When Aktiv don't supply the documentation you asked for within 14 days of you posting it (excluding weekends)

send then the Account in Dispute letter .

That will cover you for stopping the direct debit payments,

until they send you a correct copy of the agreement and a minimum of the terms and condtions relating to the time the account was opened, and a current set.

It's a very bad idea to trust a DCA with a direct debit payment facility by the way.

Stubumbles

You're entitled to check Westcott have the legal paperwork for them to have payment of this agreement decided by a court. You need to write to the legal firm reperesenting Westcotts and say as this is now a court case you urgently require a copy of the CCA document , Default Notice, and Copy of Assignemnt. You're entitled to these documents to construct a defence together and they have 14 days to produce them. Send Westcotts a copy of this letter and send them by recorded delivery.

There are load of threads on here where Goldfish have been unable to produce copies of the CCA as they've been lost. They sold their accounts to Barclaycard a couple of years ago., and if Westcott bought your account back in 2002 they might be aunabl;e to get hold of a copy, as so much time has passed since it was sold.

Without it they will have a difficult time winning this case, unless you allow them to get it by default or admission. I think you can ask the court for more time to construct a defence if they dont produce it, and Westcott may actually withdraw their case. After all this time they are probably banking on winning this case by default. Meantime go over to the Legal section and start reading some threads on defences other people have written.

You can look for other Goldfish threads by using the search button on the top of the page. type in Goldfish and all the related threads will appear. Takes a bit of time but you'll get there.

They did send me the T&C's under seperate cover, but they are not contained within one document, although I don't think that makes any difference now.

Do the terms and conditions they sent you look correct for the time you opened the account? ie correct year and bank etc. When I asked Cabot to supply T&C's for an alleged Morgan Stanley account they sent a single page of T&C's from Barclaycard dated 2005. At that time Goldfish would have owned the account.

If your SAR provides or you still have your opening statments you can check if the interest rate in the terms is the same as what was applied to your account.?

Do they say anywhere that interest can continue to be applied?

thanks for the quick response, it is definatly not on my/or his credit file. would MBNA still have the records for this debt? What sort of letter should I be sending to the DCA??

MBNA produced an application form but no t&cs for an alleged agreement of mine from late 90's

4 years after they sold it outright to a DCA.

But if they sold your account 9 or 10 years ago they might have lost it by now.

Do you know if your agreement was totally sold or just assigned to the DCA for collection.

Did you get a default notice or account termintation letter from MBNA?

Normally a SAR would go to the original creditor MBNA,

but if they sold it outright 10 years ago not sure what you'd get from MBNA.

DX or Citizen can advise better on this.

Are you able to say who the DCA is.

Link by any chance?

I'd send the DCA a CCA request .

If they can't supply it within 14 days or so you can write and put the account in dispute and stop payments .

There's a letter in the templates library.

Send it by recorded delivery and keep your proof of posting receipt.

Has the DCA been sending you a minimum of annual statements,

showing all this interest being added. ?

AFAIK DCA's can't legally add interest onto accounts they've bought unless the original terms of the agreement allowed it, and most taken out back then didn't.

I agree there's no point in making reduced payments to a defalulted debt account if interest is being added.

It's totally outrageous, and just highlights the despicable greed of this grubby industry.

DC100x when you say written off by the OC, what does that mean? And why does that influence whether a DCA would take a case to court or not ?

Just asking because I have 2 accounts I've put in dispute and relevant DCA's have offered several discounts , but they've not quite reached the SB stage.

thanks

My personal experience was CCCS won't stop payment to a creditor, so you'll have to set up your own DMP if there's any creditors you decide to pay. CCCS should give bank sort codes for each creditor etc when you end your plan, enabling you to set up direct standing orders for accounts. That's what I did and I didn't inform creditors of the change from CCCS.

I'd agree there's no point in making reduced payments where interest and charges continue. I'd prefer to be taken to court for them, at least a judge is likely to stop further interest if you request in your court case. As long as the amount is less than £5000 I think.

I say I think as I picked up most of my info back in 2008 on this site. Having returned recently after a fairly long absence the whole approach to things seems to have changed, and not all for the better I fear.

Follow Priority Ones advice, it's sound and covers all your options.

