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    • Euro have got a lot wrong and have failed to comply with the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 Schedule 4.  According to Section 13 after ECP have written to Arval they should then send a NTH to the Hirer  which they have done.This eliminates Arval from any further pursuit by ECP. When they wrote to your company they should have sent copies of everything that they asked Arval for. This is to prove that your company agree what happened on the day of the breach. If ECP then comply with the Act they are allowed to pursue the hirer. If they fail, to comply they cannot make the hirer pay. They can pursue until they are blue in the face but the Hirer is not lawfully required to pay them and if it went to Court ECP would lose. Your company could say who was driving but the only person that can be pursued is the Hirer, there does not appear to be an extension for a driver to be pursued. Even if there was, because ECP have failed miserably to comply with the Act  they still have no chance of winning in Court. Here are the relevant Hire sections from the Act below.
    • Thank-you FTMDave for your feedback. May I take this opportunity to say that after reading numerous threads to which you are a contributor, I have great admiration for you. You really do go above and beyond in your efforts to help other people. The time you put in to help, in particular with witness statements is incredible. I am also impressed by the way in which you will defer to others with more experience should there be a particular point that you are not 100% clear on and return with answers or advice that you have sought. I wish I had the ability to help others as you do. There is another forum expert that I must also thank for his time and patience answering my questions and allowing me to come to a “penny drops” moment on one particular issue. I believe he has helped me immensely to understand and to strengthen my own case. I shall not mention who it is here at the moment just in case he would rather I didn't but I greatly appreciate the time he took working through that issue with me. I spent 20+ years of working in an industry that rules and regulations had to be strictly adhered to, indeed, exams had to be taken in order that one had to become qualified in those rules and regulations in order to carry out the duties of the post. In a way, such things as PoFA 2012 are rules and regulations that are not completely alien to me. It has been very enjoyable for me to learn these regulations and the law surrounding them. I wish I had found this forum years ago. I admit that perhaps I had been too keen to express my opinions given that I am still in the learning process. After a suitable period in this industry I became Qualified to teach the rules and regulations and I always said to those I taught that there is no such thing as a stupid question. If opinions, theories and observations are put forward, discussion can take place and as long as the result is that the student is able to clearly see where they went wrong and got to that moment where the penny drops then that is a valuable learning experience. No matter how experienced one is, there is always something to learn and if I did not know the answer to a question, I would say, I don't know the answer to that question but I will go and find out what the answer is. In any posts I have made, I have stated, “unless I am wrong” or “as far as I can see” awaiting a response telling me what I got wrong, if it was wrong. If I am wrong I am only too happy to admit it and take it as a valuable learning experience. I take the point that perhaps I should not post on other peoples threads and I shall refrain from doing so going forward. 🤐 As alluded to, circumstances can change, FTMDave made the following point that it had been boasted that no Caggers, over two years, who had sent a PPC the wrong registration snotty letter, had even been taken to court, let alone lost a court hearing .... but now they have. I too used the word "seemed" because it is true, we haven't had all the details. After perusing this forum I believe certain advice changed here after the Beavis case, I could be wrong but that is what I seem to remember reading. Could it be that after winning the above case in question, a claimant could refer back to this case and claim that a defendant had not made use of the appeal process, therefore allowing the claimant to win? Again, in this instance only, I do not know what is to be gained by not making an appeal or concealing the identity of the driver, especially if it is later admitted that the defendant was the driver and was the one to input the incorrect VRN in error. So far no one has educated me as to the reason why. But, of course, when making an appeal, it should be worded carefully so that an error in the appeal process cannot be referred back to. I thought long and hard about whether or not to post here but I wanted to bring up this point for discussion. Yes, I admit I have limited knowledge, but does that mean I should have kept silent? After I posted that I moved away from this forum slightly to find other avenues to increase my knowledge. I bought a law book and am now following certain lawyers on Youtube in the hope of arming myself with enough ammunition to use in my own case. In one video titled “7 Reasons You Will LOSE Your Court Case (and how to avoid them)” by Black Belt Barrister I believe he makes my point by saying the following, and I quote: “If you ignore the complaint in the first instance and it does eventually end up in court then it's going to look bad that you didn't co-operate in the first place. The court is not going to look kindly on you simply ignoring the company and not, let's say, availing yourself of any kind of appeal opportunities, particularly if we are talking about parking charge notices and things like that.” This point makes me think that, it is not such a bizarre judgement in the end. Only in the case of having proof of payment and inputting an incorrect VRN .... could it be worthwhile making a carefully worded appeal in the first instance? .... If the appeal fails, depending on the reason, surely this could only help if it went to court? As always, any feedback gratefully received.
    • To which official body does one make a formal complaint about a LPA fixed charge receiver? Does one make a complaint first to the company employing the appointed individuals?    Or can one complain immediately to an official body, such as nara?    I've tried researching but there doesn't seem a very clear route on how to legally hold them to account for wrongful behaviour.  It seems frustratingly complicated because they are considered to be officers of the court and held in high esteem - and the borrower is deemed liable for their actions.  Yet what does the borrower do when disclosure shows clear evidence of wrong-doing? Does anyone have any pointers please?
    • Less than 1% of Japan's top companies are led by women despite years of efforts to address the issue.View the full article
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BT Basic Broandband + internet***Resolved***


