Marc Gander - The Consumer Survival Handbook


A 220 page introduction to all things consumer related by our own BankFodder.

Includes energy companies, mobile phone providers, retailers, banks, insurance companies,debt collection agencies, reclaim companies, secondhand car sellers, cowboy garages, cowboy builders and all the rest who put their own profits before you.

£6.99



Patricia Pearl - Small Claims Procedure - A Practical Guide


An excellent guide for the layperson in how to use the County Court - a must if you are intending to start a claim.

£19.99 + £1.50 (P&P)


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  1. #41
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    Default Re: Council tax debt - who is responsible to pay

    Quote Originally Posted by Dodgeball View Post
    it is for the debtor to prove the ownership of goods.
    Ultimately it is the person who owns the goods who has to prove ownership where a bailiff insists upon seizing them.


  2. #42

    Default Re: Council tax debt - who is responsible to pay

    Quote Originally Posted by Will Goodfellow View Post
    Ultimately it is the person who owns the goods who has to prove ownership where a bailiff insists upon seizing them.
    No not at all.

    A third party claim for goods , is for goods already taken under control(section 85).

    PART 85 - CLAIMS ON CONTROLLED GOODS AND EXECUTED GOODS
    www.justice.gov.uk › … › Civil › Rules & Practice Directions

    SECTION I SCOPE AND INTERPRETATION Scope. 85.1 (1) This Part contains rules about claims on con controlled goods and executed goods as follows— (a) Section II sets out the mode of application for claims under this Part'

    Deciding to take goods under control is a matter between the debtor and the bailiff. It is for the debtor to present proof.


  3. #43
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    Default Re: Council tax debt - who is responsible to pay

    What is a clamped car if it is not classed as controlled goods?


  4. #44

    Default Re: Council tax debt - who is responsible to pay

    Quote Originally Posted by Will Goodfellow View Post
    What is a clamped car if it is not classed as controlled goods?
    I think you are being a little pedantic. The bailiff can simply remove the clamp if the DEBTOR provides proof whilst he is still in the process of taking goods of course.


  5. #45

    Default Re: Council tax debt - who is responsible to pay

    Jus to be clear the bailiff is authorised by the warrant to negotiate with the debtor. If a third party wishes to make a claim under CPR he must contact the bailiffs office who will then contact the creditor.

    There is nothing stopping the bailiff removing the clamp due to evidence presented to him through the debtor but until the claim is made by the third party he has no authority to deal with him.


  6. #46

    Default Re: Council tax debt - who is responsible to pay

    The problem with interpleader claims is that they have always been wide open to abuse, hence the restrictive conditions regarding a deposit introduced by the TCE.


  7. #47
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    Default Re: Council tax debt - who is responsible to pay

    Quote Originally Posted by Dodgeball View Post
    I think you are being a little pedantic. The bailiff can simply remove the clamp if the DEBTOR provides proof whilst he is still in the process of taking goods of course.
    In some circumstances it is impossible for the debtor to prove that goods are not his. If a bailiff calls at the last known address of a debtor who no longer lives there and clamps the car of the person who now lives there, how does the debtor provide proof that the car is not his? The person now living there may not even know the debtor personally, and if the owner of the car produces evidence that the car does not belong to the debtor, the bailiff should remove the clamp as he can no longer claim a belief that the car belongs to the debtor.

    Where does it state that the bailiff cannot accept proof of ownership of goods from anyone but the debtor?


  8. #48

    Default Re: Council tax debt - who is responsible to pay

    how does the debtor provide proof that the car is not his?


    The debtor does not have too.
    Its the person who claims the goods belong to to prove they own them


  9. #49

    Default Re: Council tax debt - who is responsible to pay

    Quote Originally Posted by Will Goodfellow View Post
    In some circumstances it is impossible for the debtor to prove that goods are not his. If a bailiff calls at the last known address of a debtor who no longer lives there and clamps the car of the person who now lives there, how does the debtor provide proof that the car is not his? The person now living there may not even know the debtor personally, and if the owner of the car produces evidence that the car does not belong to the debtor, the bailiff should remove the clamp as he can no longer claim a belief that the car belongs to the debtor.

    Where does it state that the bailiff cannot accept proof of ownership of goods from anyone but the debtor?

    We have been through this, in such a case the bailiff will use his judgement, but it is for him to decide. If you are not happy it is interpleader time for the owner.


  10. #50

    Default Re: Council tax debt - who is responsible to pay

    I really don't see the problem. If the car has been taken and it does belong to someone else, surely it is plain that the issue is between the owner and the bailiff/creditor.

    Actually that is a little disingenuous, I do see the problem. A true reading of the act does nothing for the debt avoiders among us.


  11. #51

    Default Re: Council tax debt - who is responsible to pay

    Quote Originally Posted by Will Goodfellow View Post
    In some circumstances it is impossible for the debtWhere does it state that the bailiff cannot accept proof of ownership of goods from anyone but the debtor?
    Sorry I missed this post 45 first paragraph


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