Hi

I have been asked by a neighbour ( has no internet ) for advise re a fixed penalty notice that they got today.

It is dated 25/5/2018 and the offence was 13/5/2018!

They were caught doing 57 in a 50 stretch on the M1 ,

They wanted to know why it has taken over a year for this to arrive!

The said neighbour drives for a living and was in their works van.

I am going ask for more information as know they only recently got the van they are using

TIA

Sandy

Sandy, did you mean the offence was in 2017?

HB

no it says 2018 HB, my mistake for saying a year!

date of letter, 25/5/2018, date of offence : 13/3/2018

So a little over two months, then.

When a vehicle is detected speeding a notice of intended prosecution (a NIP) and a request to name the driver is sent to the Registered Keeper (RK). This must be served within 14 days of the offence. In the case of a works vehicle the RK may be the employer but will more likely be a leasing company. The Leasing company provide details of the employer (to whom they lease the vehicle) and they receive their own NIP. The employer then nominates the employee who then receives his own NIP. The employee has to reply saying he was the driver and only then will an offer of a fixed penalty (or speed awareness course if appropriate) be made. Note that no Fixed Penalty Notice is involved. What is made is a Conditional Offer of a Fixed Penalty, which is slightly different. Also note that the only NIP subject to the 14 day rule is the first one to the RK. There are no time constraints on any subsequent NIPs

Each person (or company) in the chain has 28 days to respond to the request for driver's details so that's almost certainly why it has taken so long to reach your neighbour.

ty man in the middle, think they just panicked lol, I have told them this and believe they going see if can do the driver awareness course, the van is a lease one that their firm uses

57 in a 50 will result in an offer of a Speed Awareness Course provide (a) your neighbour has not done one for an offence committed in the previous three years and (b) the offence was not committed in Scotland (where courses are not offered). It will cost him about £90 and half a day of his time, but no penalty points. If he doesn't fancy that he will be offered a Fixed Penalty (£100 and three points).

Remind him that he must return the request for driver's details within the 28 days allowed or he commits a far more serious offence. This involves a court appearance and, on conviction, a hefty fine, six points and insurance grief for up to five years.

hi, man in the middle

all they got was the notice of fixed penalty, and offer of the course or a fine, he has chosen the course and been accepted, £91 it cost, there is nothing about a request for drivers details, his name, address and driving licence number are on the letter, I looked online for them and found the offence etc, when put his details on to book course it came up to show when he had done one before, am sure it said 2017 yet been offered another, money paid and confirmation given

Sandy

the course offered is, National Motorway Awareness Course, last one was National Speed Awareness Course

I am just the piggy in middle!

Sandy

...there is nothing about a request for drivers details,

Then what proof do they have that he was driving? Before taking action for speeding the police have to have a signed response to the request for driver's details from the person who was driving. Has he told you the full story?

yes, got the letter in front of me now, has his name, address, reg of the van etc, his driving licence number, etc, he thinks the Police put reg into data base, it came back with where it was from, letter got sent there, then onto his work and then to him, he said he remembers going that way for a delivery

Yes but they don't have any proof that he was driving. Unless he has completed a "request for driver's details" (known as a "Section 172 request") they cannot show he was driving.. Was this letter the first correspondence he has from the police? If it was, it might be worth a phone call to the office that issued the fixed penalty offer to ask them how they know he was driving. This does not hang together.l

yes first letter he has had, he asked his work and the knew about it but did not tell him, first he knew was the letter today, he said he was driving as can recall being on M1 that day doing a delivery, he has not completed anything, he has been off work for last 2 weeks and only went bk Tuesday, letter dated 25/5/18

The process is this:

His employer receives a NIP and a request to provide the driver's details (this is known as a Section 172 request). They respond by naming the driver. Your neighbour then receives his own NIP and S172 request. The NIP provides details of the allegation (Date, Time, Location, Alleged speed and limit). Your neighbour must then respond to the S172 request by naming himself as driver. Failure to do so is an offence more serious than speeding. He then receives an offer of a course, a fixed penalty, or is issued with court proceedings (as appropriate).

Without this last part of the process (your neighbour naming himself as driver by means of his response to the S172 request) no prosecution for speeding is possible as they have no evidence who was driving.

Your neighbour needs to be sure about this because, from what you have said, they could take him to court for speeding and the prosecution would fail. There must be a bit missing that he has not told you about or he has been issued with an offer to take a course when he may not need to accept.

The letter he got yesterday was first he knew about it, it was from the Police, it states, you were the driver of Vehicle ( make and reg number ) of the alleged offence of Exceed a variable speed limit, you now have 3 options, the Motorway Course, possible to deal with it by a fixed penalty or go to court,

I went onto the website for neighbour and typed in all the details the letter has given him, there were pictures of the van etc.

Neighbour opted for the course and was accepted but I will tell him to find out if he was driving that day and ask his work

Conditional Offer of Fixed Penalty is the heading on letter, from Northampton Police

...it states, you were the driver of Vehicle ( make and reg number )

The issue is, how do they know (other than somebody telling them he was)? That is not acceptable proof because that same someone could say you or I was driving.

his boss told them and neighbour said yes he was driving that day, he is asking today, not be seeing neighbour really as he working

his boss told them and neighbour said yes he was driving that day, he is asking today, not be seeing neighbour really as he working

When he said "yes he was driving" was that in response to a police request? I know you cannot readily answer these questions (it is always difficult giving advice via an intermediary). I'll leave you to come back if you believe the process I outlined in post #13 has not been followed.

hi,, he was driving that day, where he works they keep a record of who has what van etc, so yes he was definitely driving on the day in question, his work has said they knew about 4 weeks ago about this offence and did not tell him, they said they thought they had!

The company is due to be sold and rumour has it the new owners do not want the staff as have their own

So did he (your neighbour) tell the police himself, by way of responding to their request for information, that he was driving? His firm telling the police is not sufficient to support a conviction and if he did not respond to a request he's in the position I mentioned earlier. I don't really think I can add any more until that question is definitely answered.

far as I know he has had no contact with the Police, all he knew about it was the letter arriving.

He was on Holiday for a week, May 12th, came back 19th and had second week at home