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  1. #1

    Default ParkingEye ANPR PCN - Town Quay 2, Southampton

    Hi all,

    I need some help. The defendant has been issued with a 100 'parking chargeicon' by parking eyeicon.

    The alleged offence occurred during the day time on a weekend, and was apparently brought to the attention of the plaintiff by ANPR cameras recording time-stamped photos with entry+exit times of the vehicle registered to the defendant. The plaintiff claims that the defendant spent just over 30 minutes in total at the car park.

    Answers to the FAQ thread are as follows:


    1 Date of the infringement[s]: Late January 2019.

    2 Date on the NTK [this must have been received within 14 days from the 'offence' date] 5 days after the date of the alleged infringement

    3 Date received 11 days after the date of the alleged infringement.

    4 Does the NTK mention schedule 4 of The Protections of Freedoms Act 2012? [y/n?] YES.

    5 Is there any photographic evidence of the event? YES, see above.

    6 Have you appealed? {y/n?] post up your appeal] ​Defendant has not entered any correspondence with plaintiff or any 3rd party appeals company.


    Have you had a response? [Y/N?] post it up n/a

    7 Who is the parking company? ParkingEye Limited

    8. Where exactly [carpark name and town] Town Quay 2, Southampton

    For either option, does it say which appeals body they operate under. Letter mentions POPLAicon

    Many thanks for taking the time to read... My query is - should defendant appeal via POPLA, or contest the charge with ParkingEye? Some guidance would be greatly appreciated, based on the answer to above as well as potential defense points to the claim, I can write a draft letter for the defendant and post up here for critique before issuing.


  2. #2

    Default Re: ParkingEye ANPR PCN - Town Quay 2, Southampton

    defendant, plaintiff, defence..
    its not in court

    its a speculative invoice by a fleecing private parking company..

    have a read of these threads ...you'll soon get the idea
    https://cse.google.co.uk/cse?cx=part...&sa=Search+CAG

    scan up the NTK, bothsides to one multipage PDFicon
    read uploadicon

    dx

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    DX
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  3. #3

    Default Re: ParkingEye ANPR PCN - Town Quay 2, Southampton

    And DO NOT APPEAL.

    The bailiff: A 12th Century solution re-branded as Enforcement Agents for the 21st Century to seize and sell debtors goods as before Oh so Dickensian!
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  4. #4

    Default Re: ParkingEye ANPR PCN - Town Quay 2, Southampton

    Thanks guys.

    @DX100UK: sorry I do realise that, in hindsight I should have simply said person A, person B etc. Or banana, potato etc. Blame my lack of imagination.

    As requested, here is the charge form: https://imgur.com/a/Wlsx2aa

    I apologise for the fact that it's heavily redacted, I did it to preserve the identity of the defendant (in case parkingeyeicon trawls these forums), and in the event of a court case (unlikely I know).

    @Brassnecked: I notice from reading a lot of past threads, a lot of people have (successfully) appealed against parkingeyeicon using the POPLAicon service, is there a specific reason you recommend the defendant shouldn't appeal?

    What's the best course of action here? Registered letter (via Royal Mail) to ParkingEye denying any liability stating common reasons such as:
    * No registered keeper liability at that particular location
    * Signage not compliant with BPA code of practice
    * Not a genuine pre-estimate of loss
    * Etc...?

    What's best course of action? Should I start writing the letter for defendant?


  5. #5

    Default Re: ParkingEye ANPR PCN - Town Quay 2, Southampton

    you don't have to 'protect' anyone

    times/dates are important
    it doesn't matter if PE read here.else we would have lost 1000's of speculative invoices.
    and we haven't.

    goto googleeye nosy neighbours and give us the link to the exact car park
    as if this is within the docks, they are stuffed,

    PLEASE REFRAIN FROM HITTING 'REPLY WITH QUOTE' IF YOU ARE SIMPLY REPLYING TO THE LAST POST IN A THREAD..JUST TYPE!!
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    DX
    RIP Martin3030

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  6. #6

    Default Re: ParkingEye ANPR PCN - Town Quay 2, Southampton

    'goto googleeye nosy neighbors'?

    Sorry dx100uk, but is there a typo there? Not sure what you meant...