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BT basic + broadband at £10 per month with no hidden extras as long as you are on a qualifying benefit it sounded a great option for me I have been long term unemployed and spend more than that each fortnight on PAYG to search for jobs.

 

I read the website and it mentioned them sending a form out they would need back so I gave the free phone number a ring.

 

So the first person I spoke to asked what benefit I was on, confirmed I was eligible and echoed basically what the website said and the forms would be in the post.

 

10 minuets after ending the call they rang back told me a date for installation was set up and took my bank details for direct debit.

 

I was taken back to be honest I thought they wanted the paperwork back and assumed they had already made the necessary checks.

 

Obviously happy now I did not have to wait for the forms to filled and returned and a date set for installation I was well chuffed with the service so far.

 

Again everything went well installation complete and the service was as to be expected, finally could jobsearch without too much worry of cost.

 

First bill came and as promised the cost was £10 which went out my account.

 

Whoopee great finally something altruistic on the part of a big business hats of to bt.

 

Then the whoopsie hit the fan.

 

First indication something was wrong was my next bill was £47 and clearly something was wrong here.

 

At the earliest opportunity I rang the helpline and was informed that as I did not return the forms they sent out to confirm I am on benefits and they can check I had been upgraded to a premium service.

 

I never received any form to send back I wrongly assumed it had all been set up.

 

So I cancelled the direct debit (if £46 went out my account I would starve ) then learned bt would add a further charge to my bill £10 for a failed payment, so I had to change my method of payment over to bill which was a £2.50 charge but less than £10 and left with no other choice.

 

Then was told they would send me another form out to sign.

 

I decided I would get in touch with bt support via Email as I could not afford the bill at all, I never asked for a upgrade and believe they should have suspended my service if there was an issue and in my opinion should not have provided me with the service until all paperwork had been completed anyway.

 

I am on low income and would not get credit nor want it.

 

Well all I can say is the customer services was no help at all and just said when they get the form back they will adjust it from the day I got in touch which still would make it impossible to pay and thus lose a much needed service when they cut me off for a missed payment.

 

8-9 days later and a few emails back and forth as to why I have issues with my post the form finally arrived.

 

Now the catch 22 situation is they want the form back within 14 days and I sent the form back the same day I received it but according to them it arrived late.

 

now I have incurred another months bill at premium rate for something that is out of my control.

 

They have now sent out a 3rd form Wednesday and again so far it has not arrived so if it doesn't come Monday again I will miss the 14 day deadline.

 

As a resolution I would like my bill adjusting back to the plan I asked for but who the heck is actually liable here the phone company or bt or both ?

Edited by dx100uk
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What you mean by "the phone company or BT"? I thought you were just dealing with a single company – BT?

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Please can you provide us with the T&Cs of this offer or lnk us to them on their site.

 

If there is any action against anyone it is against BT.

 

Did you keep any record of sending the form and particularly did you send it recorded delivery?

 

You record your phone calls?

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The Home page

https://btplc.com/inclusion/ProductsAndServices/BTBasic/BTBasicBroadband/index.htm

 

And FAQs

 

https://btplc.com/inclusion/ProductsAndServices/BTBasic/FAQ/index.htm

But overall very little on the T&C.

 

https://btplc.com/inclusion/ProductsAndServices/BTBasic/ApplyingforBTBasic/index.htm

 

Get a BT Basic application form by calling us on 0800 800 864 (8am to 6pm Mondays to Fridays). You must be the named BT account holder to apply. We will talk to you about the calls you make so that you can be sure BT Basic is the best package for you.

You will need to fill in a simple one page application form and return it to us within 14 days of receiving it.

You will also need to give us some personal information:

 

  • your date of birth
  • your National Insurance number
  • confirm the benefit you are receiving
  • remembering to sign and date your application before returning it in the pre-paid envelope.

We need these details so we can check your records with the Department for Work and Pensions and find out whether you qualify for BT Basic.

 

They keep asking me to ring them but I only communicate through Email I have confirmation in writing from them the day they received the form.

