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Posts posted by nfi247

  1. Recieved a letter from moorcroft debt recovery ltd on 29 aug, just sent them ther usual dont recoganise them as creditors and argos are in default blah. see what they say to that.

  2. after passing various letters back and forth, i cant seem to get argos to give me any information of relevance so i issued court action against them for non compliance on friday. they have had long enough to comply now.

  3. Oh dear, why are you up so early/late?


    i quite often ask myself that very question !!!


    Have you given them the 12 + 2 working days for the CCA request +30 calendar days and 40 days for the S.A.R - (Subject Access Request)?


    Yes, both are well out of there time limits


    An application won't do, sorry can't master link back yet but do forum search CCA Agreements/resources/workshop by Zubo, some excellent advice on there and template letters, keep the faith:)


    i agree, and thanks for your support. i got to look at the consumer credit (agreements) regulations 1983 today, which governs the form and content of agreements. this 'application' is not an agreement.

  4. The S.A.R - (Subject Access Request) was for 6 accounts with them although some probably do not have any charges on them, but I though what the hell, add them to the letter anyway.


    i agree, and that is what i did. regardless of charges or not, you are entitled to the information they hold on you.


    They have refunded around £100 to my DCA who is now collecting on this account.


    what? dont quite understand. are you getting the £100 or the DCA? any money claimed for unlawful charges is yours and not the DCA's.


    I would write to them reminding them that they have x amount of days left to satisfy your request, IN FULL and that you are not in a position to accept or refuse their goodwill gesture, although it has been noted accordingly.

  5. Hi;

    Hope you dont mind me subscribing


    not at all, the more the merryier


    The application form is not a CCA and if they go to court they would have to provide the original with the prescribed items.


    quite right, by my reckoning. section 60 of the CCA 1974 details the form and content of agreements through its subordinate legislation - the consumer credit (agreements) regulations 1983. the argos application form is not an agreement.


    section 127 of the CCA 1974 prevents a judge from enforcing an agreement that is not properly executed.


    i sent argos a 5 page letter fully explaining the situation.

  6. Thanks for the advice so far guys but really need an assist as to which of the two paths I should follow.


    neither, at the moment. the civil procedure rules which govern how the courts must handle cases centers heavily on Alternative Dispute Resolution prior to litigation. you must be able to demonstrate that you have exhausted all other means before litigation.


    These people made my life a living hell for months phoning up to five times a day and to find out now that they have never had the right to take any money off me just makes me fume. Time for some payback.


    first and foremost, this is not personal. its business. i would write to them explaining that under section 77 -79 of the CCA 1974 you are entitled to a copy of your agreement. this must be provided within 12 days or the agreement is unenforceable. if this continues for a furthur month then they have committed a criminal offense and report the matter to trading standards.


    Section 60 of the Consumer Credit Act 1974 details the ‘Form and Content of Agreements’ through its Subordinate Legislation being the Consumer Credit (Agreements) Regulations 1983 by virtue of the Statutory Instruments Act 1946 and SI 1983/1553.

    The Office of Fair Trading has issued a leaflet concerning Credit Agreements (which they have headed as Non – cancellable agreements) You can find the leaflet at: -


    bearing in mind of course that section 127 of the CCA 1974 prevents a court from enforcing an agreement if it is not properly executed, regardless of how much you have used the debt/spend the money.

    hope this helps.

  7. While the debt is unenforceable, that does not mean that you are entitled to

    get your money back. The debt does exist by your own admission [i should point out that I have used the card for a number of purchases from 1990 to date.]


    I suggest you forget about going to Court as the Court would ask you for proof that you had never made an arrangement with Burtons and even if you had, you never owed them that kind of money.

    They can show your history of payments as proof that there was a debt

    involved, so unless you are prepared to lie in Court [not recommended!] your

    chances of getting anything back will be very small. Just be grateful that you

    do not have to pay any more.


    Surely the judgement in the House of lords in the wilson case goes against what you are saying.


    you are not disputing if there is or is not a debt. you are disputing if the creditor has completed their statratory obligations and processed there paperwork correctly.


    the wilson case quite simply established that without a properly executed agreement in accordance with section 60 of the consumer credit act 1974 and its subordinate legislation being the consumer credit (agreements) regulations 1983, then the creditor has no claim to the debt in contract law.


    this is the very reason why the act was established if you go back to the white papers and parlimentary discussions about it.