    Anyway, the car park is the 'Town Quay Car Park 2' which I believe is at the end of a pier, closest location I can give is: 5053'33.6"N 124'20.1"W (Streetview is available but dates back to over 10 years ago, when no ANPR/entry notices existed).

    Does this help?


  7. #7

    Default Re: ParkingEye ANPR PCN - Town Quay 2, Southampton

    so then you have some homework to do if the site is near to you.

    Get some pictures of the entrance to the car park fromthe public highway as the driver would see it entering the land and then some pictures of any signage inside the car park that differs from those at the entrance. if there are no signs visible as you enter then we want pictures showing that as well.

    Now the point about the car park being inside the docks is that harbours are almost all covered by their own byeleaws, often going back hundreds of years and so those byeleaws trump any contract offered by PE, even if the harbour board say they gave PE a contract.

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  8. #8

    Default Re: ParkingEye ANPR PCN - Town Quay 2, Southampton

    we like to identify the site and hope that the parking co's do take notice so they have the opportunity to save themselves some money and drop their more ridiculous claims before it goes too far.

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  9. #9

    Default Re: ParkingEye ANPR PCN - Town Quay 2, Southampton

    Thanks ericsbrother

    Unfortunately I am far away from the site, it'd be a 2 hour round-trip for me to get there. However I asked a relative to visit the site and take pictures:

    https://imgur.com/a/bBxgW6Z

    Does that help at all?

    Time is anxiously ticking, and I'm very keen to get this out of the way. So is POPLAicon appeal the best course of action to begin with? I read on numerous sites that merely an appeal on POPLA citing GPEOL gets tickets overturned instantly, and that's without even beginning to consider the harbour bye-laws issue!

    I've already worded a draft letter/appeal, happy to post it up here if need be, for people to review.


  10. #10

    Default Re: ParkingEye ANPR PCN - Town Quay 2, Southampton

    GPEOL is dead since Beavis.


  11. #11

    Default Re: ParkingEye ANPR PCN - Town Quay 2, Southampton

    Slow don't rush..
    We need the small print at the bottom clearly
    We also need to confirm who owns the land

    Check the local council planning section of their web portal

    No need to rush into any appeal at all
    Pointless...

    PLEASE REFRAIN FROM HITTING 'REPLY WITH QUOTE' IF YOU ARE SIMPLY REPLYING TO THE LAST POST IN A THREAD..JUST TYPE!!
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    RIP Martin3030

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  12. #12

    Default Re: ParkingEye ANPR PCN - Town Quay 2, Southampton

    dx100uk, you can find the small print here https://imgur.com/KXf2xec

    I will try my best to find out about the land ownership, is this to confirm whether the land the vehicle was allegedly parked on lies within the boundaries of the Port of Southampton, for ABP byelaws?


  13. #13

    Default Re: ParkingEye ANPR PCN - Town Quay 2, Southampton

    PLEASE REFRAIN FROM HITTING 'REPLY WITH QUOTE' IF YOU ARE SIMPLY REPLYING TO THE LAST POST IN A THREAD..JUST TYPE!!
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    If you want advice please PM me a link to your thread. PM advice is not allowed!!
    DX
    RIP Martin3030

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  14. #14

    Default Re: ParkingEye ANPR PCN - Town Quay 2, Southampton

    4.1 The provisions in Schedule 4 are intended to apply only on private land
    in England and Wales. Public highways are excluded as well as any
    parking places on public land which are either provided or controlled by a
    local authority (or other government body). Any land which already has
    statutory controls in relation to the parking of vehicles (such as byelaws
    applying to airports, ports and some railway station car parks) is also
    excluded.
    ABP Port rules from November 2016
    Associated British Ports have issued updated Port Rules for persons present on ABP property. Please note that these rules are complementary to the rules for Docks Permits and the Southampton Harbour Byelaws 2003

    16/12/2016.

    https://www.southampton.gov.uk/busin...uthampton.aspx

    http://www.southamptonvts.co.uk/admi...%20Byelaws.PDF

    Does the above help? Clearly shows that the car park (and a huge chunk of the general region operates falls under remit of the bye-laws) - I'm actually surprised that it's so large!

    Also found a more detailed site plan: https://www.southampton.gov.uk/image...m63-364755.pdf

    Should I email the council (the planning department) seeking confirmation that these planning docs are still valid, and byelaws described still cover the area in question? Or is this enough?

