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_Ray_

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  1. I hear what you're saying and it makes sense - I took my lead from ericbrother's suggestion in an earlier post...
  2. I haven't entered into any communication with anyone about this issue so far. I've been following the advice of ericsbrother, dx100uk, and yourself about ignoring everything until VCS's legal team get involved - which they have done today. So far from them I've received... 1. Original NTK from VCS dated 19/01/18 2. Final reminder from VCS dated 19/02/18 3. Today's 2 letters, one from VCS the other from BW Legal (as outlined in my earlier post).
  3. Good Morning, As promised an update of how this is progressing... Today I received 2 letters (attached), apologies for the poor quality, there's a problem with my phone's camera. I think there a legible though. The first is from Vehicle Control Services Ltd. telling me that as I have failed to pay them they have now handed it over to their legal representatives, BW Legal. The second letter (in the same envelope - not sure if that is relevant or not) is from BW Legal themselves saying I need to pay, otherwise they may commence legal proceedings. So now I write to them saying something along the lines of: "Dear BW Legal, Reference: xxxxxxxxx In reply to your letter sent on 15/03/2018. As you are aware, there has been no breach of contract between myself and VCS because there wasn't one offered to start with, therefore I owe nothing. I would further point out that this has been proven many times before which suggests you are merely trying to obtain money by deception. Regards" Is the wording strong enough/too strong? Any suggestions of changes to make would be greatly appreciated. I've made a small donation to the site today because I really appreciate all the help and advice I've received. Many thanks VCS to BWletter + bw chase letter march 2018.pdf
  4. Thanks for the advice, I will do that and update the thread when it all starts to kicks off
  5. Thanks for the replies, I'll update the thread as and when things start to get interesting
  6. Hi All, Received an Invoice from Vehicle Control Solutions for allegedly stopping in a no-stopping area on a private access road at Liverpool Airport - I was not the driver of the vehicle. I've read all the posts concerning VCS and no-stopping on private land at the airport and my understanding is I should ignore everything from them until their lawyers get involved. At that stage I should send them something along these lines... "Dear VCS, In reply to your letter sent on xx/xx/2018. There has been no breach of any contractual agreement therefore I owe you nothing. Regards" If it then proceeds to court I should come back here for further advice. Have I got that all right or have I missed anything? Thanks in advance 1 Date of the infringement 16/01/2018 2 Date on the NTK [this must have been received within 14 days from the 'offence' date] posted: 19/01/2018 3 Date received: 23/01/18. 4 Does the NTK mention schedule 4 of The Protections of Freedoms Act 2012? [y/n?] No 5 Is there any photographic evidence of the event? Yes 6 Have you appealed? {y/n?} No Have you had a response? [Y/N?] N/A 7 Who is the parking company? Vehicle Control Services 8. Where exactly [carpark name and town] Liverpool John Lennon airport. For either option, does it say which appeals body they operate under. IPC
  7. Didn't even realise that was an option. Do you have a link to anywhere on the forum I can find out what's involved and how to go about finding out if they have a case? Thanks again for all your help with this ericsbrother, wouldn't have been as easy to stick it out without all the help I've received here.
  8. Final Update... Sorry, been on holiday so forgot to update this thread as I promised to do. POPLA upheld this case so nothing to pay and received a letter from Parking Eye confirming they are no longer trying to extort any money! Thank you to everyone who helped out with advice, and my advice to anyone reading this in future in the same situation is DON'T be tempted to roll over for these sharks, it's well worth the effort to stand up to them. Thanks again for all the help...
  9. Thanks ericsbrother & Homer67 for all the advice... I think we will go down the POPLA route, just to be on the safe side and see where it leads. I'll keep this thread updated if they do try to go to court or if they give up at this stage. Thanks again.
