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  1. Well done Tech Monster Don't forget to check the files at the credit reference agencies in a week or two's time to MAKE SURE it has all been removed
  2. So are you saying go to the ICO first and forget about speaking with the bank? Remember that although I now have SAR data I have not had a final response to my complaint. That will only come if I write at least once more to them If you are suggesting I go straight to the ICO now will the fact I have not yet had a final response from the bank go against me? And should my approach to the ICO be a complaint or an enquiry?
  3. Thanks for that. I think I'll finalise matters with the bank first and warn them that will be my next step if they do not voluntarily remove the data Do you think it would be relevant to make that letter to the bank a formal Section 10 notice (to stop processing data immediately but for the 1995-1998 data only) or do you think that would be an incorrect application of the section?
  4. UPDATE: More advice needed from the experts here, please To summarise the situation, a current account was opened with bank in 2008 whilst a previous account with same bank, but different branch, had been opened but was closed in 1998. Bank computers show only brief "notes", which are largely meaningless as far as detail is concerned, dating from 1995 to 1998 when account was closed and indicate that the bank had to write off two large sums of money. What little detail is showing is disputed but bank can not provide full details under a SAR as too long a time has elapsed and full data has been deleted The essential problem is twofold: 1. Bank cannot prove their notes are accurate (which they are not) 2. Bank refuse to allow credit and appear to be using this 1995-1998 data as a basis for that, although they protest that they are not using that data in their credit decision making (even though they seem to contradict themselves and acknowledge they use it as an "insight") My task is to get the bank to DELETE the data noted between 1995 and 1998 as it has no relationship to the new account opened in 2008 and holding such data would appear to contravene the Data Protection Act principle 5 "Personal data processed for any purpose or purposes shall not be kept for longer than is necessary for that purpose or those purposes". In this case, whatever happened between 1995 and 1998 should not have been held for ten years unless it included FULL details which could be properly challenged, including any signed CCAs and T&Cs etc. A new account opened in 2008 should not have this kind of cryptic (and innacurate) adverse data attached to it as it seems to be irrelevant So far we have almost exhausted the bank's complaints procedure and have completed the SAR, which proves the absence of the full facts Can anyone suggest the next step for getting the situation resolved with the bank and getting this data deleted?
  5. . Have a look again at what you say they have written to you It does NOT say they will not provide a copy of the agreement, it says they do not provide statements as a matter of course unless you ask for them and then asks you to clarify for them if you would like to receive such statements. I would suggest you write back and simply say "yes, please include statements" and say again in that letter you also require a true copy of the agreement They appear, on the face of it, to be co-operating not obstructing and you have simply misunderstood their letter
  6. What they are doing is not legal. Forget the Subject Access Request as it is not relevant, just go for the Statute Barred letter which also insists they stop processing your data illegally Once you have informed Paragon that the alleged debt is statute barred and that you will not be paying it they must stop processing your data. If they do not stop then follow through with a formal complaint to Paragon using their complaints procedure, then take it to the Financial Ombudsman to resolve if you get a final response that is not satisfactory Once you are at the final stages you should check your Equifax and Experian files again. If the data still shows then make complaints to those bodies and attach details of all correspondence between you, Paragon and the FOS
  7. Simple logic suggests that it is unlikely to go to court. If they had proof of the debt and if it was worth their while to take court action then they would have probably done that long ago Strictly speaking, while you are disputing the debt they cannot take court action. They could register a default, which would have to be registered with the original default date so it would drop off your file in another year's time anyway, but even that is unlikely to happen if they cannot prove the debt. Are you sure, though, that your credit file does not already show this as a default? If it does it may be possible to get it removed, depending on whether there was any proof the debt existed. No proof, no debt, no default
  8. In the first place, try to stop worrying and under no circumstances admit liability You say you have not attended the university since 2005. This suggests that any fees that may have been outstanding are now coming up to 5 years old. Work out exactly the amount of time that has elapsed since you paid the instalment for that year's academic fees and start counting the years from that point. If 5 years has already gone by then any alledged debt is already time barred under Scottish law and can not be taken to court If already time barred, that becomes an absolute defence. If not yet time barred then delaying them for the remaining months until it is is essential. If you admit the debt in any way, you could start the clock ticking again I would suggest writing and asking for more details on why they think you owe money, but don't give any information to them. Normally you would go the route of asking for the consumer credit agreement and then, possibly, doing a subject access request but I doubt these would be helpful for university fees so you may have to compose a suitable letter yourself. Hopefully someone else here will have specific experience of this kind of debt and will be able to advise you more fully on the exact action to take and/or wording to use
  9. Thanks. Just spent the last hour going through the Data Protection Act On first glance through it appears they might be breaking one of the principles "Personal data processed for any purpose or purposes shall not be kept for longer than is necessary for that purpose or those purposes. ." That would seem to suggest the data, whether accurate or not, should not be kept for long periods (e.g. over 6 years) and there is another bit in the act about not allowing automated systems to automatically reject you from credit (which is clearly what they are doing) As I still have around 6 weeks left to challenge their final decision on my complaint I think I already have enough to make life uncomfortable for them. Basically I'm moving my money out to the new bank anyway so they won't get my business but I will pursue them for breaches of the act and possibly seek damages and distress as well. They have really annoyed me with the fudging and almost blatant lies - I'm guessing they know they're being a bit shady with this So, armed with a few data protection clauses, a SAR including a request for true copies of the agreements (i.e. prove these agreements exist) and I should have them. Let's hope, for their sake, they keep copies of agreements going back that amount of time
  10. One thing that does occur to me is whether the SAR will actually work given that the adverse data does not refer to the account in question. If I SAR them using my account details, are they then obliged to provide me with all data held against my name or only recent data relating specifically to the two year old account?
