Marc Gander - The Consumer Survival Handbook


A 220 page introduction to all things consumer related by our own BankFodder.

Includes energy companies, mobile phone providers, retailers, banks, insurance companies,debt collection agencies, reclaim companies, secondhand car sellers, cowboy garages, cowboy builders and all the rest who put their own profits before you.

£6.99



Patricia Pearl - Small Claims Procedure - A Practical Guide


An excellent guide for the layperson in how to use the County Court - a must if you are intending to start a claim.

£19.99 + £1.50 (P&P)


Page 2 of 4 FirstFirst 1 2 3 4 LastLast
Results 21 to 40 of 68
  1. #21
    Basic Account Holder
    Do you record your calls?
    You'll regret it if you don't.




    Follow Real_CAG on Twitter
    Cagger since : Mar 2017

    Posts
    230

    Default Re: Employment tribunal

    Quote Originally Posted by Sangie595 View Post
    If you check, and if you understand what your are reading, every single one lists victimisation as an associated claim to one of the relevant main claims. Victimisation cannot be claimed as a stand alone. If discrimination claims fall, then there is no claim with which to associate victimisation. It had absolutely nothing too do with the minds of the judges. It has everything to do with the law.
    The OP is invited to read the above case laws and decide on the merit of his Claim.I have given him the tools to make up his mind.I'm not trying to force my opinion on him
    Neither should you.

    If you believe that these case laws aren't relevant then you should distinguish them from his case you failed to.You failed to provide relevant case law to support your position
    You claim "it has everything to do with the law"Yet you failed to provide the law.

    Section 27 of the Equality Act 2010 gives protection against victimization after raising a grievance

    I'm yet to see your "law" Woodhouse v West North West Homes Leeds Ltd is the case law in support of that law.

    Your statement "It had absolutely nothing too do with the minds of the judges" shows that your position has no basis in law

    Follows
    0
    Following
    0

  2. #22

    Default Re: Employment tribunal

    Quote Originally Posted by dondada View Post



    Hanif Mohammed T/A Mohammed & Co Solicitors v Jackson UKEAT/0370/12/SM - The claimant worked at a solicitors firm when she became pregnant. She had a termination and was off work for a few weeks suffering from the physical and psychological effects of the termination and the stress at work.



    Thompson v London Central Bus Company Ltd UKEAT/0108/15/DM - His claim of victimisation "on an associative basis" was struck out at the ET.



    Woodhouse v West North West Homes Leeds Ltd UKEAT/0007/12/SM - The tribunal held that the employee's case was "on all fours" with Martin (above) and upheld his victimisation claim. The EAT overturned the tribunal's decision, (ie he lost!)



    I believe case laws are best as they give insight into the minds of the judges

    I beleive they show in a majority of cases the claimant loses. Got any better cases, more relevant to the situation here?

    Never assume anyone on the internet is who they say they are. Only rely on advice from insured professionals you have paid for!
    Follows
    0
    Following
    0

  3. #23

    Default Re: Employment tribunal

    Quote Originally Posted by dondada View Post

    Woodhouse v West North West Homes Leeds Ltd is the case law in support of that law



    Overturned at appeal. Thus not helpful to the OP.

    Never assume anyone on the internet is who they say they are. Only rely on advice from insured professionals you have paid for!
    Follows
    0
    Following
    0

  4. #24
    Basic Account Holder
    Do you record your calls?
    You'll regret it if you don't.




    Follow Real_CAG on Twitter
    Cagger since : Mar 2017

    Posts
    230

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Emmzzi View Post
    Overturned at appeal. Thus not helpful to the OP.


    Please can you provide the link!


    It is courteous to provide evidence of any statement made


    Woodhouse is a well known case law on victimisation

    I would really love you to provide the link


  5. #25
    Basic Account Holder
    Do you record your calls?
    You'll regret it if you don't.




    Follow Real_CAG on Twitter
    Cagger since : Mar 2017

    Posts
    230

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Emmzzi View Post
    Overturned at appeal. Thus not helpful to the OP.
    I really don't understand how you read this case

    I will be expecting your link

    https://www.xperthr.co.uk/editors-choice/victimisation-multiple-grievances-made-in-good-faith-are-protected-acts/116357/

    Here is my link anyway


  6. #26
    Basic Account Holder
    Do you record your calls?
    You'll regret it if you don't.