See someone else has asked the same question in the Barclaycards forum on whether Cabot can legally add interest to an account they've bought which hasn't been defaulted. The standard Barclaycard letter sent out says interest will remain stopped for 6 months after which Cabot will review it agree the monthly payment.

According to the ICO, to maintain information being standard etc, defaults should be registered within 6 months of the contract breaking down, eg full payments not being made or terms changed eg removal of credit facility etc. Now how can Barclaycards say this contact didn't break down being paid at tiny fraction of the minimum for 10 years?

What happened to the unlawful recission question which used to be discussed on these forums,. Before an account was sold to a DCA it had to be defaulted as Cabot couldn't fulfill the credit card contract conditions to a consumer, which meant the contract terms were broken at point of sale. They have a licence to give out credit but they don't issue credit cards. This will be why Cabot are issuing look alike monthly statements and avoiding asking for the full balance.

If as the Brigadier has said this is a new trend, accounts not being defaulted and sold on to DCA's like Cabot , who can then legally resume full interest and the rest then DCA's have won the lottery.

If this is possible , one thing's clear, there's is no point in making any reduced payments to a debt until it's been defaulted . Only then can someone be sure no further interest is added, unless a judge decides otherwise. Because the way this looks to me is if Cabot can legally resume full interest I've wasted my time payiong anything for the past 10 years and will very shortly be back at the balance I started at, as well as having a nice new shiny default on my record. .

Something doesn't seem right about this?

Interest is only payable if awarded by the judge in the decree, and would be shown on it somehwre as payable. But I also thought I'd always read on CAG interest was normally only granted if the amount the creditor claimed for was more than £5000 for consumer related agreements?

This is different from the normal Cabot debt collection letter Brigadier. This is a normal monthly credit card statement they've sent. It shows interest rates, how payments paid are first deducted from cash withdrawals and then from purchases, etc etc, as if it has been sent from Barclaycard, or another bank.

In effect Cabot are acting as if this account has been sold not as a defaulted account to a debt collection agency , but a running live credit card account from one bank to another bank. If a credit account has been defaulted and sold on no more interest or charges can be legally added. A running live account which hasn't been defaulted can have normal interest re-instated at any time as well as charges, underpayment and late payment fees at any time at the discretion of the bank.Which is why I said there was no point in me having made reduced payments for all these years, because Cabot is just going to shove it all back on again.

Any default would have dropped off years ago , and it wouldn't stop Cabot adding another one anyway.

Cabot recently bought a load of Barclaycard accounts including one I've been making reduced payments to for over 6 years..

Instead of the usual Cabot letter saying contact us to make arrangements to pay this total outstanding amount blah blah , Cabot have sent what 'appears; to be a monthly credit card statement , with things like how payments are allocated etc etc as if to indicate this is still a live credit card account and not a defaulted debt account from many years ago. So long ago any Barcalycard default would have dropped off my account years ago.

I know Cabot have a Consumer Credit Licence, but do Cabot give out credit cards to the general public - I think not, so why are they doing this.?

I can only surmise that in a few months they are going to try adding a shedload of interest back onto this account, and then default it all over again in which case I wish I'd never paid a penny to it, because there was no point.

Would have thought Amex would default your account back in 2006 when you stopped paying. As far as I'm aware after registering a Default they can't add any further interest or charges as the account has been terminated. So the amount increasing from £3000 to £7000 over the past 5 years definitely sounds wrong to me..

You'll be able to find this out from your SAR, but hopefully it will have reached the SB stage anyway.

Tesco finance is also RBS. I've had to cut my reduced repayments to RBS + Tesco several times over the years, and haven't had any problems so far. If you don't have the money , you don't have it. but would try to send them something even if it's just £5 or £1 to keep a monthly payment going. I used to send creditors a new income/expenditure sheet when I reduced the payments but now I just reduce the payments, and ignore the automated letters asking me to phone them unless they're beginning to look serious.

Cabot need to confirm they're speaking to the right person which is why they keep asking you to confirm your personal details first. I'd wait until they write to you before making any contact and even then I'd advise taking advice from this forum before contacting them. After all this matter may have nothing to do with you.

