Marc Gander - The Consumer Survival Handbook


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Patricia Pearl - Small Claims Procedure - A Practical Guide


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  1. #1
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    Default Likelyhood of trading standards pursuing complaint?

    Ok, 1st post on here so bare with me....

    Bought a car in mid Feb this year for 3.5k, 6weeks later an engine mount fails and the dealer tries to fob off with "I'll get it fixed for you at trade cost". I use my right to reject and compose a letter to demand it repaired under the CRAicon.

    At this point I find out that the dealer xxx motor company, is actually xxxx body repairs (I won't name and shame as we are still in dispute). The sales invoice hadn't included this info and I wasn't made aware at time of sale.

    If I'd known I was buying from a body repair shop I wouldn't have bought the vehicle. The company director is also his wife, but under her maiden name on companies house. So it took me a bit of FB stalking and 2hrs searching on companies house to even be sure who to reject the vehicle to.

    I get no responce, so compose another letter, giving more detail on the fault and why I'm rejecting. Then get a letter back from "law firm". Basically saying it's an old car so it'll break down, deal with it. I reply with chapter and verse, an mention that their 'member' did not disclose who they are on the sales receipt along with a request to confirm the milage at time of sale as my invoice says exactly 75,000. So in the eyes of the law I had completed only 150miles.balso for copies of a service check on the vehicle and or pdi as I have no copies given to me at time of sale.

    They come back two weeks later with, yes the dealer rounded up the milage on the sales receipt! (illegal) And have included a copy of a pdi and service. Turns out the service check was completed after I'd laid down my deposit and taken for a test drive (also illegal) . So he had no idea the condition of the vehicle when he put it on the forecourt, I took a testdrive in what could have been a death trap.

    At this point Ive already contacted the back for a chargeback. Which has gone into my bank account, but he can still dispute in the next 6 weeks. I've responded to "law firm" with your member has committed a criminal offence(s) and I'll take it to small claimsicon if he tries to refute the chargeback.

    Due to the severity of the above and flat refusal of liability on the dealers part I've also reported direct to the local trading standards with the above info and evidence to back it up.

    Now I'm happy to take home to scc if required as I'm 100% I'd get cost of the car back just on the mis selling of the vehicle under the wrong trading name. However, how likely are trading standards to take action and if so how do I find out if they have?

    He's basically only checking cars after they are sold (if at all as service check sheet could have been completed at any point in the last 4 months), and is pretending his main trade is a car dealership rather than a body repair shop. He could potentially be taking vehicles that have come through the body repair shop, offering customers a part ex and doing a quick fix to what could be prang on a vehicle and then selling on for big profit through the sales site (what I suspect with my car due to the type of fail and his reaction on the phone).

    Oh and here is the crux, he also didn't include Ltd on the sales invoice (or any other documents) so he or his wife could be personally liable rather that the Ltd company she is director of (there is a case law which proves this).
    If I do have to take to scc - who do I serve against? The Ltd Co. He who sold the car and signed the invoice or her who is sole director of the Ltd company?

    This could end up losing him his marriageicon as well as business.

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  2. #2
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    Default Re: Likelyhood of trading standards pursuing complaint?

    .....................
    Quote Originally Posted by Barlowjc View Post
    Ok, 1st post on here so bare with me....

    Bought a car in mid Feb this year for 3.5k, 6weeks later an engine mount fails and the dealer tries to fob off with "I'll get it fixed for you at trade cost". I use my right to reject and compose a letter to demand it repaired under the CRAicon. YOUR RIGHT TO REJECT IS 30 DAYS NOT 6 WEEKS.

    At this point I find out that the dealer xxx motor company, is actually xxxx body repairs (I won't name and shame as we are still in dispute). The sales invoice hadn't included this info and I wasn't made aware at time of sale. SO WHAT?

    If I'd known I was buying from a body repair shop I wouldn't have bought the vehicle. The company director is also his wife, but under her maiden name on companies house. So it took me a bit of FB stalking and 2hrs searching on companies house to even be sure who to reject the vehicle to. SO WHAT?