    Follow Real_CAG on Twitter
    Cagger since : Jan 2017

    Posts
    56

    Default Re: Employment tribunal

    Quote Originally Posted by dondada View Post
    The discrimination and sexual harassment Claim would be out if I follow your statement

    You could still put it and ask the Tribunal to accept as it would be just and equitable to do so

    Although "Just and Equitable" has a low threshold but you still need to do some research
    I need to do some research about it. I was concentrating on showing that all the events are continuous acts and are closely related and dependent on each other. Sexual harassment atmosphere has been encouraged, enabled and defended by the shop manager, who turned blind eye to her complains and then refused her assistance on racial and discriminatory grounds. Further company failing to conduct proper investigation - not obtaining key evidence, not taking into account key evidence, not cross referencing employees, not acting upon key findings of the investigation, not making mandatory equality employee cources has continued with the enabling of the harassment for any future employees.

    There is some very interesting case law, supporting my argument, will post it later, after I choose which ones to use.


  7. #27
    Basic Account Holder
    Do you record your calls?
    You'll regret it if you don't.




    Follow Real_CAG on Twitter
    Cagger since : Jan 2017

    Posts
    56

    Default Re: Employment tribunal

    And for everyone's benefit and peace of mind I state again I also am of the strong belief that she needs lawyer. Due to time constraints I need to write the particulars of claim to best of my abilities today. After that we have consultation with a lawyer and in meantime I will fire the particulars of claim to the no win no fee solicitors and see if anyone will like the case.


  8. #28
    Basic Account Holder
    Do you record your calls?
    You'll regret it if you don't.




    Follow Real_CAG on Twitter
    Cagger since : Mar 2017

    Posts
    230

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Ayho View Post
    I need to do some research about it. I was concentrating on showing that all the events are continuous acts and are closely related and dependent on each other. Sexual harassment atmosphere has been encouraged, enabled and defended by the shop manager, who turned blind eye to her complains and then refused her assistance on racial and discriminatory grounds. Further company failing to conduct proper investigation - not obtaining key evidence, not taking into account key evidence, not cross referencing employees, not acting upon key findings of the investigation, not making mandatory equality employee cources has continued with the enabling of the harassment for any future employees.

    There is some very interesting case law, supporting my argument, will post it later, after I choose which ones to use.
    I believe you are a person with reasonable intelligence.You have all the facts about the case.My job is just to point you in the direction of relevant case laws
    I could also give you tips and suggestions.At the end of the day, you make your own decision.You are smart and intelligent enough.It would be arrogant of me to say you don't know what you are doing

    In particular, when I don't have all the facts

    Wish you all the best and feel free to ask any question

    Follows
    0
    Following
    0

  9. #29

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by dondada View Post


    My job is just to point you in the direction of relevant case laws

    1) itís not your job, itís your hobby
    2) has the OPs friend put in SEVEN ET claims and TEN grievances? Because that is what the case you are quoting is about. And do they also fancy the stress of months and months in court?


  10. #30
    Basic Account Holder
    Do you record your calls?
    You'll regret it if you don't.




    Follow Real_CAG on Twitter
    Cagger since : Jan 2017

    Posts
    56

    Default Re: Employment tribunal

    Thank you. I really appreciate your help. It is very difficult time for me too and it is good to know that you think I might be able to help. I cannot abandon my friend and say ''tough luck, you are on your own''. I thought this website is about the same too. I plead to the people participating in this thread to be civil to each other and if they can to contributeicon with advice. If they cannot help me I respect their decision, but please don't put extra pressure on me. I am doing my best, I ask you to do the same.


  11. #31
    Basic Account Holder
    Do you record your calls?
    You'll regret it if you don't.




    Follow Real_CAG on Twitter
    Cagger since : Jan 2017

    Posts
    56

    Default Re: Employment tribunal

    i am trying to connect the incidents out of the 3 month period at the moment with the more current ones. About the argument of being ''just and equitable to do so'' is that enshrined in specific legislation or just in the spirit of the law ? Anyone can provide legislation or case law ? I am really short on time, have to finish in couple of hours time latest before we see the lawyer. i am hoping, if I make things easier for her, she will be more inclined to accept no win, no fee. Also will send the form to other no win , no fee law firms. Hopefully someone will respond, as ET1 has to be submitted tomorrow the latest.


