Thank You!

I have now just spoken to Northampton. They have given me an email address to confirm all this to. I will then back it up in writing too, just to be on the safe side.

I will chase SCM in another week if I still haven't had a reply. She did seem pleasant enough and seemed to want to be helpful, so I suppose that's something!

I will keep you updated. Thanks again for all your help. I am keeping a careful eye on the calendar!

Phew!

I was called by the solicitor dealing with this case. She says that she responded on "around 1/2 December" but that, as she is in Edinburgh, it's like the post is all being delayed.

Given that post is problematic and can be delayed at this time of year anyway, she is prepared to agree to an extension of time for 28days from today and specified the 6th January 2011, which I confirmed with her.

I will now ring Northampton and ask if I can notify them by email. I will then write and send Recorded Delivery (Special Delivery has been suspended up here because of the weather) and send a copy to her as well. She has given me her Edinburgh address to send this to.

Did I do ok? Very nervous, but aware that this has given us a little breathing space!

Oh Dear.....

I rang the number on the Claim Form - constantly engaged.

Rang SCM Head Office - gave me Barnet's number

Rang Barnet - gave me Cardiff's number - constantly engaged.

They are now supposedly going to get someone to call me back.

Waiting game now then. Very concerned that time is marching on.

Thank you. Still nothing from them, but did receive some post yesterday! (First for a good while)

I will get on to the Solicitors now and update you shortly.

Update Time - if you can call it that.

Since my last post we have had feet and feet of snow and therefore no post whatsoever since last Friday (26th November).

Consequently, even if BH's lawyers have responded, we haven't had it. (They signed for the CPR on 25th) So, by my reckoning their 7 days is up. SO what should we do now?

If we only have until next weekend to put in a defence then I obviously need to work on it, if they have replied. However I don't know that they have!

HELP!!

Presumably you are further South than us, but it's really lovely here. The cats hate it, but the humans love it. Had a couple of lovely bracing walks and it looks so pretty. Makes you feel better doesn't it?!

Seriously gh2008 Thank You!

I will sleep easier tonight. Suddenly had a bit of a panic attack over this, but I'm seriously grateful to you for easing my mind. Ok, going to have that good night's sleep.

CPR has been received. SAR went today (to Lloyds Group, as advised) and a request for the Complaints Procedure.

I shall await the postman (if he can get here through the foot of snow outside!)

Sorry if I am being a little paranoid (not like me, but I am still worried by all this)

Can someone please just put my mind at rest?

Court Claim was dated 11.11 (received 15.11) and acknowledged Online on 22.11

CPR was signed for by Claimant's Solicitors today. However, checking my CPR letter I can't find anywhere where I have asked for an extension of time to file a defense. Should I have?

BTW keep a close eye on dates.

 

Part of the CPR request was asking for them to agree to an extension of your Defence submission.

As the CPR deadline for compliance looms near you will need to contact SCM to seek agreement to the defence extension, 99% they will agree - if not you will have to make an application to Court (who will be less than impressed by SCM)

If they do fully comply within time - accompanied by levitating pigs - then again they should also agree to a 14 day extension to the defence

 

DO NOT miss the defence deadline, by that date there needs to be either 1) agreement to delay or 2) an application in

I am confused as to when the deadline for defence is exactly, as it stands now?

How do I get an extension?

Will I still be in time if the Solicitors do (by some miracle) respond to the CPR in time?

I am really really sorry. I am feeling so much better about all this, but it's nagging away at me as I know I have to keep a really careful eye on timescales. It's just completely new to me and I am still trying to get my head around it all!

Am I right in thinking that my deadline for defence is 13th December? and if so is there a way I can check this to be certain!?

Just a little update.

CPR letter signed for by Black Horse today. Track and Trace screenshot saved.

So, 7 days to see if they comply........8-)

Thanks gh, I have to admit I DO feel like I am back in control. As always the CAG to the rescue!

Thanks for explaining. I shall sit and wait in great anticipation for their response to the CPR and will post with any updates in the meantime, or when the response does/doesn't appear.

Meanwhile the SAR is ready to go tomorrow to Lloyds Group as is a letter requesting their Complaints Procedure. I will then start composing a complaint letter.

Many thanks!

Thank gh, but I'm a bit confused......

CPR was posted RD today. Presumably I check the Royal Mail track and trace and count 7 days from when they sign it? (is it 7 calendar days or 7 working days?) If they don't respond within 7 days what do I need to do?

You are right that the CPR requested an extension to the defence submission. What do I do if they don't respond to that or don't agree to it?