    I get no responce, so compose another letter, giving more detail on the fault and why I'm rejecting. Then get a letter back from "law firm". Basically saying it's an old car so it'll break down, deal with it. I reply with chapter and verse, an mention that their 'member' did not disclose who they are on the sales receipt along with a request to confirm the milage at time of sale as my invoice says exactly 75,000. So in the eyes of the law I had completed only 150miles.balso for copies of a service check on the vehicle and or pdi as I have no copies given to me at time of sale. IF THE ACTUAL MILEAGE WAS SAY 74600 AND HE PUT 75000 THATS FINE.

    They come back two weeks later with, yes the dealer rounded up the milage on the sales receipt! (illegal) NO IT'S NOT And have included a copy of a pdi and service. Turns out the service check was completed after I'd laid down my deposit and taken for a test drive (also illegal) NO ITS NOT So he had no idea the condition of the vehicle when he put it on the forecourt, I took a testdrive in what could have been a death trap. BUT IT WASN'T SO YOU SUFFERED NO LOSS.

    At this point Ive already contacted the back for a chargeback. Which has gone into my bank account, but he can still dispute in the next 6 weeks. I've responded to "law firm" with your member has committed a criminal offence(s) NO HE HASN'T and I'll take it to small claimsicon if he tries to refute the chargeback. BEST OF LUCK WITH THAT

    Due to the severity SEVERITY? REALLY? of the above and flat refusal of liability LIABLE FOR WHAT? on the dealers part I've also reported direct to the local trading standards with the above info and evidence to back it up. NOTHING I CAN SEE HERE TO BACK UP TBQH

    Now I'm happy to take home to scc if required as I'm 100% I'd get cost of the car back just on the mis selling of the vehicle under the wrong trading name. I'D SAY NO BETTER THAN 50% TBH However, how likely are trading standards to take action and if so how do I find out if they have? NOT VERY LIKELY AT ALL IF THIS IS THE ONLY COMPLAINT, MORE LIKELY IF IT IS A TRADER ALREADY ON THEIR RADAR

    He's basically only checking cars after they are sold and is pretending his main trade is a car dealership rather than a body repair shop. He could potentially be taking vehicles that have come through the body repair shop, offering customers a part ex and doing a quick fix to what could be prang on a vehicle and then selling on for big profit through the sales site HE'S PERFECTLY WITHIN HIS RIGHTS TO DO THAT AS LONG AS HE'S NOT SELLING INSURANCE WRITE OFFS WITHOUT DECLARING IT.(what I suspect with my car due to the type of fail and his reaction on the phone).



  3. #3
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    Default Re: Likelyhood of trading standards pursuing complaint?

    ok, in response to Oddjobbob's now deleted ? quote.


    law regards not including his correct company contact info:
    The Company, Limited Liability Partnership and Business (Names and Trading Disclosures) Regulations 2015 section 25 (1), they should disclose appropriated information as set out in section 25 (2)(b)(a)

    incorrectly writing the mileage on a sales invoice is a breach under the Consumer Protection From Unfair Tradingicon Regulations 2008. It has to be the exact mileage on the day of sale, not one mile under or over. its apparently approx 900+ in my case which works in my favour with the vehicle breakdown and right to reject (for repair, which i requested at the time, not a refund), but neither i nor he knows what the correct mileage is on the day of sale, that's one reason why its the law.

    Putting the car through mechanical due diligence prior to putting it up for sale or on a forecourt is also covered under Consumer Protection from Unfair Trading Regulations 2008.

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  4. #4
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    Default Re: Likelyhood of trading standards pursuing complaint?

    HE'S PERFECTLY WITHIN HIS RIGHTS TO DO THAT AS LONG AS HE'S NOT SELLING INSURANCE WRITE OFFS WITHOUT DECLARING
    He is, but the point Is had I known his primary business was body repairs rather than car trading I wouldn't have bought from him. Trading under a trading name which is different to your company name is legal as long as you declare it and show it on all company paperwork and especially sales receipts.
    It's also an obstruction, as without a company name and number on the sales invoice its more difficult to prove who you are dealing/trading with.
    After my letter pointing this out he has subsequently updated his Web site with the correct company info.

