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    • the Town and Country [advertisments ] Regulations 2007 are not easy to understand. Most Council planing officials don't so it's good that you found one who knows. Although he may not have been right if the rogues have not been "controlling" in the car park for that long. The time only starts when the ANPR signs go up, not how long the area has been used as a car park.   Sadly I have checked Highview out and they have been there since at least 2014 . I have looked at the BPA Code of Practice version 8 which covers 2023 and that states Re Consideration and Grace Periods 13.3 Where a parking location is one where a limited period of parking is permitted, or where drivers contract to park for a defined period and pay for that service in advance (Pay & Display), this would be considered as a parking event and a Grace Period of at least 10 minutes must be added to the end of a parking event before you issue a PCN. It then goes on to explain a bit more further down 13.5 You must tell us the specific consideration/grace period at a site if our compliance team or our agents ask what it is. 13.6 Neither a consideration period or a grace period are periods of free parking and there is no requirement for you to offer an additional allowance on top of a consideration or grace period. _________________________________________________________________________________________________________________So you have  now only overstayed 5 minutes maximum since BPA quote a minimum of 10 minutes. And it may be that the Riverside does have a longer period perhaps because of the size of the car park? So it becomes even more incumbent on you to remember where the extra 5 minutes could be.  Were you travelling as a family with children or a disabled person where getting them in and out of the car would take longer. Was there difficulty finding a space, or having to queue to get out of the car park . Or anything else that could account for another 5 minutes  without having to claim the difference between the ANPR times and the actual times.
    • Regarding a driver, that HAS paid for parking but input an incorrect Vehicle Registration Number.   This is an easy mistake to make, especially if a driver has access to more than one vehicle. First of all, upon receiving an NTK/PCN it is important to check that the Notice fully complies with PoFA 2012 Schedule 4 before deciding how to respond of course. The general advice is NOT to appeal to the Private Parking Company as, for example, you may identify yourself as driver and in certain circumstances that could harm your defence at a later stage. However, after following a recent thread on this subject, I have come to the conclusion that, in the case of inputting an incorrect Vehicle Registration Number, which is covered by “de minimis” it may actually HARM your defence at a later stage if you have not appealed to the PPC at the first appeal stage and explained that you DID pay for parking and CAN provide proof of parking, it was just that an incorrect VRN was input in error. Now, we all know that the BPA Code of Practice are guidelines from one bunch of charlatans for another bunch of charlatans to follow, but my thoughts are that there could be problems in court if a judge decides that a motorist has not followed these guidelines and has not made an appeal at the first appeal stage, therefore attempting to resolve the situation before it reaches court. From BPA Code of Practice: Section 17:  Keying Errors B) Major Keying Errors Examples of a major keying error could include: • Motorist entered their spouse’s car registration • Motorist entered something completely unrelated to their registration • Motorist made multiple keying errors (beyond one character being entered incorrectly) • Motorist has only entered a small part of their VRM, for example the first three digits In these instances we would expect that such errors are dealt with appropriately at the first appeal stage, especially if it can be proven that the motorist has paid for the parking event or that the motorist attempted to enter their VRM or were a legitimate user of the car park (eg a hospital patient or a patron of a restaurant). It is appreciated that in issuing a PCN in these instances, the operator will have incurred charges including but not limited to the DVLA fee and other processing costs therefore we believe that it is reasonable to seek to recover some of these costs by making a modest charge to the motorist of no more than £20 for a 14-day period from when the keying error was identified before reverting to the charge amount at the point of appeal. Now, we know that the "modest charge" is unenforceable in law, however, it would be up to the individual if they wanted to pay and make the problem go away or in fact if they wanted to contest the issue in court. If the motorist DOES appeal to the PPC explaining the error and the PPC rejects the appeal and the appeal fails, the motorist can use that in his favour at court.   Defence: "I entered the wrong VRN by mistake Judge, I explained this and I also submitted proof of payment for the relevant parking period in my appeal but the PPC wouldn't accept that"   If the motorist DOES NOT appeal to the PPC in the first instance the judge may well use that as a reason to dismiss the case in the claimant's favour because they may decide that they had the opportunity to resolve the matter at a much earlier stage in the proceedings. It is my humble opinion that a motorist, having paid and having proof of payment but entering the wrong VRN, should make an appeal at the first appeal stage in order to prevent problems at a later stage. In this instance, I think there is nothing to be gained by concealing the identity of the driver, especially if at a later stage, perhaps in court, it is said: “I (the driver) entered the wrong VRN.” Whether you agree or not, it is up to the individual to decide …. but worth thinking about. Any feedback, especially if you can prove to the contrary, gratefully received.
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    • deed?  you mean consent order you and her signed? concluding the case as long as you nor she break it's conditions signed upto? dx  
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euro parking/gladstones claimform - PCN maghull centre merseyside **DISCONTINUED ++ COSTS**


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hi...can someone give me advice..

.i have been issued with a charge from euro parking services

..i have ignored it ..

they kept sending me with reminders of the charge .

 

.now got a claim form with county court business centre.

 

..what do i do keep ignoring or reply.

