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    • They did reply to my defence stating it would fail and enclosed copies of NOA, DN Term letter and account statements. All copies of T&C's that could be reconstructions and the IP address on there resolves to the town where MBNA offices are, not my location
    • My defence was standard no paperwork:   1.The Defendant contends that the particulars of claim are generic in nature. The Defendant accordingly sets out its case below and relies on CPR r 16.5 (3) in relation to any particular allegation to which a specific response has not been made. 2. Paragraph 1 is noted. The Defendant has had a contractual relationship with MBNA Limited in the past. The Defendant does not recognise the reference number provided by the claimant within its particulars and has sought verification from the claimant who is yet to comply with requests for further information. 3. Paragraph 2 is denied. The Defendant maintains that a default notice was never received. The Claimant is put to strict proof to that a default notice was issued by MBNA Limited and received by the Defendant. 4. Paragraph 3 is denied. The Defendant is unaware of any legal assignment or Notice of Assignment allegedly served from either the Claimant or MBNA Limited. 5. On the 02/01/2023 the Defendant requested information pertaining to this claim by way of a CCA 1974 Section 78 request. The claimant is yet to respond to this request. On the 19/05/2023 a CPR 31.14 request was sent to Kearns who is yet to respond. To date, 02/06/2023, no documentation has been received. The claimant remains in default of my section 78 request. 6. It is therefore denied with regards to the Defendant owing any monies to the Claimant, the Claimant has failed to provide any evidence of proof of assignment being sent/ agreement/ balance/ breach or termination requested by CPR 31.14, therefore the Claimant is put to strict proof to: (a) show how the Defendant entered into an agreement; and (b) show and evidence the nature of breach and service of a default notice pursuant to Section 87(1) CCA1974 (c) show how the claimant has reached the amount claimed for; and (d) show how the Claimant has the legal right, either under statute or equity to issue a claim; 7. As per Civil Procedure Rule 16.5(4), it is expected that the Claimant prove the allegation that the money is owed. 8. On the alternative, as the Claimant is an assignee of a debt, it is denied that the Claimant has the right to lay a claim due to contraventions of Section 136 of the Law of Property Act and Section 82A of the consumer credit Act 1974. 9. By reasons of the facts and matters set out above, it is denied that the Claimant is entitled to the relief claimed or any relief.
    • Monika the first four pages of the Private parking section have at least 12 of our members who have also been caught out on this scam site. That's around one quarter of all our current complaints. Usually we might expect two current complaints for the same park within 4 pages.  So you are in good company and have done well in appealing to McDonalds in an effort to resolve the matter without having  paid such a bunch of rogues. Most people blindly pay up. Met . Starbucks and McDonalds  are well aware of the situation and seem unwilling to make it easier for motorists to avoid getting caught. For instance, instead of photographing you, if they were honest and wanted you  to continue using their services again, they would have said "Excuse me but if you are going to go to Mc donalds from here, it will cost you £100." But no they kett quiet and are now pursuing you for probably a lot more than £100 now. They also know thst  they cannot charge anything over the amount stated on the car park signs. Their claims for £160 or £170 are unlawful yet so many pay that to avoid going to Court. When the truth is that Met are unlikely to take them to Court since they know they will lose. The PCNs are issued on airport land which is covered by Byelaws so only the driver can be pursued, not the keeper. But they keep writing to you as they do not know who was driving unless you gave it away when you appealed. Even if they know you were driving they should still lose in Court for several reasons. The reason we ask you to fill out our questionnaire is to help you if MET do decide to take you to Court in the end. Each member who visited the park may well have different experiences while there which can help when filling out a Witness statement [we will help you with that if it comes to it.] if you have thrown away the original PCN  and other paperwork you obviously haven't got a jerbil or a guinea pig as their paper makes great litter boxes for them.🙂 You can send an SAR to them to get all the information Met have on you to date. Though if you have been to several sites already, you may have done that by now. In the meantime, you will be being bombarded by illiterate debt collectors and sixth rate solicitors all threatening you with ever increasing amounts as well as being hung drawn and quartered. Their letters can all be safely ignored. On the odd chance that you may get a Letter of Claim from them just come back to us and we will get you to send a snotty letter back to them so that they know you are not happy, don't care a fig for their threats and will see them off in Court if they finally have the guts to carry on. If you do have the original PCN could you please post it up, carefully removing your name. address and car registration number but including dates and times. If not just click on the SAR to take you to the form to send to Met.
    • In order for us to help you we require the following information:- [if there are more than one defendant listed - tell us] 1 defendant   Which Court have you received the claim from ? County Court Business Centre, Northampton   Name of the Claimant ? LC Asset 2 S.A R.L   Date of issue – . 28/04/23   Particulars of Claim   What is the claim for –    (1) The Claimant ('C') claims the whole of the outstanding balance due and payable under an agreement referenced xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx and opened effective from xx/xx/2017. The agreement is regulated by the Consumer Credit Act 1974 ('CCA'), was signed by the Defendant ('D') and from which credit was extended to D.   (2) D failed to comply with a Default Notice served pursuant to s87 (1) CCA and by xx/xx/2022 a default was recorded.   (3) As at xx/xx/2022 the Defendant owed MBNA LTD the sum of 12,xxx.xx. By an agreement in writing the benefit of the debt has been legally assigned to C effective xx/xx/2022 and made regular upon C serving a Notice of Assignment upon D shortly thereafter.   (4) And C claims- 1. 12,xxx.xx 2. Interest pursuant to Section 69 County Courts Act 1984 at a rate of 8% per annum from xx/01/2023 to xx/04/2023 of 2xx.xx and thereafter at a daily rate of 2.52 to date of judgement or sooner payment. Date xx/xx/2023   What is the total value of the claim? 12k   Have you received prior notice of a claim being issued pursuant to paragraph 3 of the PAPDC (Pre Action Protocol) ? Yes   Have you changed your address since the time at which the debt referred to in the claim was allegedly incurred? No   Did you inform the claimant of your change of address? N/A Is the claim for - a Bank Account (Overdraft) or credit card or loan or catalogue or mobile phone account? Credit Card   When did you enter into the original agreement before or after April 2007 ? After   Do you recall how you entered into the agreement...On line /In branch/By post ? Online   Is the debt showing on your credit reference files (Experian/Equifax /Etc...) ? Yes, but amount differs slightly   Has the claim been issued by the original creditor or was the account assigned and it is the Debt purchaser who has issued the claim. DP issued claim   Were you aware the account had been assigned – did you receive a Notice of Assignment? Not that I recall...   Did you receive a Default Notice from the original creditor? Not that I recall...   Have you been receiving statutory notices headed “Notice of Sums in Arrears”  or " Notice of Arrears "– at least once a year ? Yes   Why did you cease payments? Loss of employment main cause   What was the date of your last payment? Early 2021   Was there a dispute with the original creditor that remains unresolved? No   Did you communicate any financial problems to the original creditor and make any attempt to enter into a debt management plan? No   -----------------------------------
    • Hello CAG Team, I'm adding the contents of the claim to this thread, but wanted to open the thread with an urgent question: Do I have to supply a WS for a claim with a court date that states " at the hearing the court will consider allocation and, time permitting, give an early neutral evaluation of the case" ? letter is an N24 General Form of Judgement or Order, if so, then I've messed up again. Court date 25 May 2024 The letter from court does not state (like the other claims I have) that I must provide WS within 28 days.. BUT I have recently received a WS from Link for it! making me think I do need to!??
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VCS PCN Caimform - Car park: Berkeley Centre, Ecclesall RD, Sheffield, S11 8PN