They use a number of different numbers on automated diallers, so keep blocking the numbers. Can post some up for you but think there's a list somewhere on this site.

My experience of Cabot is that it doesn't matter what you tell them by letter, email or phone, they either ignore it, or send a letter full misleading information from their wonderful NOT customer compliance team. and continue to send out automated letters and make numerous calls, all requesting payments and that you phone them...

A Truecall machine which blocks nuisance calls is the answer they're not cheap but wonderful. Even so it can take Cabot months of non stop calls from umpteen numbers which Truecall blocks every time to realise it's costing them money to achieve nothing and stop calling.

Big Debtor, I would wait and see what they send you next. the least someone can reasonably expect in a letter saying they owe money is where the debt originates from. Without that its's only fit for the bin. Been dealing with them for a couple of years now. They deal with thousands of accounts and yours is just one of many they are chasing. They are a big machine and don't normally turn round fast. Unless you owe a very large amount its unlikely they'll move fast, as they'll need to use a Scottish legal firm and that eats into their profits, especially if you defend.

Cheaper for them to try and use their traditional means of persuasion by bombarding your phone with calls every day from different phone numbers. Don't speak or answer the phone calls ever.

I used to send out I&E forms each year to crediotrs I still pay. Now I refuse to fill them in or send them, I ignore their review letters requesting me to contact them to discuss increasing my repayment offer, and Truecall blocks any of their begging calls. Every year I work out how much I can afford and just send it. No one has taken me to court yet about this, and the payments I make have reduced substantially over the past few years. MY OH who works in the private sector hasn't had a pay increase in over 3 years and during that time price of food and utility etc petrol has greatly increased. DCA's need to be kept in their place which is at the very bottom of the pile.

The debt has increased to over 9k from a 5k default balance as per experian.

 

Unless your original agreement with MS allowed for interest being added after default (and its doubtful it did)then HFO aren't entitled to collect any addtional interest.

Does anyone know if HFO have a credit licence or just a debt collectors licence?.

Also to comply with your CCA request then they must send you a copy of the original terms and conditions at the time your agreement was taken out together with any subsequent variations. As far as I am aware the recent high court jusgements/rulings on s77/78 requests confirms this , although DCA's and creditors tend to conveniently forget this part.

Miss Muppet asked if you received a Default Notice under S87 and also to post up a copy of the so called agreement they have sent you minus any personal info. Would be helpful if you did this, plus the threatening letter, so people can advise further.

,

Looks to me like someone has copied those Financial terms from what was originally a card carrier sent out with their shiny new cards. First patagraph on the 2nd page says the definitions and other terms are set out in your 'enclosed' copy of the Providian terms and conditions'.

They don't 'enclose' terms and conditions on Reply Card Applications , so can't see them having been on the application card you sent back.

I continued the monthly payments to them and they wrote saying interest was suspended if payments were maintained....I may have missed one ot two along the way but only by the occasional date overlapping etc..but regardless.

 

If your account has been defaulted and terminated then no futher interest can be added, unless as VJon said the agreement you had allowed for this, or a Judge in deciding a case awarded them interest and normally they don't if its less than £5000 I think. Most credit agreements didn't, allow for interest to accrue after default.

I've seen some threads about more recent GE Capital accounts where this did form part of the agreement, but obviously yours at 14 years old isn't one of these.

They can add as much interest on paper as they like but it doesn't mean they will ever get it. Seems to be a habit of theirs on reading other Cabot threads. Makes me wonder if the reason for it , is that it inflates their book value and makes them look a better bet when seeking future investment allegedly;)

If they don't come up with your agreement they aren't going to get paid anything never mind their imaginary interest. Strangely Cabot haven't added 1 penny to my OH's alleged and disputed account. But they've done a whole load of other strange and wonderful things:eek:.

One day Cabot will disappear up its own derriere and what a nicer world it will be.

Fred,

I have similiar case where Goldfish sold without a DN. Cabot admit at the time they bought it , goldfish had not issued a default. 2 years later Cabot issued a DN in ther own right, altho its questionable.

On reading some threads on the legal forum it seems to be the opinion that if a DCA has a Credit licence and Cabot do, then they can buy undefaulted accounts.

