Yup - Sending positive thoughts your way! Mike

Well - I wrote back x2 limitation letters... Today, received 2 letters from them saying: BUT - and this may be a bit of help.. At the top left of the letters (prev and the these) there is what I assume to be the "document name".. On the last letters offering "pay just 15% to settle" the reference is "STBD2DEF" On these letters it is "CLOSBDEF" Now I wonder if - "STBD2DEF" means something like "Statutory Barred Debt to Default??" and "CLOSBDEF" means "Closed by Default?" Might be useful if we could compile a list of these codes, to see what sort of stage Lowell are at with everyone elses's debts?? Just a thought.. Do they have to expunge these accounts from her credit record now? Mike

Ok - Received a reply from Santander, waffling on that they would happily "remove your equipment" from the vehicle - At a cost of £250_ vat, and we would then be able to collect... Sol wrote back saying stop messing about, you have broken the law and are just trying to fudge the issue.. Santander replied to my Solicitor, as follows: Just a couple of problems here... They have admitted that the car was on the private driveway... So in the abscence of consent, a CourtOrder would have been needed. It was actually ME (MR GSMGuy) that answered the door and spoke to them, as Mrs GSMGuy was not at home, being at work some 20 miles away.. I explained this to them, and they still saw fit to speak to me.. It was ME that was coerced into handing over the keys - Whilst holding my 4 month old Son, and trying to keep an eye on the other 3 children. The property (our house) is actually in MY SOLE name, as Mrs GSM was not working at the time we bought the house, so it all went in my name, and as such the land registry entry is in my sole name also. When they took the car, it was ME that signed the condition form, not Mrs GSMGuy, because... She wasn't there, to give consent, permission, approval, grant entry or whatever they want to call it! So... I think they HAVE breached Section 92(1) of the Consumer Credit Act 1974. Have yet to speak to Solicitor (only just got letter) But I presume they have dropped themselves RIGHT in it... Wannabe, care to comment?? Mike

Yup, they didn't give YOU any leniency when they took your car, did they? Mike

Well, back in Frb 2009, I wrote to the two companies involved in this, sending them letters via RD.. Today, we have received (still in maiden name) two further letters from "RED" DCS, offering to "pay just 15% of the balance to close your account" I take it this is a final clutching at straws to make some money from the purchased debt, as they prob paid only a couple of % for them?? I intend to write back once more, quoting the previous letter, and enclosing copies of both it, and the letter received which caused me to respond in the first place - BUT add that I now consider this to be harassment in respect of a SB debt... Does this sound like a good idea? Shame I can't charge THEM £35 per letter.... Mike

Yes, it's this one: http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?293900-Help!-Car-repossessed-only-1-month-behind-not-received-Termination-letter../page3&p=3298307#post3298307 Mike

Sequenci, The agreement was in Mrs GSM's name, however - it was myself that was at home when the repo peeps turned up, they basically coerced me into giving them the keys - Mrs GSM had no idea they had even been until she got home that night - The point I am trying to confirm, is that I had no authority in effect to act, and by taking the keys from me, they still acted illegally as Mrs GSM did not give her consent .. If you know what I mean.. Just trying to head them off.. Mike

Excellent - Have just read that in full on this page here: http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1974/39/section/92 but can't find any mention of the "Third party bit?" Cheers Mike

Glad to see you got your ££ back - Just came across this thread whilst searching for something else.. You may also wish to keep an eye out for a Green skoda Octavia saloon - Private Hire Taxi, Registration number ******* Mike

Wannabedebtfreesoon, I am counting the days with you, having had a similar experience recently.. One question, can you point me in the direction where it says As Santander are trying to imply that as I "willingly" gave them the key - I didn't, I was coerced whilst holding my 5 month old, and trying to give dinner to the other 4 children, by threats of "recovery vehicles dragging it off your drive in front of your neighbours, and £500 charges for this and opening the car" That this counts as a "legal reposession" Whereas, in fact, Mrs GSM, whose name the agreement is in, was in fact at work, unaware and most certainly did not give her consent to the "repo" Cheers Mike

