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Thread: holiday pay

  1. #1
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    Default holiday pay

    I'm asking about holiday pay for my wife.

    She has a zero hours contract and today she has shown me her contract.

    The job was given to her by a friend.

    She was told the hourly rate was X amount (by the friend).

    The contract say the hourly rate is X amount (what she thought it was) but this also includes any holiday entitlement (12.07% of the hourly wage she is getting an hour). So if she has a week off she does not get paid anything for that week.

    She is working 40 hours a week and this oversight is costing her 5000 a year. She expects to be there for the best part of a year to complete a specific job.

    How does she resolve this?

    She wants this private company to offer her a permanent contract but i think if she raises questions she will not get this offer. She has been there for 14 weeks so far.

    I know "rolled up" contracts are illegal (according to the .gov.uk website).

    I look forward to any help.


  2. #2

    Default Re: holiday pay

    Hi.


    In case it's relevant, is your wife on the minimum wage please?


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  3. #3

    Default Re: holiday pay

    From: https://www.gov.uk/holiday-entitleme...pay-the-basics

    Rolled-up holiday pay

    Holiday pay should be paid for the time when annual leave is taken. An employer cannot include an amount for holiday pay in the hourly rate (known as ‘rolled-up holiday pay’). If a current contract still includes rolled-up pay, it needs to be re-negotiated.
    Please wait for the employment experts to drop in and comment on the situation before doing anything hasty.

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  4. #4
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    Default Re: holiday pay

    Rolled up holiday pay is not always unlawful, and is often paid as you describe on contracts like this. The point is whether, in her contract and payslip the holiday pay included is shown seperately. If it is, it's lawful and it's up to her to save it if she wants "paid holiday".

    If she raises a grievance, whether right or wrong, she is incredibly unlikely to keep the job or the friend who gave her the job.

    At that point, if the holiday pay is not clearly stated and she wishes to take this further, it's at her risk. Equally, if it is stated, she's losing nothing and the employer had done this correctly.

    Oh, and the .gov site is often wrong! It can't possibly cover all legal eventualities.


  5. #5

    Default Re: holiday pay

    The Working Time Directive is clear that holiday pay should be paid at the time that an employee takes holiday. Rolled up holiday pay is considered unlawful under the WTD however the UK implementation of the Directive was not (nor is) quite so specific. Although the Government guidance is that holiday pay is unlawful, and that holiday pay should be paid based on hours worked at the time of taking leave, any employer still using the practice of rolled up holiday pay will have a defence to any claim for non-payment of holiday pay so long as the 'rolled up' element of pay is clearly separated and documented as such on the payslip. There is also a recommendation that any contracts still in place where rolled up holiday pay is used should be renegotiated

    So the shortened version of the above is that yes, it is unlawful, but in terms of what can happen as a result is very little so long as the contract and payslips make it transparent that there is one rate of pay for the job (which cannot be below NLW/NMW) and a separate pay element representing the rolled up holiday pay. The employee must also be free to book (and should be made to take) the statutory minimum annual leave entitlement. The contract does though need to be renegotiated so that leave is paid at the time it is taken

    EDIT - crossed posts with Sangie - sorry

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  6. #6
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    Default Re: holiday pay

    My wife is getting over NMW.

    The payslips show her hourly rate but no mention of holiday pay.

    Her contract does clearly show her hourly rate includes 12.07% holiday pay.

    Thank you for your replies so far.


  7. #7

    Default Re: holiday pay

    as it's zero hours, she can just stop any time she gets a new job.


    but perhap a conversation with her friend first would be helpful!

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  8. #8
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    Default Re: holiday pay

    She's tried talking to her friend but she does not know anything about employment law. Her friend (who works there on over double the wage) was told the wage was XX.XX an hour but did not say whether holiday was or was not included in that figure.

    Her contract says she has to give a week's notice, if she wants to leave.

    My wife should have either queried this when she was given the contract or shown it to me.

    In this part of the country employment is so poor she's grateful to have a job.


  9. #9

    Default Re: holiday pay

    she can just refuse any shfts while working her notice = no actual notice



    otherwise it is not zero hours

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  10. #10

    Default Re: holiday pay

    as it is a zero hours contract she can decide whe she wants to take a break and there is nothing the employer can do, that is what zero hours contracts are about. in practice it would be wise to forewarn them about having a holiday so they can make arrangements where necessary.
    Now as said, uplift legal but unusual for people on 40 hour weeks and working year round check that the sums add up correctly. I cant see that she could possibly lose 5k a year unless she is on a contract that pays 25 per hour before the uplift

    As for notice period, a zero hours contract means no notice is needed.
    All his tells me employer just cant be bothered to make much effort so she shpouldnt expect much in the way of appreciation and loyalty


  11. #11
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    Default Re: holiday pay

    Quote Originally Posted by ericsbrother View Post
    as it is a zero hours contract she can decide whe she wants to take a break and there is nothing the employer can do, that is what zero hours contracts are about. in practice it would be wise to forewarn them about having a holiday so they can make arrangements where necessary.
    Now as said, uplift legal but unusual for people on 40 hour weeks and working year round check that the sums add up correctly. I cant see that she could possibly lose 5k a year unless she is on a contract that pays 25 per hour before the uplift

    As for notice period, a zero hours contract means no notice is needed.
    All his tells me employer just cant be bothered to make much effort so she shpouldnt expect much in the way of appreciation and loyalty
    Thanks for your replies.

    Her hourly wage is supposed to be 10 per hour plus holiday. I have calculated she is on 8.92 per hour plus 1.08 rolled up holiday.

    I got my sums wrong and she is 48 a week short (if she accepted rolled up leave).


  12. #12
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    Default Re: holiday pay

    Just for the record


    If you raise a grievance under the working time regulations you shouldn't suffer detriments or be dismissed

    see section 45A and section 101A of the Employment Rights Acts 1996

    see also sections 31 and 32 of the Working Time Regulation 1998

    Most times, you shouldn't suffer any form of detriment when you ascertain a statutory rights


  13. #13

    Default Re: holiday pay

    is that written down somewhere? If 10ph plus holiday pay it will be 11.20ph. Ohter than that she can claim holiday pay based on the number of hours worked per year as per the govt calculator If it is 10 inclusiveas you have calculated then does it say that in writing somewhere.
    ?


    .
    Quote Originally Posted by caring guy View Post
    Thanks for your replies.

    Her hourly wage is supposed to be 10 per hour plus holiday. I have calculated she is on 8.92 per hour plus 1.08 rolled up holiday.

    I got my sums wrong and she is 48 a week short (if she accepted rolled up leave).



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