  10. 3rd update as promised... After sending the following letter to Parking Eye: Dear PE, Ref Number: xxxxxxxx Please cancel the above parking charge on the basis of the following: 1. Your Notice To Keeper was issued too late to create a keeper liability. Alleged 'event' occurred on 01/07/17 - 'parking charge' issued 21/07/17 (outside the 14 day limit). 2. It does not state what the event that caused the money to be claimed is. 3. It does not say whether it is a contractual demand or a demand for monies due as a result of a breach of contract. 4. It does not say who the creditor is. As all of these are required to be included in a notice under the Protection of Freedoms Act, Parking Eye should now cease corresponding with the me or risk action for breach of the Data Protection Act for not adhering to the terms of their Keeper of a Vehicle at the Date of an Event contract. Regards We received a reply denying our appeal (letter attached) - but from what I've read on other posts, this is their normal course of action. Still, it doesn't make any sense that they should deny the appeal given that, as ericsbrother has said, their original invoice is riddled with mistakes and they would obviously lose any further appeals. They have graciously offer to extend the discount period for a further 14 days so that we can pay the reduce amount, which is good of them - not! It appears we now have the option to appeal to POPLA, so my question is, is this the time to do that? Many thanks letter3.pdf
  11. I think you misunderstand me... What I said wasn't meant to infer I was considering using "the duff ticket machine" argument, I was just replying to your point in a previous post about having evidence that the Keeper was somewhere else at the time of the event. My intention is/was to send out the letter I outlined on August 10th denying liability - that letter has now been sent. I appreciate any and all the advice I've received so far and don't see any reason someone would ask for advice on here then not follow it - that would be crazy. Thanks again
  12. No we don't have that evidence because the registered keeper was the driver at the time. They paid the parking fee at the time, then something went wrong (i.e. wrong reg number or computer error) to make this charge appear. I'm going to send the letter now and hopefully they will realise they can't enforce this and they'll go away. I'll update the thread if/when I hear back from them...
  13. Thanks dx & ericsbrother... I haven't sent them anything as yet in reply to their 3 letters. Can I just clarify at which stage I should be sending them something, as it doesn't look like they're going to just give up at any stage? What will the letter say/threaten that I should reply to - any ideas? Thanks again
  14. 2nd update as promised... I've received a 3rd letter from PE but I'm not sure if this one counts as the 'threatening' letter or not. The only reason for my uncertainty is they mention the possibility of sending a solicitors letter after 14 days so maybe I shouldn't send my letter until I receive the next letter from them. Any thoughts? Thanks PE Final Notice .pdf
  15. OK that makes sense, I'll leave it until they start to threaten action before we send them anything - may as well let them rack up their costs as much as possible....
  16. Update as promised... PE have now sent a second, identical, copy of their invoice - so I'm guessing I need to send them a reply now that they are obviously not going to let this go. Am I right in thinking I need to deal with this before they involve a collection agency? I've never written one of these letters before so, using ericsbrother's advice, how does this look? Dear PE, Ref Number: xxxxxxxx Please cancel the above parking charge on the basis of the following: 1. Your Notice To Keeper was issued too late to create a keeper liability. Alleged 'event' occurred on 01/07/17 - 'parking charge' issued 21/07/17 (outside the 14 day limit). 2. It does not state what the event that caused the money to be claimed is. 3. It does not say whether it is a contractual demand or a demand for monies due as a result of a breach of contract. 4. It does not say who the creditor is. As all of these are required to be included in a notice under the Protection of Freedoms Act, Parking Eye should now cease corresponding with the me or risk action for breach of the Data Protection Act for not adhering to the terms of their Keeper of a Vehicle at the Date of an Event contract. Regards As I said I've never written one of these before so if there's anything I need to add/remove before I send it, please feel free to chime in. Thanks again for all the advice.
  17. Thanks for your help ericsbrother - that's great information to know. I'll update the thread if they hear anything else from PE and also if it goes any further. I'm guessing if they do send a reminder it'll be around the end of August...
  18. Not ignoring it was my understanding from the other posts I'd been reading...
  19. Thanks for the response... I'm happy to take your advice and tell them to ignore the notice, but you also said 'unless they issue a claimform' - if that happens, won't it make things more difficult in that they won't have responded to the initial notice or used the POPLA process? I'm sure I've seen it said in other posts that a court would take a dim view of this. Forgive me if I'm overthinking this, it's not a subject I know much about (aside from what I've read here), and I'd hate it if they ended up owning these bandits money. Thanks again Sorry, forgot to address your point about the wrong reg number... That might have been the case, could they use that as a grounds for an appeal if it gets that far?
