget sheets and letters. There is a lot if info out there. Now, if you're already done the above and they still refuse your offer, let me know. I don't whant to go on describing things that may not apply to your situation. Best wishes.

The following has worked for me.... Letter #8 in the forums is just more forceful with respect to some points. Mix and match as you see fit. You might also want to write on the back of the 1 pound cheque "to be used for CCA request only", as debt collectors are notorious for cashing those to decrease your debt. Cheers, Harry 1 High Street, Newtown, Kent R21 4RH June 29, 2009 The Loan Company Company House, Church Street, Newtown, Kent, R1 7HG Account No: 4563210025897412 Dear Sir/Madam With reference to the above agreement, I would be grateful if you would send me a copy of this credit agreement and a full breakdown of the account including any interest or charges applied. I understand that under the Consumer Credit Act 1974 [sections 77-79], I am entitled to receive a copy of any credit agreement and a statement of account on request. I enclose a payment of £1 which represents the fee payable under the Consumer Credit Act 1974. I understand a copy of any credit agreement along with a statement of account should be supplied within 12 working days. I understand that under the Consumer Credit Act 1974 creditors are unable to enforce an agreement if they fail to comply with the request for a copy of the agreement and statement of account under these sections of the Act. I look forward to hearing from you. Yours faithfully Mr A N Other

sorry coleman72, I'm with a laptop and no power (less than 15mins on the battery) as I'm travelling... I'll either reply to you tonight when I'll be back home, or else hopefully someone else can answer.

You can send it to Triton and most likely they will reply back saying that they've forwarded your request to Natwest, etc... and will get back to you. This almost certainly means that it will take more than the 12 days... but that is their problem. So you might say, why don't I send it directly to NatWest... but it's best to send it to the people chasing you about it, and in this case it is Triton. If you sent it directly to NatWest they may continue to send you threatening letters, without knowing that you'we requested a CCA. Ask them in the letter if they now own the debt, but I doubt it. Triton is used by RBS or NatWest to apply pressure on you. They are usually acting on behalf of them. But check the first letter they sent you, they sometimes say that they are acting on behalf of their clients, Natwest.

TRITON Credit Services, PO Box 183 Telford TF2 2BU ENGLAND has worked for me before, unless others know of an non PO Box address.

Yes the fee is £1.00 for cca request and this also covers if you request a Statement of Account at the same time... otherwise an extra pound for the SOA. I've send CCA requests where I've asked something else as well, so no problem there.

Join the club coleman72, Triton can sound threatening with their letter, listing a number of horrible things they "may" do to you, and some of their letters can be considered harassment. Did you already have an arrangement with NatWest, or is this the first time you're having difficulties with your account and they passed it on to Triton? (by the way they are in the same building, NatWest, Mint, RBS and Triton - officially an RBS company). Whatever your situation it is advisable to do as you say. Send them a CCA request letter. Go to the following link in these forums which has a bunch of letters regarding creditors: The Consumer Forums - Debt collectors Click on letter number 8, i.e. "CCA Request Letter". Another example of a letter and additional legal information can be found in the National Debtline site: National Debtline England & Wales | Debt Advice | Factsheet Getting A Copy Of Your Credit Agreement And Account Details The above should be enough to get you started.

Join the club sharmal! I'm in a rush today, so hopefully someone else can give you better advice. I just want to make some points relating to what you said: - Well done, telling them to write to you. If they continue to harrass you by phone, write to them about it. There is useful info here in various places, and also here: National Debtline England & Wales | Debt Advice | Factsheet 03 Harassment - Someone should be able to advise you from here about what to do with the charges of £236 - Regarding your home here is some info from CCCS that I could find about this. If I read this correctly your home should be safe, as you haven't signed the mortgage: Am I liable for my partner's debts? If two people jointly enter into a credit agreement, they are both liable for the whole amount of the debt. This is known as 'joint and several liability'. For an agreement to be joint and several, it must be signed by all parties in the form required by the Consumer Credit Act. So, if you have not signed such an agreement, you are not liable for your partner's debts. However, joint and several liability can also apply to rent arrears on joint tenancies, or arrears on joint mortgages, to council tax payments for couples and to water/sewerage charges on properties which are jointly occupied. You need to talk to the individual creditor to obtain a clear understanding of the liability for the debt. Hope this helps a bit.

Agree with both responses above. DO NOT PAY THEM UNLESS THEY ARE ABLE TO PRODUCE A VALID CCA. This is your LEGAL RIGHT. They are now in DEFAULT. This is not just an opinion of people in the CAG, this is the LAW. Check it out in other places that offer debt advice like National Debtline: National Debtline England & Wales | Debt Advice | Factsheet Getting A Copy Of Your Credit Agreement And Account Details