    Thanks once again for your help.


  15. #15

    Default Re: ParkingEye ANPR PCN - Town Quay 2, Southampton

    enough no need to do anything further

    if/when whichever fake/tame paperwork only solicitor write with a letter entitled 'letter of or before claim'
    then you'll simply send back one of the snotty insulting letters you'll find on many threads here already
    until that come you can safely ignoreicon everything else from everyone.

    dx

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    DX
    RIP Martin3030

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  16. #16

    Default Re: ParkingEye ANPR PCN - Town Quay 2, Southampton

    Thanks, I guess the waiting game starts.

    Having read many other threads on the forum as bedtime reading, the odds are it's only a matter of time before they try it on and waste my energy with further letters. Let's hope I'm wrong.

    EDIT: Is it not worth rolling the dice and submitting a POPLAicon appeal in the meantime? I mean there's nothing to lose, and the decision isn't binding for the appellant?


  17. #17

    Default Re: ParkingEye ANPR PCN - Town Quay 2, Southampton

    let Ericsbrother comment i know it used to cost them 27 but not sure now or it its the right thing to bother with

    PLEASE REFRAIN FROM HITTING 'REPLY WITH QUOTE' IF YOU ARE SIMPLY REPLYING TO THE LAST POST IN A THREAD..JUST TYPE!!
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    RIP Martin3030

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  18. #18

    Default Re: ParkingEye ANPR PCN - Town Quay 2, Southampton

    protocols are importnat in all of this.

    Yopu cant appeal to POPLAicon because you havent appealed to PE and had that rejected. We recommend you dotn appeal as they will turn it down and any appeal to POPLA as a result cannot consider the lawfulness of the byelaws and supremacy of contract so you wont win that appeal either.

    As PE are sunk by the docks byeleaws and their signage is a miserable failure to create a contract with you either ( either an invitation to treat or prohibitive signage according to which one you read) the appelaing will only give them the thought that you are in a hurry to settle this and if they tell you a differnt fib you will just pay them.

    I would just let them waste their money until they get to sending out a PAP letter before actionicon and then let them knwo that there was no contract to breach beacus of x and y and that you will be demanding a full costs recovery when they fail to show a cause for action at court.

    They noramlly go quiet then or even send you a letter saying they ahev cnacleed the charge withot an explanation of why. tyhat way they dotn give the game away in court and lose a valuable income stream that is all based on nothing

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  19. #19

    Default

    Understood, no time-wasting POPLAicon appeal it is then.
    From what I've read, I think POPLA appeals being decided in favour of the appellant are somewhat rarer nowadays, compared to say two or three years ago.

    Thanks for the advice around the signage
    - have you got any relevant case law examples I could read, to familiarise myself with this?
    Or explain what is wrong with the signage specifically?

    The thing I don't understand is
    - why do the Parking Companies pursue such cases in court, especially if they have a high chance of losing (and they probably know it).
    Solicitors cost and I doubt the time+expenses of one attending a puny small claimsicon court case is worth the tiny amount of money that can potentially extract from the defendant if the case is found in their favour.

    Also, a bit of a philosophical question (and I have no idea what the answer is at the moment):
    does DPA/GDPRicon play a part in this, seeing as parkingeyeicon claim to have accessed registered keeper data through POFLA when it has been demonstrated to not apply in this case?

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  20. #20

    Default Re: ParkingEye ANPR PCN - Town Quay 2, Southampton

    The poor signage is the minor of the three problems PE have with their ludicrous attempts at prising money from you.

    The byelaws are strong because it doesn't come within the remit of POFA [and PE know that of course].
    And the prohibitive nature of their signs means that you were a trespasser and only the landowner can pursue you for trespass not PE.

    Why do they do it?
    Because most people pay up without challenge.

    others pay when the debt collectorsicon start increasing their amount claimed and others do not bother to turn up in Court so PE then wins automatically-full amount with costs usually highly inflated.
    so they more than cancel out the ones who go to Court and win.
    Besides the fact that they are prepared to go to Court is often enough sadly for so many people to pay up rather than fight.

    GDPRicon could well play a part in this and should they decide to take things further that could be part of your response to get them to back down.

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