Perhaps I am gettin ahead of myself, sorry, but your expression "levitating pigs" and the fact that they have hardly played fair so far doesn't give me much hope of them responding in a timely fashion or agreeing to an extension. It would be useful (if only for my peace of mind) to know what happens next. Then perhaps I can draft what I will need in the event that they just ignore me!

How do I know when the defence deadline is, so that I don't miss it? (Sorry if I'm being thick!)

As per the two posts above, I'd like to say that, whilst some valuable advice was given during my chat with NDL, and whilst some interesting paperwork was also sent to me, they DID advise to admit the debt and DID advise that BH would DEFINATELY accept our offer of payment.

On the face of it, ok. However, as it turns out, we are unable to ascertain how much we actually owe them, whether the charges they have levied are lawfull and it looks as if we have also been treated unfairly. If the latter proves to be the case then we are prepared to take this as far as it goes and to only agree to make instalment payments on the sum we actually owe.

I am preparing the complaint and SAR this evening and will update as appropriate.

I was very impressed with the calm handling of my call to NDL. I was really shaken up by the Court Claim paperwork and, suffering from long term, life threatening ill health as I do, I needed someone to calm me down and to give straightforward advice at that moment.

I will also say that having had a good hard look at the situation as a whole, the NDL advice re other debts and a payment plan have helped us to take the bull by the horns as it were and we're no longer losing sleep over our finances. I have decided though, that I can self manage a DMP, so that's the intention for now!

Have found S140 of the CCA - interesting reading! Have Bookmarked it so I can absorb it a little more.

The OFTs stance on Unfair Practises is equally interesting. Thanks so much for the heads up on this one gh!

I'm just compiling the SAR and will get that in the post tomorrow. Also looking up Complaints Procedure for Lloyds Group, which I will deal with in a seperate letter.

Just checked the paperwork I have - Yes, the LBA is definately the same date as the Court Claim. And yes, the DCA (Nationwide Collection Services did request the whole balance in their threatograms of 8th September, and 23rd September.

Interestingly too, but not sure if it's important, we haven't received anything from BH to state that they have cancelled or terminated the agreement. The figure requested by the DCA is £226 less than BH demanded in their LBA, but I cannot see how, as the monthly payment was £274 - definately need to see a statement, along with the Agreement.

I'll keep reading and update you all accordingly.

SarEL - thanks for your reply.

The Solicitors wrote a Costs letter to my daughter before the second stage of the internal process had even been heard. The letter included several threats and we copied it to the Tribunal Chair. He was not impressed and wrote to them to explain themselves. The copy we have of the reply doesn't really explain their behaviour at all.

Their first move had been to request a deposit, but the Tribunal Chair told them "no", not least because they had not complied with Rule 11(4) and copied us in.

They have requested a PHR, but again did not comply with rule 11(4) until the Chair asked them if they had!

We have requested the documents that they are supposedly relying on to show that she "lied", ie her online application form as this is vital to prove she didn't. They haven't produced this at internal hearings or via the Solicitors, so we have asked the Tribunal to Order them to. No response thus far.

We have also requested a CMD rather than a PHR as, until we know whether they actually have certain documents we cannot know whether to take this further.

She was NOT given her two weeks notice pay, despite their assertion that she resigned. The fact is she didn't resign, she left the office on the same day and didn't return because she then took Union advice. However, they didn't follow "Absent Without Leave" procedures either!

I will update when I have further news, unless anyone has further advice!

Thanks CB and GH

I will get an SAR off to Lloyds Group today. Let's see what they have indeed!

I will look up what you have suggest gh and go from there. The CPR went this morning Recorded Delivery.

Thanks again

Hi there,

I am trying to help my daughter with an issue and hope that I have come to the right place on the Forum to get some advice!

I'll try to keep this short.

Feb 2010 - Daughter succesful at Interview with Large Bank

She then completed their "Screening Process" and was given a start date.

April 2010 - Daughter starts at Large Bank. Training Course for 6 Weeks.

May 2010 - Having completed Training and (in the words of her line manager) exceeding all targets, she is called into a Meeting and told she lied on her Application form re her Exam Results and therefore she's going to be sacked if she doesn't resign.

Union were involved at all stages of the internal resolution process. Daughter discovered she was pregnant two weeks after leaving Large Bank and therefore unable to get further employment for the time being.

Applied to Employment Tribunal during the internal process due to Large Bank dragging their feet and that fact that she would have been out of time if she had not.

So, Large Banks Solicitors are now getting nasty as the internal resolution process has come to and end with a big fat "no" and no supporting information or documents. Whereas Daughter can PROVE she provided her grades, but they will NOT give her a copy of her online application form to PROVE that she "lied" (their words)

Via Employment Tribunal we have requested an Order to get them to disclose the Online Application Form. Now their Solicitors have said they will "next week" when Large Bank gives it to them (So why not just show it to us in May and every meeting in which we've asked for it since?) and meanwhile will we agree to show them our paperwork if they show us theirs!?