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  5. #5
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    Default Re: Likelyhood of trading standards pursuing complaint?

    You have some good ammunitions.
    Firstly, your sale receipt doesn't mention the ltd company so you can go after the person who sold you the car personally.
    Secondly, you had a written record of having covered only 150 miles with the car. This was the best evidence that the car was faulty at point of sale, but then you disputed the mileage recorded on the receipt (as far as i understand, please confirm).
    Frankly i have seen dealers being economical with mileage record, never record 900 miles more.
    Thirdly, your bank is on your side at the moment, so hold tight and remind them of the CRAicon.
    Crucial point: What's the make model and year of this vehicle? Price paid?
    I ask because if you bought a 1990 car for 100 you would expect for things not to be perfect, differently if you bought a 2 year old car for 20k with fsh.
    So please update.


  6. #6
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    Default Re: Likelyhood of trading standards pursuing complaint?

    I didn't dispute the milage on the sales receipt, I just asked the law firm to confirm I'd only completed 150miles. They are the ones disputing it, and have provided admission that the dealer rounded it up.
    Im waiting on reply at the moment to see if he'll fight the bank, they issued the chargeback based on supply of faulty goods. The issues on the invoice won't come into play.

    It was a 10+ year old Vw Touran and approx 3.5k. Which is approx market value for the car considering age and mileage.
    My point is that he didnt check if the car was on good condition prior to selling or advertising it he's in the wrong. He may not have known that there was a fault with the car, but thats the issue. He should have checked it over prior to taking a deposit.


  7. #7
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    Default Re: Likelyhood of trading standards pursuing complaint?

    Frankly, and as usual on this site, people who don't know the in's and outs are getting involved and those that do get their posts clipped, edited or deleted. No doubt this one will be too. however, whilst you have a point with a fault your attitude is not going to help you. Frankly given the nature of the fault, it's not a major issue and does not prevent the use of the car.


    Can't see why you're being so aggressive as you obviously know nothing about cars.


  8. #8
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    Default Re: Likelyhood of trading standards pursuing complaint?

    Engine mount failed completely, ie most likely the bolts snapped. The bolts need replacing on this car when you do a cam belt as they are designed to shear in an accident. If you don't replace them and reuse the old ones they can fail several 1000 miles after the cam belt has been changed.

    As a result the Engine shifted (dramatically, I suggest you Google it), cam belt shredded and clutch went to floor (clutch / gear box issue).

    Vehicle is undrivable and had to be towed back to the garage.

    Dealer has had the car 4 months and other than confirming (last week) that the engine mount has failed, has provided any other info in the car.

    However all of this is irrelevant, as has nothing to do with my question.

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  9. #9
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    Default Re: Likelyhood of trading standards pursuing complaint?

    And the question in a nutshell is???


  10. #10
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by heliosuk View Post
    And the question in a nutshell is???
    How likely are trading standards to take action?


  11. #11
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    Default Re: Likelyhood of trading standards pursuing complaint?

    Very unlikely to be honest, your case isn't exactly watertight in a lot of aspects. What action do you expect trading standards to take and why?


  12. #12
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    Default Re: Likelyhood of trading standards pursuing complaint?

    I regret to have to inform you that Trading Standards are no longer the consumer's friend that you might believe.

    They do not get involved in individual cases unless a strong public interest is apparent. They might note it and should they have several complaints against the same trader, look further to see if there is systemic breaches of the Consumer Laws.

    There is no longer a direct access to Trading Standards, you have to go through your local Citizen's Advice Bureau instead.

    My time as a Police Officer and subsequently time working within the Motor Trade gives me certain insights into the problems that consumers may encounter.
    I have no legal qualifications.
    If you have found my post helpful, please enhance my reputation by clicking on the star. Thank you
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