  20. Hi, First the details of the alleged 'offence'... 1 Date of the infringement - 01/07/2017 2 Date on the NTK [this must have been received within 14 days from the 'offence' date] - 21/07/2017 (20 days after the 'event') 3 Date received - 23/07/2017 4 Does the NTK mention schedule 4 of The Protections of Freedoms Act 2012? [y/n?] - Yes 5 Is there any photographic evidence of the event? - Yes, images of the vehicle entering and leaving the car park 6 Have you appealed? {y/n?] post up you appeal] Have you had a response? [Y/N?] post it up - No, thought I'd ask for advice here before doing anything. 7 Who is the parking company? - Parking Eye 8. Where exactly [carpark name and town] - Premier Inn, Deansgate Locks, Manchester For either option, does it say which appeals body they operate under. - The notice only mentions POPLA in respect to appeals but it says they are a member of BPA. My son and daughter-in-law used this car park and my son paid for a ticket for considerably longer than the time they actually parked for. He can't remember the exact period he paid for (and they've lost the ticket), but as they were going to an event they didn't expect to finish until after 10pm, he knows it was for considerably longer than the time they spent there. Having said that, the Parking Charge Notice/Invoice makes no mention of why the charge has been issued, we're just assuming it's for staying too long. Is it normal that the 'offence' isn't mentioned on these charge notices? If it is, how is someone meant to appeal or defend themselves against an unspecified transgression? I've read in other CAG posts that these notices must be received within 14 days of the alleged 'offence' (it's termed an 'event' on Parking Eye's invoice) - does that apply in this case as well because it turned up 22 days later and was issued 20 days after the event? I've attached a copy of the PCN as a file - can't seem to figure out how to add it as an image like others on here are doing, hope that's not a problem. Can anyone suggest the best course of action to take? Many thanks Parking-Lie.pdf
  21. Thank you for this, it's exactly the kind of news I was hoping to hear I've found a free Statutory Declaration form online that I'm hoping will do the trick, maybe someone would be kind enough to take a look at it and let me know if it would do? Do I do this now, before they take any further action, or wait until after they seize any goods and then get the declaration notified? If it's afterwards, do I just send it to Marston's or would I still need to send it to the court? I've just read somewhere that it wouldn't stop any further action unless I get it accepted by the court beforehand, but as this isn't my case, I was wondering if that would even be possible? I've just realised I don't know which court is dealing with the case - if I'm going to submit this statement I assume it's the original court who handed out the original fines (I can find out from my son though). Would it be a good idea to call the guy from Marston's and ask him which court it is and tell him why? That way it would alert him to what I'm doing and maybe it would put him off even bothering with the forced entry - just a thought, I won't do this until someone who knows tells me it's either a good or bad idea... Anyway, you've really put my mind at ease so thank you again.
  22. Thanks for your reply Bazooka Boo... I did keep him outside today despite his original assertion that he had the right to force entry and would use a locksmith to facilitate entry. I appreciate what you're saying about it being my property, but one of my questions was how do I prove something is mine if the enforcement officer says he suspects I don't own it? I don't have receipts for stuff I bought several years ago, hell I don't have receipts for stuff I bought several months ago - do most people? I'd suspect not! With regards to my son providing the court with an income/expenditure form, he did this when he first went to court but they still insisted he pay the minimum amount they were allowed to set it at - despite him having no income. I'm not trying to make excuses for him, I firmly believe he should pay what he owes, but the situation seems to have gone passed that now and the guy today made veiled threats about how difficult it would be for the rest of us when we had to prove that goods in the house don't belong to my son. That's why I'm trying to clarify the following points I asked in my original post: 1. He 'warned' me to get together receipts for any item that he might suspect belong to my son or he will take them away. Like most people I don't have receipts for everything so how do I prove any goods are mine? 2. I have the log books for any vehicles but I don't believe they accept them as proof of ownership - is a receipt from a garage acceptable? 3. Also, my son's girlfriend parks her car in our driveway sometimes, can they seize her car until we prove it is hers? 4. One final thing - we have a motorbike that my son uses sometimes. It belongs to me but the V5 document is in his name because we were told it needed to in his name for him to insure it. I have an invoice for the bike from Honda (in my name), would this bike be in any danger of seizure? Thanks again for your input...