  8. hi everyone, i am having a little difficulty with argos and lloyds and i need to sort it out. some advice would be great. i have CCA requested both and SAR requested both. argos have sent me an 'application for argos card' as my agreement and a shabby list of charges for my SAR. lloyds have sent my charges statements but wont entertain talking to me about CCA request. any advice? all the info is here http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/lloyds-bank/101744-nfi247-lloyds-tsb.html & http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/other-stores/102082-nfi247-argos.html

  9. wow, now it is starting to boil up. received 2 letters from Argos today. the first, about my SAR saying that what they have given me (see post 8) was all they were legally obliged to do and if i want statements then it will be £1 each sheet. the second letter detailed there obligations under the S78 of the CCA and after seeking legal advice, they are of the opinon that they have satisfied there obligations with the 'application' agreement.


    now, im confident that an application form is not an agreement, nor does it satisfy the requirements of section 60 - form and content of agreements. any comments?


    but with the SAR, not sure where to go from here. i dont think that they are any where near satisfying my request.


    some advice would be appreciated. any one?

  10. 06/08/07 recieved a default notice from argos served under the CCA 1974. theres me thinking that the account was in dispute (they have been told several times, in writing) and that while in dispute, they can not default me? let alone that they still havent satisfied my CCA request or my SAR and both are outside there time limits

  11. as i believe argos are in criminal default, i want to report them to trading standards and the rest but where do you find the address to write to and any ideas on what you would write in order to sound professional? any help would be appreciated.

  12. as i believe Lloyds are in criminal default, i want to report them to trading standards and the rest but where do you find the address to write to and any ideas on what you would write in order to sound professional? any help would be appreciated.

  13. hi paul, and hopeful1. I'm not to sure about hopeful1's interpretation of the CCA and reclaiming charges, and i apologise, just that i was of the opinion that you are not disputing weather there is or is not a debt, you can quite happily say there is; the CCA allows for the powerful institutes to be regulated and disciplined for breach and provides for powerful protection of the weaker consumer. What i mean is that the onus is on the institutions to get there paper work correct, and that is what the CCA protects. it does not dispute if the debt exists or not; it merely ensures that the stronger party to the agreement, the banks, haver to ensure that everything is right, if not its strict liability and they stand to lose the lot. so my personal opinion, and what i am doing, is to continue to claim the charges back with or without an agreement.

  14. recieved a letter of SC&M saying it was my last chance to discuss this matter as i had ignored all of there previous letters (untrue, replied to them all with recorded mail) so i wrote to them and informed them that i could prove my communications with them and reminded them as solicitors that they must seek an alternative to litigation where possible under the CPR rules. still waiting for a reply. i decided to write to llyods again and i recieved the usual 'sorry you have cause to complain ... 28 days etc. so at least they have acknowledged me. recieved charges statements 25/07/07 and they are not complete. have given them 14 days furthur (SAR runs out 29/07/07) to comply in full. now we wait.

  15. to update anyone who is intrested, it seems that argos are not taking this seriously and i think it is a matter of time before court action against them. i replied to the compliments slip 13/07/07 asking for there full cooperation only to recieve a letter threatening a default notice against me (18/07/07) and another letter saying sorry i had cause to complain with the same charges sheet enclosed. I replied of course warning that the 40 day limit expires 29/07/07 and they have 14 days to comply with my SAR and CCA request or else i will be left no choice but to go to court. im waiting for a reply as i type. i even have the collections department hounding me 2-3 times a day and they never want to talk about the SAR or CCA request. wonder why?

  16. hi itsamomentintime, and yes i have already stopped paying them (just 1 month so far) but they are still asking for payment and not acknowledging my CCA request or SAR for that manner. I plan to total up my illegal charges and then hit them with court action demanding for my charges back as well as all payments made if they dont have my agreement. any thoughts, good or bad?

  17. i recieved a compliment slip from argos with a printed a4 piece of paper that details the following:



    1x10.00 late fees

    2x14.00 late fees


    1x14.00 late fees

    1x17.50 late fees etc, etc


    this is getting a joke. is it really that difficult to do? any ideas on an appropriate response? i know what i would like to write but i dont think it will help

  18. I wrote to BLS informing them that i have not made an offer capable of acceptance and i inform SC&M that in my opinion the agreement is unenforceable and any legal action will be defended. that should do it, i hope.

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