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Something has just struck me that says 14 days after I receive the form not 14 days from when they send out the form. So in actual fact they did receive it in time and I informed them via Email the day I received the form.

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Still banging my head against a brick wall and a few emails back and forth between myself and the the frustrating complaints team I decided to go to the top and contact CEO Gavin Patterson and fair dues got a Email back the same day passing me over to a dedicated case handler.

 

 

Now if only some common sense prevails I might get a satisfactory resolution finally.

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I doubt it ...this is BT...:-) have you not got Virginmedia in your area ?

We could do with some help from you.

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All are available in my area however I have been unemployed long term and cannot afford broadband or a phone line with a budget after deductions of £27.50 per week for food and job searching.

 

BT basic + plus broad is only £10 per month if you are on a qualifying benefit all inclusive with £10 calling credit and 12GB of data and line rental.

 

That was great for me and left me with £25 for food per week and keeping up appearances travel etc I live to far away to walk to the job centre or library to search.

 

But then the problems started, I am faced with a bill over £100 to be paid this week when it should only be £20 and increasing as we speak.

 

I cannot afford any other service or pay the bill so stuck with BT until they resolve the problem or cut me off.

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All I can find on the website in relation to this deal is for existing customers.

 

 

I am arguing the point that they upgraded my account without my consent, technically it is reverted back to the premium rate for existing customers if they do not receive the form back in time but I was not a existing customer and in my opinion I should have been reverted back to no service.

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Just to update within 24 hours of emailing BT CEO [email protected] I received a message from the executive complaints team.

 

 

I also noticed that your account was on the verge of being restricted but I’ve just reversed that so service will maintain until we get this situation sorted out. I’ll check back with you on the 11th to check you’ve received the BT Basic form.

 

 

So while the BT complaints team have been a object of frustration obstruction and futility for several weeks and would have let my service become restricted and allow the bill to mount up. Emailing the CEO seems to have worked so far and can only say they have been quick and sympathetic so far towards my issue.

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finally got it sorted so I guess this thread should be marked as resolved can only sum up that BT customer services are a object lesson in futility and emailing the CEO is the best and fastest way forward in a dispute and a pleasure to deal with.

 

 

 

I’ve checked the account and currently there is an outstanding balance of £93.93, I’ve applied a credit of £75.03. This leaves you a balance to pay of £18.90.
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Pleased its been resolved for you trebormoinet

 

Lets hope there are no further problems and the CEO has to come out with his toolbox:-)

 

I will mark your thread as same.

 

Regards

 

Andy

We could do with some help from you.

PLEASE HELP US TO KEEP THIS SITE RUNNING EVERY POUND DONATED WILL HELP US TO KEEP HELPING OTHER

 

Have we helped you ...?         Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group - The National Consumer Service

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I assisted a couple of young people with a very similar issues for the same product and have also had it myself and had similar problems in cases with these forms. Make sure as part of your complaint that you require to have all your bills readjusted to account for the BT Basic Plan. They should do this automatically now the CEO is involved. You can also request to have any overpayments once the bills are adjusted credited back to your BT Account or Bank Account. I would always go for the latter.

 

Also watch the usage of that 12GB. If you exceed it on a regular basis, they will upgrade your package to BT Broadband. You can still keep BT Basic line rental. But they will put your broadband on the Standard ADSL tariff.

 

As a side note. This is a great scheme for people on low incomes / state support. But I think the forms they send are a very outdated way of doing things. They also don't allow enough time for the form to arrive, be read and signed and returned. As long as it is eventually returned with proof of postage they do accept it and readjust bills, even if it's 2 weeks - 1 month late. But it might take some pressing on the Customer Service team to readjust the bills. When applying for the Warm Home Discount with Gas and Electricity providers, they don't require such forms and it can all be done over the phone. The only thing that goes on the phone really is the National Insurance number of the account holder and a couple of tick boxes. Something that could be done over the phone or on a website.

 

Virgin Media is certainly the better network operator. But currently their cheapest package is £33.00 a month at the time of writing for Broadband Only. That's steep considering that BT Basic + Broadband is currently £9.95 a month and includes £1.50 worth of calls every month capped at £10.00 a month. So your bill in any 1 month can be no more than £19.95 for an unlimited amount of 01, 02 and 03 calls and UK mobiles.

 

Also what they don't tell you, is you can have a BT Basic Landline for £5.10 per month and then choose broadband from another provider which may have a more generous Bandwidth limit.

 

Glad you got this sorted, but thought I'd leave this here for reference for those doing Google Searches and facing similar issues.

This is how I spend most of my life :ranger:

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  • 4 weeks later...

Final resolution was I BT allowed me continue with service until the paperwork was resolved and when it was they dropped all charges and set my balance back to zero effectively giving me 3 months usage for free.

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