Hi,

I received a text from CRC this morning stating they had sent me a letter a week earlier and to call them about it.

From looking on the internet i released its Xercise 4 less related. i contacted Harlands who told me my direct debit was cancelled in late July (by my bank) so from then up to now i've not been paying any subs to the gym.

I received an email from Harlands on 22nd July, saying:

"Harlands administer the collection of all payments due under your agreement with Xercise 4 Less. Your bank have advised us that your July instalment has been returned unpaid "refer to payer" as there were insufficient funds in the account to pay the amount due.

We will therefore debit your account on 2 AUG 16 for the total amount of £34.99. Please note that the submission for this will be made two working days prior to 2 AUG 16 and if this date is not convenient"

i thought fair enough the money will come out on 2nd aug, but it didn't as the bank cancelled the DD, however i didn't realise this and Harlands / CRC apparently started sending letters out to me but to an address i've never heard of!! i.e. they had the wrong address on their systems.

I called CRC today and the guy said if you pay within the next 30 days we will reduce your fees to £112.49. now i do owe Xercise 4 less subs to cover July to September but im not happy they are wanting so much. i find it grossly unfair when they had my address down wrong. they could have emailed me again, texted me, froze my account so i couldn't access into the gym to make me aware of this issue.

The CRC guy said i will need to call back on 22nd nov to either pay the £112..49 or sort out other arrangements.

He said it was my responsibility to pay and the letters sent out (to the wrong address!) were only courtesy.

He also said i should have checked the payment went through on the 2nd, i told him i thought it would have gone through DD without an issue.

i feel frustrated, will call my bank tonight to ask why the DD was cancelled. any advise on how to tackle CRC ?

Hi Orange.

1. Do you know if Harlands had your address down wrongly through THEIR error or yours ?

2. Was there a reason your DD failed, like redundancy or a change in income.

3. Have they told you failure to pay may result in extra admin fees being due from you under the m/ship T&C's.

Do NOT speak to Harlands/CRS by phone at all. If they call you, tell them to put anything they have to say in writing.

You need proof of all exchanges and you won't get this by phone so keep it all in writing only. You do NOT need to call Harlands/CRS by any date and they can't make you do this.

Hi Slick, thanks for replying

1. I believe Harlands had my address down wrong, when i told Harlands and CRS my address they said it didnt match what was on their system. i got told the first line of the address on their system and i've never heard of it !

2. I had a large number of outgoings that month, so i believe the DD may have bounced but expected the DD to go through 10 days later which it didnt (as the bank cancelled the DD)

3. No, the CRS guy only said if i pay by 22nd Nov i will owe a discounted £112 as opposed to £179.

my concern is that im happy going to xercise 4 less, but after this do you think i should cancel my membership ?

Hi Orange,

1. When did you last visit the gym.

2. Are you in a position to pay the four months fees to bring the m/ship up to date if that's, but not their added admin fees. I doubt they'll accept this but we need to know what you want to do so we can give best advice.

I think the m/ship effectively ended back when the DD was cancelled by your bank but that did not end your liability to pay. Your liability ended when Harlands decided to add their unlawful penalty fees on top of the m/ship fees.

1. i went to the gym last night (27th October) but don't know if Harlands / CRS would check my gym visit data?

2. i can pay the 4 months fees (£9.99 per month) plus the admin fee of £25 they charged me in July for the DD bouncing.

Should i write a letter to harlands / CRS ?

Hi Orange,

Ignore Harlands/CRS completely for now as dealing with them is a waste of time. I suggest a letter to X4Less Head Office, Unit 1, Kirkstall Industrial Estate, Leeds, West Yorkshire, LS4 2AZ :-

Dear sir or madam,

Membership at [town/city] gym

I refer to my membership at the above gym and regret that my DD payments were not made from July onwards.

I want to remain a member of the gym and am willing to pay the 4 membership fees for July to October inclusive to bring arrears up-to-date. I am also willing to sign a new DD mandate for fees to be collected in future months.

I will not pay any admin fees that Harlands want as they are unlawful penalties so I hope you will tell them to stop seeking payment of admin fees.

Please let me know if you accept my offer and let me know how I can pay the arrears and resume the membership.

Yours faithfully,

Send from the PO and get a free Certificate of Posting at the PO counter. Keep us informed of progress or further demands from Harlands/CRS.

thanks slick,

should i add my membership no and phone contact no on the letter as well?

do you think they will respond back?

Yes to m/ship number.

No to phone number - you need to keep it in writing only so you have proof of what is agreed.

Time will tell if, and how, they respond.

In the meantime, ignore Harlands/CRS and don't be surprised if you're refused entry at the gym seeing you've not paid since June !

didnt know Leeds was their head office location. should i put down, for the attention of the manager... ?

hopefully they will respond back.

Hi Orange,

I believe they have a gym and the Head Office at the same location.