  12. #32
    Basic Account Holder
    Do you record your calls?
    You'll regret it if you don't.




    Follow Real_CAG on Twitter
    Cagger since : Mar 2017

    Posts
    230

    Default Re: Employment tribunal

    Quote Originally Posted by Ayho View Post
    i am trying to connect the incidents out of the 3 month period at the moment with the more current ones. About the argument of being ''just and equitable to do so'' is that enshrined in specific legislation or just in the spirit of the law ? Anyone can provide legislation or case law ? I am really short on time, have to finish in couple of hours time latest before we see the lawyer. i am hoping, if I make things easier for her, she will be more inclined to accept no win, no fee. Also will send the form to other no win , no fee law firms. Hopefully someone will respond, as ET1 has to be submitted tomorrow the latest.
    Just and Equitable is seen in section 123 of the EqA2010

    https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga...15/section/123

    There are a lot of case law relating to that.Just a little tip

    Under the CPR 17, you don't need a Judge permission to amend your POCicon before it is served on the other side.The Employment Tribunal is more user-friendly
    If after you put in your Claim and you feel you could do better, then you can amend it (provided it is within 2 weeks).Note, it becomes more difficult to amend after that.

    Give it your best shot anyway, I believe if you are diligent you would do okay.My suggestion is that at the bottom of your POCicon, you state I reserve the right to amend this Claim
    While in the true sense of the word, you may no longer have the right, it would give you some leeway before a lenient judge
    I hope you understand that point.

    Back to "Just and Equitable" Some of the factors the Judge takes into consideration are

    1. Gravity of the Allegation ie how serious they are
    2. How pleaded is your POC (most LIP score very low here so don't worry)
    3. Your conduct so far

    But like I said, you need to do loads of research.The knowledge you have personally is what is going to sail you over
    The more diligent you are the more likely a Judge would sit up and take notice of you.Judges get a lot of rubbish LIPs (and lawyers also) But when he sees the effort you have taken then he would be more lenient even if you get one or two things wrong.

    I will repeat myself to the point of being annoying; Do loads of Research!

    Wish you all the best

    Follows
    0
    Following
    0

  13. #33
    Basic Account Holder
    Do you record your calls?
    You'll regret it if you don't.




    Follow Real_CAG on Twitter
    Cagger since : Jan 2017

    Posts
    56

    Default Re: Employment tribunal

    Simply perfect. These paragraphs will make it easy for me to even argue that continuous acts should be until the appeal of the grievance decision - with good luck. Without luck it should go to at least the final outburst of shop manager and even that way everything will be inside the 3 month period.

    About stating that I reserve the right to amend this claim- this is very good tip. eventually if case is taken by a lawyer, they can amend it to their liking.

    Your comments about LIP, I am aware of that and was hoping myself that the judges will look sympathetically and will be more lenient.


  14. #34

    Default Re: Employment tribunal

    My very best advice is not to quote case law you don't have a full understanding of because the judge will see it as timewasting.

    Stick to the known facts. Keep it simple and focused. Don't ramble. Don't use law you are not sure of.

    Because suggesting your case is just like case X when it is not, is just handing ammunition to opposing counsel to get it struck out at first read, with no hearing at all. Opposing counsel love to make you look stupid. Quoting incorrect facts is like loading their gun.

    Stick to the knitting, There has been harassment. The internal processes have been followed by your friend in the hope of attaining justice and a good working relationship going forward. You believe the outcome to be unfair.

    Never assume anyone on the internet is who they say they are. Only rely on advice from insured professionals you have paid for!
    Follows
    0
    Following
    0

  15. #35
    Basic Account Holder
    Do you record your calls?
    You'll regret it if you don't.




    Follow Real_CAG on Twitter
    Cagger since : Jan 2017

    Posts
    56

    Default Re: Employment tribunal

    Quote Originally Posted by Emmzzi View Post
    My very best advice is not to quote case law you don't have a full understanding of because the judge will see it as timewasting.

    Stick to the known facts. Keep it simple and focused. Don't ramble. Don't use law you are not sure of.

    Because suggesting your case is just like case X when it is not, is just handing ammunition to opposing counsel to get it struck out at first read, with no hearing at all. Opposing counsel love to make you look stupid. Quoting incorrect facts is like loading their gun.