..worried because they are asking for £238

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NO, YOU DO NOT IGNORE THIS OR YOU WILL LOSE A COURT CLAIM AND HAVE THE BAILIFFS AROUND.

 

We need to know absolutely everything,

when and where the parking event was,

when you got notification

and how, what other correspondence you received

and from whom and the EXACT name of the parking co

and their address as per their letters.

 

Chances are they have screwed up wit their paperwork and part of your defence is you are not liable as they cannot rely on the POFA.

 

read a good few threads around here and you will have an idea of what we want and how to go about things.

 

You will also be needing to send a CPR31.14 to the parking co for information

 

but fist of all acknowledge the claim by going to moneyclaimonline, registering and ticking the box saying you intend to defend in full, no for mediation and you now have an extra 14 days to send in a skeleton defence-bullet points on why you dont owe them anything

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Can you please check where it says FINE anywhere please

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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hi thanks for getting back so quick.

 

.the parking event was 20/10/2016 at maghull shopping centre merseyside

 

we received the notice through the post

..i think we have threw all previous correspondence.

 

..this one was issued on the 21/02/2017.

..the exact name of the parking company is euro parking services ltd plantagenet buildings 98 spencer street birmingham b18 6db.

 

..maghull shopping centre is owned by "the maghull group"

the solicitors acting are Gladstones solicitors ltd warrington.

 

..they have issued the charge to my now wife but the charge is in her maiden name

 

..i am a named driver on the vehicle as well as my daughters so we don't know who was driving .

 

..also for months the parking meters were out of order so you could not get a ticket

..do this info help

 

hi doesn't say fine anywhere

 

hi my wife is really worried and wants to call the solicitors ..is this ok to do or not

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no!!

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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right ive removed the word fine from your thread title and all your post since

it is NOT a FINE, its what we call a speculative invoice.

 

 

pop up on the MCOL website detailed on the claimform.

.

register as an individual

note the long gateway number given

then log in

.

select respond to a claim and select the AOS box.

.

then using the details required from the claimform

.

defend all

leave jurisdiction unticked.

click thru to the end

confirm and exit MCOL.

.

get a CPR 31:14 request running to the solicitors

.

don't sign anything

.

here is the CPR you need to send:

 

 

to the solicitors

[Your address]

.

[Their address [solicitors]

.

[Date]

.

Dear Sir or Madam,

.

Re: (Claimant's name) v (Your name) Case No:

.

CPR 31.14 Request

.

On (date) I received the Claim Form in this case issued by you out of the (Name) county court.

.

I confirm having returned my acknowledgement of service to the court in which I indicate my intention to contest all of your claim.

.

Please treat this letter as my request made under CPR 31.14 for the disclosure and the production of a verified and legible copy of [each of the following / the] document(s) mentioned in your Particulars of Claim:

.

1. the contract between [parking company name] and the landowner that assigns the right to enter into contracts with the public and make claims in their own name,.

.

2.proof of planning permission granted for signage etc under the Town and Country Planning Act 2007

.

3.copies of the notice to driver, notice to keeper and any other correspondence from [insert Claimant Name] & [insert Solicitors Name} to the defendant that they intend to rely upon in court.

.

You should ensure compliance with your CPR 31 duties and ensure that the document(s) I have requested are disclosed at your earliest convenience..

.

Your CPR 31 duties extend to making a reasonable and proportionate search for the originals of the documents I have requested, the better for you to be able to verify the document's authenticity and to provide me with a legible copy.

.

Further, where I have requested a copy of a document, the original of which is now in the possession of another person, you will have a right to possession of that document if you have mentioned it in your case. You must take immediate steps to recover and preserve it for the purpose of this case.

.

Where I have mentioned a document and there is in your possession more than one version of that same document owing to a modification, obliteration or other marking or feature, each version will be a separate document and you must provide a copy of each version of it to me. Your obligations extend to making a reasonable and proportionate search for any version(s) to include an obligation to recover and preserve such version(s) which are now in the possession of a third party.

.

In accordance with CPR 31.15© I undertake to be responsible for your reasonable copying costs incurred in complying with this CPR 31.14 request.

.

If you are unable to comply with this request within 14 days and believe that you will never be able to comply with this request please confirm in your response.

.

You are reminded that as this case is yet to be allocated to a track, CPR31:14 does apply, a refusal to comply because you 'think' at this stage you dont have too will be used against you in any filed defence.

.

Yours faithfully

.

TYPE YOUR NAME DO NOT SIGN IT

 

........

 

 

DO NOT contact the sols or euro.

 

 

you need to get down to the car park and take LOADS of photos of all the signs

the machine and their notices

the entrance layout etc etc.

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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hi ..thanks so much... registered with the mol...where do i get a cpr 31:14 from

 

hi you have asked us to take photos of the carpark...there is major groundworks and construction going on there and you can't park there anymore at the moment

 

hi...thanks worked it out i have copy and pasted the info you have forwarded to me.. i will be posting it off to them tomorrow...thank you for all your help and knowledge

steve

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whatever happens DO NOT miss your defence filing date

 

 

you need to get those photos

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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hi ..