  23. Many thanks for your reply, I'll answer the questions as best I can.... How old is your son? - He's 25 You say that he has no income. I assume that he is claiming benefits or some sort. Is this correct? - No he is not on benefits - he has just started his own business but isn't making enough money to take a wage yet. Did he receive the summons for these court fines? Did he respond to the summons? - Not sure if I understand what summons you mean (apologies I'm not up with all the ins and outs of the court system). He did attending court for both these motoring offences and explained his situation to the magistrate but they told him they had to set a minimum weekly or monthly payment arrangement even though he has no income. Has he made any payments to the court? - Not sure, but I don't think so Before getting to the late stage of a personal visit, your son should have received a Notice of Enforcement from Marston's. Did he contact the company on receipt of this notice to make a payment proposal? - Don't know if he received the Notice of Enforcement, but I do know he didn't offer any payment proposal to Marston's. Personally I believe if you do the crime you do the time so I don't condone non-payments like this. However, I've been put in the situation where Marston's are threatening my possessions which is why I asked my questions above. It might sound a bit harsh, but right now I'm trying to find out more about how this effects me. I know that might sound a little selfish (it isn't meant to be), but he is old enough and ugly enough to deal with the fallout from the mess he has created. My priority is to find out more about the potential problems (and any ways to mitigate them) this could cause the rest of my family through no fault of our own....
  24. I had a visit today from an Enforcement Officer from Marston's about my son's unpaid court fines/debt (£820 inc costs for 2 motoring offences). I told him my son has no income or any assets - but I know he's not going to take my word for that - and at first he said it would be easier just to let him into the house as he only needed to look in my son's bedroom to confirm that, otherwise he would have to come back with a locksmith and force entry. For the record, I didn't believe he would be satisfied with ONLY going into that 1 bedroom. He showed me a court document (well it looked more like a hand-filled form) that he claimed gave him his authority - I didn't take note of what the form was, ooops! I told him I was going to video him on my phone and then asked him if the document he had gave him the legal right to enter as he had previously inferred. At that stage he changed his tune and and apologised if that's how I'd understood things, he then told me he'd have to go back to court to get that authority - amazing what being recorded does to their attitude as well! Anyway, later in the day I got my son to call him (on speakerphone) and after he told him the same thing regarding lack of assets and income, my son said to him "what do you want to do then" unfortunately he heard this as "do what you want then" which must have upset him a bit because he became extremely aggressive and very loud on the phone, saying he was going to "come into your house when you're not there and take your stuff". The problem is my son genuinely doesn't have anything for him to take except for clothing. We do though, we have a whole houseful of stuff that he could 'claim' and a number of vehicles as well. Because it's an unpaid court fine I understand that he can get authorisation to force an entry (if a judge agrees with him), and because he got so upset with what he thought my so had said to him, I get the feeling he will try his hardest to make it happen. I also get the feeling he will try to make things as difficult as he can for me - I say me because it is me that will have to deal with him as my son is rarely here (also I wouldn't want my son here because he doesn't stay as calm as I do in heated situations - and I don't want him getting in anymore trouble). This guy was seriously annoyed! So I need some guidance if possible.... If he does get access to our home, can he 'target' the whole house to look for things to seize or does he have to stay within my son's bedroom? I suspect the former.. He 'warned' me to get together receipts for any item that he might suspect belong to my son or he will take them away. Like most people I don't have receipts for everything so how do I prove any goods are mine? I have the log books for any vehicles but I don't believe they accept them as proof of ownership - is a receipt from a garage acceptable? Also, my son's girlfriend parks her car in our driveway sometimes, can they seize her car until we prove it is hers? One final thing - we have a motorbike that my son uses sometimes. It belongs to me but the V5 document is in his name because we were told it needed to be for him to insure it. I have an invoice for the bike from Honda (in my name), would this bike be in any danger of seizure? Thank you in advance for any help/guidance you can provide.
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