    Stick to the knitting, There has been harassment. The internal processes have been followed by your friend in the hope of attaining justice and a good working relationship going forward. You believe the outcome to be unfair.
    Good advice, will take it to heart, thank you


  16. #36

    Default Re: Employment tribunal

    Quote Originally Posted by Ayho View Post
    Good advice, will take it to heart, thank you
    I hope you do get a no win no fee offer because that's usually a decent sign you may have a case. Keep us posted!

    Never assume anyone on the internet is who they say they are. Only rely on advice from insured professionals you have paid for!
    Follows
    0
    Following
    0

  17. #37
    Basic Account Holder
    Do you record your calls?
    You'll regret it if you don't.




    Follow Real_CAG on Twitter
    Cagger since : Mar 2017

    Posts
    230

    Default Re: Employment tribunal

    Quote Originally Posted by Emmzzi View Post
    My very best advice is not to quote case law you don't have a full understanding of because the judge will see it as timewasting.

    Stick to the known facts. Keep it simple and focused. Don't ramble. Don't use law you are not sure of.

    Because suggesting your case is just like case X when it is not, is just handing ammunition to opposing counsel to get it struck out at first read, with no hearing at all. Opposing counsel love to make you look stupid. Quoting incorrect facts is like loading their gun.

    Stick to the knitting, There has been harassment. The internal processes have been followed by your friend in the hope of attaining justice and a good working relationship going forward. You believe the outcome to be unfair.

    I must admit, well stated!

    I couldn't have said it better. Well done


  18. #38
    Basic Account Holder
    Do you record your calls?
    You'll regret it if you don't.




    Follow Real_CAG on Twitter
    Cagger since : Mar 2017

    Posts
    230

    Default Re: Employment tribunal

    Quote Originally Posted by Ayho View Post
    Simply perfect. These paragraphs will make it easy for me to even argue that continuous acts should be until the appeal of the grievance decision - with good luck. Without luck it should go to at least the final outburst of shop manager and even that way everything will be inside the 3 month period.

    About stating that I reserve the right to amend this claim- this is very good tip. eventually if case is taken by a lawyer, they can amend it to their liking.

    Your comments about LIP, I am aware of that and was hoping myself that the judges will look sympathetically and will be more lenient.
    You are making a classic human mistake here.You are looking at your weak point.No! you don't do that!You have a strong victimization claim

    CCTV images were not obtained!
    Screenshots were not considered!

    You put your best foot forward.You state your victimization claim strongly.Then point out to the Judge that your friend tried to do the right thing by following the internal procedure.Point out that if your friend had come straight to the Tribunal she wouldn't have been out of time with her harassment and discrimination Claim

    She did the right thing hence it will be Just and Equitable to extend time. I repeat myself; put your best foot forward.
    Just thinking of this case makes me angry;Your friend's child was ill, rather than allay her fears, her colleague increased it by saying "your daughter could be pregnant"!
    How can any reasonable person say that it was in good intentions!

    I will say this a thousand times; Do your Research!

    Follows
    0
    Following
    0

  19. #39
    Basic Account Holder
    Do you record your calls?
    You'll regret it if you don't.




    Follow Real_CAG on Twitter
    Cagger since : Mar 2017

    Posts
    230

    Default Re: Employment tribunal

    Also, if there is any screenshot of jokes made AFTER your friend had put in her grievance then you can exhibit that as evidence of a continuous state of affair.

    In order words, a continuing act.Note that the online form accepts only 2500 characters (and a further 2500).However, you could attach another document

    It has to be in Notepad or Wordpad. The website doesn't accept MsWord yet.Put as much as you can in the online form though as that is what the Judge would look at
    He, most likely, wouldn't read the attachment initially.I know I will now annoy you but I will still repeat myself; do loads of research!

    Wish you all the best

    Follows
    0
    Following
    0

  20. #40

    Default Re: Employment tribunal

    Dondada, would it be possible to tell us how many tribunal cases you've been involved in please?

    HB


Page 2 of 4 FirstFirst 1 2 3 4 LastLast

Tags for this Thread


Reclaim the Right Ltd. - reg.05783665 in the UK reg. office:- 923 Finchley Road London NW11 7PE
We use cookies to personalise content and ads and to provide social media features. We also share information about your use of our site with our advertising and analytics partners. See details