So, where from here?

Do we wait and see if the ET Chair will Order them to disclose? Do we Disclose our paperwork?

It's a bit complicated, without making it obvious who the parties are, so sorry if it's a bit vague.

The claim at ET is for wrongful dismissal (Procedures were not followed, not allowed representation in the "resign or be sacked" meeting, as it was "informal" - apparently!) and Age/Sex Discrimination (Union feel that they wouldn't have treated someone older with more life experience in this way)

Problem we have is that due to length of service/membership Union cannot help us from here on in!

Any help gratefully received.

Just a quick update, having gone through everything!

Latest DN we received was dated 16/10/10, giving us until 4/11/10 to pay arrears. (Copy of this sent to Citizen B) - Hopefully someone will be able to tell if this is legit or dodgy.

Last letter received from Black Horse (which they may claim is a Letter Before Action) dated 11th November.

Court Claim initiated 11th November (the same day as LBA, but arrived a day later in post)

Acknowledgement of Service done yesterday (for both of us)

CPR Letter going tomorrow (23/11/10) to Black Horse.

I'm going to do some reading up and will update as soon as I can. Firstly with when they sign for the CPR.

Many many thanks to all who have helped so far. I am taking all advice on board and trying to read up as much as I can in the meantime.

Thanks for the information Nicklea - I have read quite a lot now and, whilst other cases are interesting and can be useful for understanding how it all works, I have no intention of just taking off and doing my own thing. The advice on this thread is very valuable.

I have just finished my CPR, which will go RD tomorrow. I will check the RM website religiously until they sign for it.

I will update the thread accordingly.

In the meantime I have sent images of the two DNs and the supposed LBA to Citizen B, which I have just realised was dated 11th November, the day of the Claim. It actually arrived to us on the Monday (15th), the day before the Court Papers arrived on our doorstep. So minutes "before action" as opposed to days etc!

When Citizen B has sent copies to those interested I look forward to taking more valuable advice.

*Scuttles off to read the links in Nicklea's post*

Digi Camera on charge as I type!

Ok, I've got the CPR letter done. I've asked for the statement of Account from inception to the current date. Will this suffice?

We have definate;y been hit with £25-£30 of charges per month since March. Can we claim these back? And if so how? Do we wait until we have the statement of account, so we can work out how much it totals up to?

Thanks everyone for your help.

To clarify, it's one case and one case number, with two defendants, me and OH.

As soon as I have the pics of the DNs and LBAs etc I'll PM them.

Thanks EmandCole!

My husband has not been able to kick the scanner hard enough and it's refusing to work! I am working on it and hope to be able to have the DN scanned and sent to folk as soon as possible, please bear with me as the scanner is temperamental to say the least.

Unfortunately I didn't keep the envelopes, no. However, I have kept everything they've sent since January 2010 and a few from before that. (Hindsight is a wonderful thing eh? I'd have kept them if I knew they were relevant)

As I've already said, I have no issue with coming to an agreement as to affordable instalments IF (and it's a debatable IF at the moment) they have an enforceable agreement and they have played by the rules.

Yes, National Debtline were insistant that we didn't defend it, but just admitted it whereupon they told me that BH "Will definately" agree to the instalments offered. I am SO pleased I came straight here (once I'd remembered my password!)

Thanks again everyone, I'm feeling positive and in control, for the first time in I don't know how long!

Hi,

And again thank you for all your help. I've had a couple of good night's sleep (for the first time in ages) and feel a lot more confident in dealing with this now. Coupled with sorting out a budget sheet and re-jigging some payments, I feel confident moving forward.

So far I have acknowledged via MCOL the Court papers.

I am in the process of completing the CPR, now that I understand it properly. Thanks for your patience.

Citizen B

Thanks, I will ask, in the CPR letter for a statement of account, in order to ascertain that the figures are correct. The most recent statement we have does show that they are still adding interest on.

When we received the DN in April I got together a recent Income and Expenditure that I had done (nowhere near as comprehensive as I have done now) and posted it off. Unfortunately I didn't think to send it RD, so I have no proof they received it. I only have a copy of it on my PC. (and a few others from prior to that).

How I'd like to play this is, having given it some thought, ensure that they have disclosed all documents pertinent to the case and ensure that they have an enforceable agreement. Should that be the case I would like to negotiate with them in order to make affordable repayments (as per the budget sheet and not giving them any advantage over other creditors). If they haven't got an enforceable agreement then my husband and I are happy to see where this leads us.

To answer your question the Loan in unsecured and I'd like it to stay that way!!