Well, my solicitor has spoken to them at length yesterday.. Now they seem to be taking a different route, saying that they are not happy that the car appears to have been used as a taxi (It is primarily used to transport the kids, but it is also plated, as it is my personal backup car in case the other is off the road) Solicitor told them that there is nothing in the hp agreement forbidding this, and if they check the mileage, they will see that the car has done only 7000 miles since May last year.. Hardly the sign of heavy use... They then countered that Mrs Gsm should always retain "custody and control of the vehicle" and, as such, I should not be using it for business purposes.. My solicitor told them this was rubbish, firstly, as husband and wife, we both use each others cars, secondly that merely leaving the car parked, or at the dealers for a service would put her in contravention of such a term.. Mike

Ok, Sol wrote to both of them (Santander and recovery Co) First thing they wanted, was a signed authority to act - Which was already included.. Now they say they need to speak with Mrs GSM on the phone - I have told her to refer them to the Solicitors, if it's anything other than a call to arrange rerurn of the car and contents. We are now £510 out of pocket with vehicle rental alone, and this will increase by £170 come Friday... Mike

Ok, just spoken to Solicitor, letters have gone out to both Santander and the repo agent yesterday, along with copies to me.. However, received today from DVLA, is a letter telling me they have had an application from a new keeper... I have phoned them and told them the car was taken without permission, and also given them the crime reference number. So it looks like Santander have gone ahead and sold our car along with our posessions and belongings too! Mike

Ok, Solicitor instructed, he's doing it foc, which is a relief. He had read through the agreement, and also all the correspondence received to date. He feels they have definitely breached the agreement, and as such is writing to them tonight.. Will post contents of letter once I get my faxed copy.. Mike

Well, well, well... Two letters from Santander received today; Letter dated 16th Feb, acknowledging our complaint and enclosing complaints procedure etc, inside a franked envelope with Santander logo on it - I have no idea HOW they have managed to mis-spell our surname, it must be on every screen of their system in relation to the agreement.. Another letter dated 2nd Feb - Which in fact IS a termination notice - Again posted in a Santander envelope WITHOUT any postage! It HAS been through the postal system though, as it bears the barcode imprint that the rest of todays mail has.. I suspect Santander are trying to cover their backs by issuing a Termination Notice AFTER they have reposessed the car. Does this sound strange to anyone else? I am going to get a Solicitors' advice - Friend of family, and gets a lot of work from me so will be FOC - Hopefully.. Mike

Mrs gsm has just had a missed call on her mobile, saying "please call santander on 0844 xxxxxx to arrange collection of your property and belongings from the vehicle before 5 pm today..." Firstly, how are we supposed to get to manchester with 5 children, as they are on half term holidays, to do so, and surely less than 2 hours notice is totally unacceptable, as I am out at work at the moment.. I am minded to fax or write, accepting their offer, and asking them to contact me me arrange a time for them to bring our car back here, so that I can remove the equipment in the same way I fitted it, ie my private garage.. I am unwilling and unable to travel to retrieve my property, and anyway, why should I, when they have taken it illegally? Also, plod have just been on, they reckon that it's not theft as "the original appropriation was not illegal ( my @rse!) And therefore santander believe they have a right to the property to offset against the debt" I explained that they had taken it from private property without a court order, which IS illegal, their response was.. Civil matter... Bloody waste of space..

Cheeky b@r steward of a repo man has just been back to house whilst I am at work, to return my sunglasses from the car. Mrs Gsm refused to sign his receipt... That was the first time he had ever seen her, as she was out when they took the car. So I can't wait until they try and say they had her permission to take it, as the agreement is in her sole name.. Mike

Ok, just spoken to "ebt Recovery Dept" she was very dismissive at first, until I pointed out, that after they "supposedly" sent out a DN (never received) on 07/01/11 - They went on to collect money via DD, AND write to us informing us of future payments and collection dates... She then said "This doesn't make sense to me, will pass you to Mgr" Mgr came on phone and said he would speak to collection agent re car - Came back and told me that they would "see if there is anyone capable of removing the equipment at the auction house" To which I replied - No chance, I want to remove it myself, I fitted it! I then informed Mgr to expect faxed and recorded delivery LBA, and he agreed to notate the account - Fax just gone, so off to the post office.... Mike