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Hello everyone

 

Last August (2017) I parked in a small carpark outside a parade of shops and went to have lunch with family.

 

There was no pay & display machine and I genuinely thought it was free parking.

 

Some time later, I received a letter telling me that my registration number had been detected on the way in and out of the carpark and I had overstayed the allowed amount of time. They wanted me to pay a fine.

 

I ignored the letter, believing that it was not enforceable, and also ignored one or two reminders.

 

A few days ago I received two pieces of correspondence.

 

One was a Particulars of Claim from the parking company, filling two pages, quoting a Claim No. and with an accompanying letter saying that a copy had been filed with the court.

 

The other was a Claim Form from County Court Business Centre.

 

This also included information in the Particulars of Claim box but, interestingly, this particulars of claim was different and very much briefer than the one sent to me.

 

I'm not sure if that is significant.

 

The longer Particulars (the one sent direct to me) mentioned such things as "failure to adhere to advertised terms & conditions", "breach of contract for failing to adhere to the terms & conditions" and that their terms & conditions were "accepted by conduct" (ie presumably by me parking).

 

They are claiming £160 plus £25 court fee, plus interest.

 

My contention is that, no matter how obvious they claim the signage to be, if I didn't see them then they were not obvious enough. Surely it is their responsibility to make sure I see it, not mine to look for it. If I didn't see a sign then I couldn't have agreed to their conditions and no contract was made. Unfortunately, the carpark is nearly 100 miles from where I live and I cannot easily go back and check the signs.

 

I have seen a sticky thread (with the confusing title 'CPR 31.14 Request to use on receipt of a PPC') which suggests I should ask the parking company for a copy of their contract with the land owner. Surely that is confidential and they will refuse/ignore my request? The same with asking for copies of planning consents relating to erecting signage. What if the documents cannot be secured in time for me to use them in my defense? Is there any way for me to ask the court to suspend action while I wait to receive requested information from the claimant?