No need to address it to any - Dear sir or madam will do fine, as per my draft.

i had a email reply from Xercise 4 less head office as follows:

Thank you for getting in touch with us. Unfortunately we can see that

your account is now with CRS. This means that you have either missed a

direct debit payment or cancelled your direct debit and your debt has

now gone over to a third party debt collection agency (Credit

Resolution Services).

If you contact our Membership Support Team on 0113 203 8602, they will

be able to help you.

Alternatively if you don't think this is the right information please

speak to the General Manager at your club.

Please note this account is not monitored

Kind Regards,

Central Support Team

Head Office

Xercise4Less

Unit 1, Kirkstall Industrial Estate,

Kirkstall Road,

Leeds,

LS4 2AZ

What can i do from here ?

I suggest a further letter to X4Less :-

Dear sir or madam,

I refer to your email of xxdate.

I cannot deal with this matter by phone and will not call your Membership Support Team as I need communications in writing only.

The DD mandate was cancelled by my bank and I want to pay you to catch up, and then set up a new DD mandate.

Please let me know in writing if you are able to accept my catch-up payments so we can move on and continue the membership.

I will not communicate with Harlands or CRS (who are Harlands using different letter-heads) as they will only be interested in ramping up their demands by adding their unlawful admin fees.

Yours faithfully,

Thanks slick, should i print off the email they sent me and stick it with the new letter?

Yes, you can do that.

Hi Slick,

I posted the letter to Xercise 4 Less on 08/11/16 (over a week ago) but i've not heard anything back.

I'm concerned some juniour member of the team may have just pushed my letter into a corner.

Should i send another letter in?

CRC are expecting me to call them before the end of the month to settle the account which is now over £100.

Hi Orange,

Have you taken time to read other threads here, most of which are about Harlands/CRS ? You'll find we tell folk to ignore Harlands/CRS after initial contact is made because they have no power or authority.

Do NOT call Harlands/CRS for any reason. And if they call you, say nothing and hang up !!

You've put this back to X4Less and you need do nothing more until they take the trouble to reply to you again. You do not need to send them another letter at this stage.

The fees that Harlands are adding on in admin fees are not enforceable. We always tell folk to challenge these fees and not pay them.

Hi slick,

xercise4less and CRC have responded back today.

the text from CRC goes as follows: "Please call CRS on 01444 xxxx in order to make the payment we previously agreed with you"

I never agreed to pay it, when i called CRC last month the guy said he would take off their fees if i pay by the 22nd (today) and i said i'd get back to crc about it.

The email from xercise4 less goes:

"Good morning,

Thank you for contacting Xercise4less.

Your membership has now been passed to CRS as it has been left unresolved here at Xercise4less.

Unfortunately you will need to contact CRS directly on 014444xxxx to settle your arrears. Please be aware they are able to set up payment plans with yourself if needed.

--

Healthy Regards

Membership Enquiries

Head Office"

How should i respond to this ?

Hi Orange,

You've made a reasonable offer to deal with X4Less and catch up with payments but they're clearly not bothered about you, their customer, and are happy to throw you to the lions, Harlands/CRS.

I suggest you ignore CRS's text for now and make no attempt to contact them. If they call you, refuse to answer any security Q's and hang up.

In time, they may pass the matter on to The Zinc Group and then Spratt Endicott, Harlands pet solicitor.

Reply to no one unless we tell you to, but keep us posted on their demands.

ok cheers slick, in terms of my membership i currently dont have a direct debit set up so the charges will just keep racking up. (membership fee + admin fee)

Shall i just leave it as is?

Hi Orange,

ok cheers slick, in terms of my membership i currently dont have a direct debit set up so the charges will just keep racking up. (membership fee + admin fee)

Shall i just leave it as is?

Hi Orange,

I fully understand that.

Harlands/CRS may continue to add on m/ship fees and their admin fees but that does NOT make the charges enforceable.

Although your case is slightly different to other cases here, the principles are the same. Things went wrong for whatever reason and you've offered to catch up with payments but the gym has washed their hands of any responsibility.

You have no need to deal with Harlands/CRS for now so stick with the advice you've been given. The sooner you realise Harlands/CRS are full of hot air and empty threats, the happier you will be.

Keep us posted and we'll be here when you need us.

Hi Slick, this afternoon i had a call from CRC automated line, it put me in a que to get through to a CRC agent but i was at work so put the phone down.

Excellent !!

Bang the phone down on them anyway, whether you're at work, at home, or anywhere at all.

There's nothing you need to hear from Harlands/CRS.

I'm now thinking of cancelling my membership at xexise4less. apparently i can do this on their website.

Slick, should i call them to notify them i am changing my address? (moving house in 4 days).

Hi Orange,

Have you visited the gym since the end of October, when I asked you about attending ? If so, when did you last visit ?

Don't try to cancel online until we sort this out as I suspect X4Less will refuse to cancel while the m/ship fees are not up-to-date.

Yes, i've been 4-5 times in November. i last went on Thursday 24th Nov.

They now have a new gym access method, previously i just typed in a 8 digit code, now we have to register for bio-metric finger print which gets scanned each time we enter.