Just about to fax and post letter - BUT as car is now at auction - With my possessions... I wonder what will happen when they get the fax/letter. I am tempted to put into the letter that the recovery agent told me that it was at auction, and suggesting that they do something about it - NOW! Mike

Ok, Drafted this so far - As the agreement is actually in my Wife's name, I have included an "authority to act" paragraph.. Comments? Mike PS - Just had a call back from the recovery agent - Apparently the car has now been deposited at the Auction, COMPLETE with all of my equpment and posessions!!!!!

So, Letter before action, demanding return of car within seven days, or I will commence proceedings in the county court for return of vehicle, plus costs and compensation? Should I mention my equipment & belongings still being with the car, and their value, and also that I hold them liable for the safekeeping of those items? Mike

Cheers Surfer01 - Just waiting on a call back from TS - Have spoken to "Which Legal Services" and they advise writing to them, saying they have breached the contract due to their maladministration and trespass, and as such demand the car back within 7 days, after which I will issue in the small claims court, BUT what am I issueing for?? total amount paid to date under agreement is £4854.98, so am I after that much plus compensation, or suing for the return of the car? Mike

Will ring TS now - Just as an aside, been checking the payment dates etc, they are as follows: 01/11/10 Normal payment £368.33 made by DD - Account fully up to date, no previous payments late or missed. 01/12/10 1st payment missed. 17/12/10 Letter received, dated 14/12/10 advising of missed payment and late payment charge totalling £393.33 (not a DN). 24/12/10 Letter received, dated 21/12/10 reminding of overdue payment of £393.33 (not a DN) enclosing a new DDM, although still live on account. 03/01/11 Letter received, dated 31st Dec advising of late fee, and saying "Any amount that remains outstanding on or after 14th Jan will be collected via DD" - So we made sure there would be 2 payments plus fees available, as we knew thats what we owed. 10/01/11 Letter received, dated 07/01/11 saying they had not collected Jan 1st payment, making total £786.66 (2 x payments + 2 x late charges of £25) and enclosing yet another DDM, filled in and returned (2 DDM's now live on account). 11/01/11 Single monthly payment of £368.33 taken via one of the DD mandates funds were funds available for 2 payments plus the fees, so don't understand why they only took £368.33, when their letter dated 31st Jan said they would collect full amount. 18/01/11 Letter received dated 15th Jan advising arrears were £443.33, ie one payment plus 2 x £25 late fees. 24/01/11 Letter received, dated 21st Jan, exactly same as letter received 18th Jan, BUT now advising arrears of only £368.33 ie one month only also included, was yet another DDM saying please enclose a cheque for the o/s payment of £368.33 when you send back the DDM - Checked with bank, and they had TWO live DDM's for Santander, one of which had been used for the payment taken on 11/01/11! Did not send back the third DDM. 03/02/11 Letter received, dated 31st Jan again advising of late fees and again stating "Any amount that remains outstanding on or after 14th feb will be collected via DD" So once again, we made sure there were sufficient funds available. 10/02/11 Repo man turned up and took car from driveway. That's the story to date, with all the letters etc thrown in, just so that someone can clarify, if possible that they are definately in the wrong? Mike

Will check operation - When I eventually get a call back, just been onto Santander, their collections dept are refusing to speak to me now, saying the recovery agent are handling the account - Theu could not comprehend that, as the agreement is with them, then that is who I wish to speak to... Got a fax No for them though, and the postal address - Just about to draft up letter - Can anyone tell me the exact reference/section of the CCA that I need to quote re the illegal posession, and the fact that we did not receive a DN or terminsation notice AND that they took a payment AFTER the date they say they sent out a DN... Not going to claim jobseekers, have rented a car @ £170 per week, BUT it means that we cannot go anywhere as a family, as we need a seven seater, which ours was... Mike

Ok, just drafted this to fax over to the collection agents: Lets see if I get a call back.. Now to draft the letter to Santander.. Mike