 

I am up for fighting this, if you guys think there is much chance of winning, but I am not very confident about this sort of thing. If anyone is prepared to hold my hand and walk me through it, I'll have a go. Can anybody help me?

 

The issue date on the court Claim Form is 21 May 2018.

 

Thanks,

 

John

Edited by Joh7n
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I think you should start off by telling us which company is it who is suing you. Also, have you been back to the car park to check the signage? This would be a good idea.

 

Please will you post up the claim in PDF format. Make sure it is redacted for identifiers, of course

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Please complete this

https://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?465231-Received-a-Court-Claim-From-A-Private-parking-Speculative-invoice-How-To-Deal-With-It-HERE***Updated-Aug-2016***

 

So we have all the correct info to help you

 

Yes get that CPR running and do Acknowledgement of Service

Edited by Andyorch
edit

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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we can help yu but you will have to tell yourself you are going to win this and the doubts you have regarding the truths surrounding certain things are easy to overcome. Think of it like this.

 

As it stands you are £185 out of pocket so anything you do that reduces this is a win.

 

We think that it is unlikely that you actually owe anything at all. the £160 include monies the parking co cant lawfully claim from you so even if you lost the actual claim for breach of contract you will only owe £100 at most so a saving of £60.

 

Now, we need to know a lot about the event and what you have still got in the way of paperwork. so start off with the where and when, what letters have you received and when, do you still have them.

 

Next we need to know about where.

We need an exact location

we want pictures of the entrance to the land from the public highway (we can google the place as well) and

pictures of the signage there,

both at the entrance and

any different signs that are elsewhere on the land

 

. we need to know how big the signs are

, how many and whether they are illuminated or not (even by a streetlamp).

If the signs are partially obscured by wheelie bins or trees we need to know that as well.

 

Once we have the full where we will get you to do soke digging on who owns the land and whether planning consent was granted for their signage (they need it regardless of what they claim)

 

Lastly we can pick holes in their claim as being inadequate for the purposes of CPR's but that usually just gets them an instruction to do it again

 

so your skeleton defence Will partially be around this as they have failed so far to show a proper cause for action as the claim is too vague to determine why they are claiming form you and in what capacity (driver or keeper).

Edited by DragonFly1967
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Thanks Guys

 

Yes I will post PDFs of the relevant paperwork, as soon as get home and figure out how to do it. I'll have a good look to see if I have any other correspondence. There is a chance I could get someone else to check the signage for me. The carpark is in Sheffield which is a long way from North Wales where I live, but I have family in that direction.

 

dx100uk

 

 

Yes get CPR running and do Acknowledgement of Service

 

What does that mean?

 

ericsbrother,

I don't understand why, if I lose, I could only owe £100. Would you mind explaining in idiot-proof language for me.

 

I'll try to get everything done that you've all asked for in the next few hours. In the meantime, thanks you all very much. I'm very grateful and I'm looking forward to a possible punch-up, so as to speak.

 

John

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CPR = Civil Procedure Request CPR 31.14 and AoS ...acknowledge service of the claim form

We could do with some help from you.

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If you turn up at court and point out that the POFA only allows the parking co to claim the amount originally invoiced from the keeper then the maximum charge is £100.

 

The signage may well have blurb about adding extra recovery costs but the keeper hasnt agreed to any contract so they are only liable for the monies due as a result of the breach of contract.

 

The claim will fudge this rather important detail so you need to be in there and arguing against the extra bit.

 

The claimant may well then fall foul of the newer rules on proper filling out of the claims form and they will get that £100 reduced to as little as £50 for their naughty behaviour.

 

Something to consider even if they have a watertight contract via their signage and letters ( they wont, they arent bright enough to get it right and too greedy to care anyway)

 

tell us where it was and we can start looking on google streetview and be ahead of the game

 

Sheffield is a bit too vague and you still havent named the parking co.

 

Both are important, nealry all parking co's have previous form we can refer to and that will includ ethier standard letters, which solicitor they use and so on.

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Thanks for that ericsbrother. That’s good to fall back on.

 

Right, before I scan & post the docs, here are some further details:

 

Parking Co: Vehicle Control Services, Sheffield

 

Car park: Berkeley Centre, Ecclesall Rd, Sheffield, S11 8PN

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Title updated

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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located the place and there is a sign at the entrance.

 

Firstly it is on the LHS of the entrance so any driver cant read it as they go past it.

 

Secondly the sign itself says you have to read the other signs for the contractual terms and that means it isnt a contract but an invitation to treat and that means you dont have to accept the terms of the subsequent offer and still park there.