As soon as the CPR is complete I will ensure it goes Special Delivery tomorrow.

gh2008

Thanks for your advice. I am starting, by reading a lot on this forum in particular, to get a handle on this. As you'll see from what I've written above, I'm determined to get them to at least prove what we owe and that they have an enforceable agreement. Once that's established we'll go from there.

It's a Loan, unsecured, in both names.

So...........Two questions........

Is there a particular way I should ask for the statements/proof of amount in the CPR letter?

Do I send 2 CPR letters, one from me and one from my husband, or just one, with both names on it?

Once I know the answers to those two I can complete the CPR and get it posted.

Thanks again!

Right, had a read through the CPR letter - I think I understand it (!)

There is one thing I don't quite get, if you could help?

1. the agreement giving rise to the obligation to xxxxx for the credit advanced. You will appreciate that in an ordinary case and by reason of the provisions of CPR PD 16 para 7.3, where a claim is based upon a written agreement, a copy of the contract or documents constituting the agreement should be attached to or served with the particulars of claim and the original(s) should be available at the hearing. Further, that any general conditions incorporated in the contract should also be attached.

Is the xxxxxx ME or Black Horse? (Sorry to be a bit thick, but I obviously want to make sure I get this correct!

Thanks again!

Registered Online - Did the AOS for both of us (individually) and stated that we defend the whole claim.

Now to work on the CPR Letter.

Thanks so much gh2008, I will look at that now. I will also register online and defend the case, for both my husband and myself. We both received identical Court Claim papers.

I have been through the paperwork received by Black Horse before the CC papers.

Firstly, the address we have always had for BH has been in Edinburgh, but the Court Papers give an address in Cardiff. Not sure if this is relevant?

They are claiming £10,715.77, which is NOT what the most recent statement says!

11.11.10 - Received letter we must pay the balance immediately, or they will be entitled to start legal proceedings.

(Is this a Letter Before Action? As it doesn't state that it is)

16/10/10 Default Notice with sum of arrears requested. (I will get this scanned tomorrow)

23.9/10 - Letter from Nationwide Collection Service - "Final Notice" in Red, if they don't hear from us they will pass it back to the Creditor.

22/9/10 - Statement showing balance at £10,489.17. (with an amount overdue at £2k plus)

21/9/10 Collection Activity Fee Advice £30

8/9/10 Nationwide Collections Letter - pay up or else!

According to the two statements I have a Collection Activity fee (£30) has been added every month since April 2010. Previous to that they had charged us £25 twice before, when our Standing Order payment arrived late.

We wrote to them in June 2010 (sending Income and Expenditure), but they never responded.

The balance in April 2010 was £9953.94, so where the rest has come from I don't know. Presumably charges?

We also received a Default Notice in April of this year, also only requesting us to settle the arrears, not the full sum outstanding. (Do you need to see this one too?)

I promise to go and have a good look at the CPR letter and ensure I understand it all before getting one sent off, with the relevant info to our case on it.

Thanks again for your help!

Oh, THANK YOU all so much for coming to help!

Ok, today I have been through everything, had a good bin out and completed a Budget Sheet, carefully working out pro-rata payments to all creditors. This particular one we can allocate £110 per month to.

Ok, let's get to the questions asked above.

CitzenB

Claim was issued 11/11/2010 and received by us on Wednesday (17th November) It's for a Loan (Joint Names)

The Solicitors are: SCM Solicitors, Cockfosters Road, Barnet. (Same address as Black Horse department that has been writing to us, before we removed our heads from the sand)

The POC says:

The Claimant's claim is for the balance due under a Credit agreement regulated by the Consumer Credit Act 1974, following default in payment.

Date of Agreement: xx/xx/08 (Actual date written there is correct)

Parties: Black Horse Ltd and Defendant(s)

Agreement Number: xxxxxxxxxxx

The Claimant's claim is for the balance DUE £10,xxx

dx100uk

My Husband (who is the more IT savvy of the two of us) says he will kick the scanner until it works and do as you say. I hope to be able to have this posted up by tomorrow (Monday) night.

gh2008

Thanks for your calming words! I am trying really hard not to panic. Home circumstances don't help (long story). However, I've managed get all unnecessary stuff filed away, a full budget sheet done and have fired off letters offering payment to all the others. (I have SAR'd and CCA's them all, bar this one would you believe) some time ago, and then lost track when I got ill.

So, to summarise, I need to know what to do next. I think I am right in saying I need to get the Agreement from them so that you guys can see whether it's a legal agreement.

We have BOTH received a summons. Should I acknowledge receipt and say, for the time being, that I am going to defend it?

Thanks again for coming to my rescue!