  11. Which it certainly isn't but that may be difficult to establish Perhaps a fuller explanation will help you to see the problem. After 2 years of running the account as a second account I wanted to switch it to main account use. I then discovered, after being turned down for a cheque guarantee card, small overdraft and credit card that I was barred from any credit whatsoever. I was told that there was adverse data on their computer. I then made a formal complaint as my credit files are absolutely clear. The bank responded with these words: "Your application does not successfully pass our credit score." "On this occasion the bank did not conduct a search at credit reference agencies but used our internal credit scoring system, which I regret I am unable to give you a specific reason as to why your application has been declined." "I regret that your account does not carry the weight we would need to overturn the credit scoring result." "you will be welcome to reapply to us in six months time." It's the sort of final response to a complaint that suggests I simply failed on credit scoring but with an excellent credit rating and a large amount of money going in and out the account in the previous six months it does not add up. When I made the complaint I said I had been told that there was adverse data on their computer about me and that if that was the reason for declining me I wanted to know what the data was so that I could challenge it. Their response, though, gives the impression there is NO adverse data When I went into the bank today I actually saw the data about them writing off two debts in 1998, ten years before I even opened the account there, and I was told that was the real reason for being declined. It's really quite dishonest of them don't you think? The real problem here is that I can see from the branch computer the data exists but they are unable to expand on it. When I complain to head office they simply fudge and give inaccurate and misleading information and denials. I'm also not even sure whether I can SAR them here in Scotland or whether the law is different
  12. I've already thought of that and may consider doing so, although I'm then potentially in the situation of having to disprove the data which is difficult to do when you have no knowledge or record of it. It would also cost me £10 I believe. However, as I say, I may do that in due course but it's not really about "what" the data is rather about whether it should be on the computer at all if it is twelve years old What I'm really trying to establish now is the legality of holding on to the data and using it against me in any case, the "any" case being "even if it was correct". I hope you follow my reasoning here, which is that I like to know all of my rights before I start fighting I only opened the account with them two years ago so data from 1998 is clearly not related to this account in this branch and their refusal to offer me any credit rated product, despite my excellent credit rating, is not only irritating and offensive but it has also wasted a lot of my time and cost me money. It has operated the last two years as a second account, my main account being elsewhere with Santander who appear to be getting worse as far as customer service goes. I wanted to move everything away from Santander just before Christmas but it has taken until now to discover this rather strange data exists. I have effectively solved the problem by opening a new account with a third bank where I am getting full facilities but this historic adverse data will not be left lying as it is
  13. I'm reading between the lines on this one and what I am reading is that these accounts were in your mother's name, not yours Any account that was solely in her name does not have to be repaid by you. I am hoping that maybe the BT bill was in her name as well, which means you would not be responsible for paying it
  14. Here's an interesting question, if anyone knows the answer How long can banks keep on their computers historic adverse data and use that data in credit lending decisions? The background to the question is that after being turned down for overdraft and credit card by my bank and after making a formal complaint that they were holding adverse data against me on their computers, which they denied in a way that is non committal, I finally saw on their branch computer that they think they wrote off a current account and a loan of mine in 1998. I was only able to see the basic reference on their computer whilst in their branch today and could not get any more details than what I've just said. I have no recollection of that date and those events but clearly I cannot challenge the details effectively whilst they are witholding the full information from me and in denial at head office that such data exists Regardless of the accuracy or not of the data it does seem to me to be suspect that they should have a legal right to use data that is supposedly 12 or more years old and not disclose to me that they are relying on that data to make lending decisions Anyone with a knowledge of the legal position regarding the permissability of the data?
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