 

The other signs arent readable from any distance and arent illuminated so wont be legible at night. That means the signage will struggle to be considered as offering anything at all.

 

VCS have plenty of history for rubbish signage and then lose their claims. They have given up instructing solicitors as they lose less money by shooting themselves in the foot rather than getting someone else to shoot their toes for them.

 

Now sheffield have their planning applications available through a portal so should be easy to look up any recent applications but you may need to phone the planning dept to ask them about PP for VCS.

 

Also check whether the planning consent for the development has anything regarding parking in it, many do say 3 hours parking and that cant be altered by some bandit parking co nor even the landowner without getting new consent.

 

lastly there is a sign saying the palce is managed by some other company. I woudl bet that the VCS contract is with them and not th landowner. that menas it is unlikely the landlord has assigned the right to VCS to make money out of suing people in their own name and that means they have no locus standi and cant win a claim cos the law says they have no right to sue.

 

You will need to sedn VCS a CPR 31.14 request for information to see their contract with the landowner and their planning permission. They wont respond but by not doing so they ruin their chances of getting anywhere.

 

Lastly the sign says that you agree to be bound by the unreadable signs if you stay there for more than 10 minutes. well, that makes any claim a claim for a contractual charge and they are suing you for breach of contract, which is different.

 

Like saying you are the driver/keeper, it is one or the other, not both and that is something to stick in your defence to get the judge to put all of these things together and makea bigger picture when they may be not thinking they are good enough on their own (they should be, the POFA is explicit)

Edited by honeybee13
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Wow ericsbrother, that is amazing. Very impressive. Thank you very much. I’m itching to get stuck in now.

 

Unfortunately, I’m away for a couple of days with work and may not get an opportunity to post while I’m gone.

 

I’ve had trouble getting my scanner to work properly and so have not been able to produce the PDFs of the correspondence.

I’ll sort it all out when I get back.

 

In the meantime, if I get any free time I’ll start drafting the CPR 31.14 request.

 

Thank you all again for your advice, especially ericsbrother, who has gone to so much trouble.

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You dont need to draft a cpr simply print and send our one

You need to get that done now...

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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Share on other sites

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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Hello Guys

 

Right, here are copies of the documents you have requested. I'd like to say once again how grateful I am for your help and impressed I am with your knowledge.

 

The parking incident was on 23 Aug 2017

 

Acknowledgement of Service done online yesterday, 29 May 2018

Claim Form.pdf

Letter Before Claim.pdf

Particulars of Claim.pdf

CPR 31.14 Request.pdf

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Please put all your uploads into one multipage pdf

Else we'll be here all day downloading

 

Read upload

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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Please put all your uploads into one multipage pdf

Else we'll be here all day downloading

 

Sorry guys, I misunderstood the instructions. Each one of these is a small multi-page document. I'll know for next time.

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ok

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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had to hide them all

poc has case number showing

 

cpr not needed we know what our template says

 

letter before claim has ref no's

 

clamform has case ref and password

we don't need to see a claimform we know what they look like

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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Ok, thanks dx100uk

 

Unfortunately I am at work at the moment on a late shift, but will modify and re-submit them in the morning.

 

I enclosed the Claim form because it contains POC which are different to the ones sent direct to me and contained in one of the other docs.

 

The CPR is similar but longer than the one on this site. I got two different templates and combined them.

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then we don't need to see other templates either please

respect their copyright

 

ideally the two pocs need to only be typed out in a msg box here

 

NTK is the only thing we need to actually have a scan of please

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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  • 2 weeks later...

Hello again Guys,

 

RThe Acknowledgement went in early.

 

The CPR 31.14 expired several days ago and asked for their contract with the land owner, planning consents for signage and copies of the NTK & any other correspondence from them to me.

They have not replied.

 

The Claim was dated 21 May, so I think my defence needs to be in the 23rd June.

What do I need to do now?

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21st is 1 in the count

by 4pm 22nd

 

use the std defence in about every claimform thread in this forum

#

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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I've read your booklet "Received Court Papers from a Private Parking Company (PPC) Speculative Invoice??

How to deal with it here".

Is that the standard defence you referred to?

It's very good.

I have some questions, though:

 

I have asked for planning consents for signage and they have not responded.

Can I now claim that the court should assume that no such consent exists and that the PPC cannot now show evidence to the contrary since it has been denied to the defendant, despite a CPR request?

 

Can I similarly claim that no contract exists between them and the land owner for the same reason?

 

Can I claim that I never received a NTD/K showing evidence that I overstayed since that was also requested in the CPR?

Does this mean that they can not now show the photographic evidence to the court?

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Yes use the 3 line defence here already

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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