If this is correct, then it opens a can of worms as Cabot definitely don't administer these accounts in the same manner as the original lender would a live account. And they don't provide any credit facilites obviously. I'm still trying to look into this, but information is thin on the ground., or may be I'm not looking in the right place.

But before Cabot can issue you with court papers they would have to send you a DN in their name. At that point they will hopefully screw up and ypou can add that to your defence along with the unenforceable agreement they have supplied you with.

I'd just leave them to it, they must have a barrel load of unpaying accounts to chase, and the clock is always ticking.

.

 

 

 

The other thing is, if they do this, will it still be acruing interest until it becomes the full value of our home and they take it away?

 

Please please help

 

LB

Interest only accrues after judgement if the judge awarded it. If so it will say on your judgement paperwork from the court. You only mention that they were awarded a total of balance and costs?.

You should also get notification prior to the final CO order hearing date, where you will get a chance to defend.

Forced sale is not legally impossible but very unlikely particularly when your property is jointly owned but the judgement is in your name only.

As for the restricting effects on CO's/restirctions on the future sale of your home,there was a thread on here recently about this with a link to this subject on another well known forum run by ML. Can't post a link but you may find it using a search of 'Charging Order? The myth '. Don't know how legally correct it is but makes for interesting reading.

Good Luck

Asked for copy of loan agreeement and terms and conditions at time loan was taken out. they have sent copy of agreement but no terms and conditions.

2 questions

In the prescribed terms they quote an APR interest rate of 10.4% only. They have then taken 10.4% of the loan amount and front loaded the total interest onto the loan. Is that correct, and does it meet the criteria for being a proper prescribed term?

The figure had been reducing from the overall total, but all of a sudden last year they whacked another £1500 onto it as what can only be additional interest. This means that my reduced repayments over the past 4 years have been wiped out in a single stroke. How can this be correct when they have already front loaded the total interest at the strt of the loan?

Can I put this account into dispute as they have not supplied the original terms and conditions which would allow me to check whether they can just whack addtional interest on then they feel like it.

thanks

V.W

When I first got into difficulty with paying a Cap one account, and didn't know any better about my rights, they wouldn't stop interest and default charges and allow me a repayment plan until I provided a doctors letter proving my ill health.:mad: Cost me £35 for the report, it should have been £60 but my GP knew I was in financial difficulty.

After I found CAG I sent off for my CCA, and all they came back with was an unenforceable application form, so I put the account in dispute and stopped paying them altogether.

That was 2 years ago, they eventually passed the account to Lowells, who have just written to me and said that due to the length of time since the account was opened Cap One can no longer find the paperwork so Lowell have closed the file and I won't hear anymore from them, unless Cap One eventually find the agreeement.:grin::grin:

I definitely wouldn't be send them any personal info and certainly not bank statements. It does no harm to ask for your agreeement. You never know they might not be able find yours either.

As far as I am aware, if it is for a credit card where the terms have been varied over the years, they have to send the orignal terms and also a copy of all varied terms as well.

Unfortunately many creditors and DCA's seem to conveniently forget this and hope we won't notice, particularly Barclaycard allegedly.

Just read Mr Carpenters comments on the 'Whats wrong with the Consumer Action Group' thread on Credit today.

In one post he questions the effect of what would happen if a vulnerable person had their life affected by reading 'poor' or 'bad advice' on CAG and being silly enough to act on it.

Course he doesn't mention the effect on vulnerable people taking the bull***t threats and bad advice dished out on a daily basis by DCA call centre threatmonkeys trying to earn a bigger monthly bonus. And its not just the odd rogue DCA, doing this as he would like to have us believe, some of the bigger DCA's are the worst culprits.

And before these credit today people totally disappear up their own sanctimonius ar*** bleating on about us bad debtors who are finally standing up for our legal rights they should remember that without debt there would be no money in supply. If everyone paid off their loans/debts tomorrow the global economy would come to an abrupt end.

Banks create loans on money they never had. Banks have always known a percentage of loans will default. It scientifically isn't possible for all the interest generated to be repaid ,due to the total global money supply and the way this totally corrupt financial system works.

They should be thanking us for the fact that when we all initially signed up for our shiny new credit cards and loans we generated billions of additonal interest for them, on money they never had to lend.

thanks:)