.the defence filing date..?

...is that 14 days from when i received .

.. and is it the cpr 31:14 i send to the solicitors address or do i need to send it to the court address as well.

.sorry about this

...in the past i have just ignored correspondence from these company's

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hi ..

.the defence filing date..?

...is that 14 days from when i received .please fill this link out..

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?465231-Received-a-Court-Claim-From-A-Private-parking-Speculative-invoice-How-To-Deal-With-It-HERE***Updated-Aug-2016***(2-Viewing)-nbsp

 

.. and is it the cpr 31:14 i send to the solicitors address or do i need to send it to the court address as well. no go read post 6 again

.sorry about this

 

...in the past i have just ignored correspondence from these company's

 

 

well you know not to now...........

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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Share on other sites

the CPR31.14 goes to the parking co's solicitors.

 

AS you threw away all of their correspondence you cannot show that they got the procedures wrong ( they did, I assure you) so you have to defend the claim with arguments about the validity of the contract.

 

The fact you cant park there now is no reason not to photograph the site and see what signs there are.

 

Photos of the place being dug up can help you as they will show that whatever the parking co's evidnce is it is not checkable so can be challenged on its veracity.

 

Post up the exact Particulars of Claim, as written on the first part of the N1 from court.

 

Generally Gladstones dont do this properly and you can ask for the claim to be chucked out for having no substance. they are usually told to furnish full details in a certain time but rarely do so that helps you as well.

 

I have found it said that the owners of the land are Grainrent Ltd and the site is managed by LCP.

If you get a response to the CPR request it will be interesting to see who has signed the deal and in what capacity.

 

I cannot see any signage at the entrance to the square from the Westway so you will need to enlighten us to exactly where this event took place.

 

If it was the location I am looking at on google streetview then you grab a screen shot and use it to show that there was no contract offered so you cant have breached it.

 

Any small signage scattered about isnt necessarily a contract because you coyuldnt consider it before netering the land and parking.

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hi thanks for the information and for taking the time to google map for me..

 

 

.the car park is situated behind the HSBC bank..

 

 

.i have taken photos this morning and there is signage there but i wasn't aware when this happened as you use to take a ticket from a machine for free parking.

.these were out of use for months

...i will go to the entrance and take photos from leighton ave...

 

the particulars of claim

 

the driver of the vehicle registration(the vehicle) incurred the parking charge(s) on 20/10/2016 for breaching the terms of parking on the land at maghull centre

 

the defendant was driving the vehicle and/or is the keeper of the vehicle

 

and the claimant claims

£160 for parking charges / damages and indemnity costs if applicable, together with interest of £3.33 pursuant to s69 of the county courts act 1984 at 8%pa, continuing to judgement at £0.04 per day

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yes you can.

follow the upload

PDF's only please

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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so no signage at entrance and the signage says pre agreed cars with permits only.

 

Well, that prohibits you from being there BUT they then say that if you are not included in the above then you agree to be bound by a contract to apy them £100.

 

The claim is for a breach of contract

- there is no charge for breaching a contract so they got that wrong.

 

A judge should know the difference but you will have to spell it out carefully,

there is no breach of contract clause in the signage and the unauthorised parking is not actionable as trespass by the parking co as they have no interest in the land.

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hi thanks again.

..massive help..

 

.when the claim was issued it was in my wifes maiden name on the 20/10 2016.

 

.the very next day we got married .

..so when i send the cpr31.14 do i still fill in the form in her maiden as it was on the n1 claim form or put her new surname on the cpr31.14

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doesn't matter

put both re :NEE

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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thank you nice one

 

just been to take a load of pics from the entrance to the car park and someone has sprayed black paint over one of the signage about 100 yards after the entrance.

 

..i know of a pensioner who was charged £100 for parking there as well as a friend who had ignored everything as well as the county court letter .

 

..all this in the last few days.

..this was always a free parking zone for years so when it changed i don't know.

..i can send some more pics if that helps in any way

 

hi..just been through all the pics i have taken today

..as i have previously mentioned there is major construction work being carried out but you can still access the car parks..

 

.there are a lot of construction signage about wearing hard hats, safety footwear & hi-vis jackets.

 

.they are the same in colour as the parking signs that are "visible" so i can see why people would miss them

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then part of your CPR 31.14 request to the solicitors will be for sight of the planning permission for the signage as well as the contract with the landowner that assigns the right to enter into contracts with customers and to make civil claims in their own name.

 

You would be surprised how often they dont have the necessary permission to bring a legal claim so they may well not have what is called locus standi.

 

You can check with the council to see if there were condition placed upon the planning consent regarding parking here.

 

Often PP was granted with a ridr saying frre parking or 3 hours free parking.

 

As this is a legal duty no parking co can interfere with it without going to the council and getting PP to change this.

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  • 3 weeks later...

hi...the cpr31.14 was delivered by recorded and tracked delivery and signed for by gladstones solicitors on 27/02/17...we still have had no correspondence back..so we were wondering how long would we have to wait for any correspondence back from them?

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need that link filling out to advise properly - post 10

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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Share on other sites

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