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Defence Systems Ltd T/a Park Watch Court Claim


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Hi All,

 

I'm hoping that someone will be able to guide me through defending the following claim. I have taken a note of the subject information requirements before posting and I believe I've got them listed out correctly, here goes:

 

Name of Claimant: Defence Systems Ltd T/A Park Watch

 

Address for sending documents: Gladstones Solicitors Ltd

 

Date of Issue: 15 June 2016

 

Timeline: 4 July 2016 (to acknowledge) + 14 Days (to submit defence) = 18 July 2016

 

Particulars of Claim: Date – 03/08/2015 – Description – Car Registration number/Parking charge notice Ref – Amount - £150.00 – Due Date – 31/08/2015 – Total Due - £150.00.

 

And The Clamant Claims: The claimant claims the sum of £159.48 for parking charges and indemnity costs if applicable including £9.48 interest pursuant to S.69 of the County Courts Act 1984 Rate 8.00% pa from dates above to 14/06/2016. Same rate to Judgement or (sooner) payment. Daily rate to judgement £0.03. Total debt and interest £159.48.

 

Amount claimed = £159.48

 

Court Fee = £25.00

 

Legal Rep Costs = £50.00

 

Total Amount = £234.48

 

The description reference referred to in their claim relates to ‘stopping in a no stopping area’.

 

I have been contacted by three companies so far regarding this matter. Park Watch (a division of Defence Systems Ltd the ‘Claimant’) on 10 August 2015 (this letter included a photo image of the car in the no stopping area although there is no time stamp displayed on it) and again on 7 September 2015. Then I was contacted by a company called Debt Recovery Plus Ltd on 21 October 2015, 05 November 2015, 20 November 2015, 22 January 2016 and 08 February 2016. Then Gladstones Solicitors wrote to me on 22 March 2016 and then their letter before claim on 06 May 2016.

 

None of the above correspondence gave notice of assignment.

 

However, I have acknowledged service and indicated that I intend to defend.

 

On the day of the alleged offence I had stopped the car outside the front of One Stop Shopping Centre (Perry Barr, Birmingham) to allow my other half to use their toilet facilities. The Mrs is registered disabled and has a blue badge, which was displayed in the car as I waited. I believe I was waiting for about 10 minutes for the Mrs to return.

 

I have since been back to One Stop Shopping Centre and taken a photo of the sign and without zooming in with the camera or photo graph software, the contracting part of the sign cannot be easily read.

 

It was noted that the sign used by Defence Systems Ltd to contract with consumers is about two and a half meters off the ground on a lamp post and on the left of the road. The sign cannot be seen from the driving seat, if your vehicle is right hand drive as mine is. Therefore, I can state that I did not read the sign or knew of its contractual element at the time the car stopped in front of the shopping centre.

 

The sign reads:

Park Watch

 

Access Notice

 

 

Bus Access Only

 

 

No Unauthorised Access at Any Time

 

 

Contractual Agreement

 

 

This Land is Private Property and is managed by Park Watch

 

 

If you enter this area contravening the above terms and conditions

 

 

You are contractually agreeing to pay a parking charge to the sum of £100.00 (or the reduced sum of £60.00 if the payment is made within 14 days) should the parking charge remain unpaid you will incur additional costs as a result of further action taken against you

 

 

Vehicles will be captured on camera the details of the registered owner may be acquired from the DVLA the registered owner will then be notified by post of the issue of this parking charge do not enter this area unless you agree to the above contractual charges

 

 

Creidt/debit card charges apply, parking control and enforcement action may take place at any time Park Watch and their client accept no responsibility for loss or damage to cars of the contents thereof unless such a loss or damage is caused by negligence of Park Watch. Park Watch is soley responsible for providing space maximisation and is not responsible in any way for the car parks service

P1010238.jpg

Edited by bigphil61
add a photo

Many of life’s failures are experienced by people who did not realize how close they were to success when they gave up. - Thomas Edison

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Follow this thread

And get the claim ack'd on mcol website

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?466041-Park-Watch-(Defence-Systems-ltd)-Gladstone-claimform-PCN-Now-%A3234.87(1-Viewing)-nbsp

 

Dx

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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Hi Dx, Thanks for taking a look, I've read the thread you outlined and its almost identical (I'm keeping an eye on it for updates) and several others too. I've acknowledged service, ticked defend in full and sent back (signed for) via royal mail. I will update as and when further info available....BP

Many of life’s failures are experienced by people who did not realize how close they were to success when they gave up. - Thomas Edison

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You mean via mcol website

You don't need to use the n1 form at all

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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  • 3 weeks later...

Hi Dx, I've had a bash at putting a CPR 31.14 request (loosely based on the template in the library, I'm just highlighting here the bits I've changed) together to send to Gladstones, could you take a look and let me know if I'm in the right arena or if I'm barking up the wrong tree? ....BP

 

CPR 31.14 Request.

 

On 17 June 2016 I received the Claim Form dated 15 July 2016 in this case issued by you out of the County Court Business Centre.

I can confirm that I have returned my acknowledgement of service indicating my intention to contest and counter claim your entire claim.

 

Please treat this letter as my request made under CPR 31.14 for the disclosure and the production of verified and legible copies of each and every document you intend to rely on. Although, It has been noted that in your Particulars of Claim that you fail to mention any documents, in our opinion the following documents are required in order for you to make any viable claim:

 

1. Written authorisation of the landowner as per BPA regulations.

2. A photograph, time and date stamped showing arrival and departure of the vehicle.

3. Photographic evidence showing that a Blue Badge was not displayed in the vehicle at the time of the alleged breach.

4. A photograph showing that your contract terms and conditions signage was conspicuous, legible, written in intelligible language, so that they are easy to see, read and understand, whilst seated in a vehicle.

Edited by bigphil61
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Many of life’s failures are experienced by people who did not realize how close they were to success when they gave up. - Thomas Edison

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please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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Share on other sites

Hi Dx,

 

Thanks for that, I've updated my request and will be posting out today...BP

Many of life’s failures are experienced by people who did not realize how close they were to success when they gave up. - Thomas Edison

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Hi ericsbrother, I

 

 

've requested proof of planning permission and I've been in touch with my local council's planning department for the same, awaiting any response. BP

 

just checked through my junk mail and found an email from my local council showing how to access the PP info.

 

It gives the document ref, date of application and briefly states :

 

 

'Landlords advertising for the shopping centre directional signage along Walsall Road and within car park'.

 

It goes on to state that this was approved.

 

I checked through all planning permission applications for the landlord and could find nothing else regarding signage.

 

Would Park watch need their own permission for signage or do they get away with using the permission given to the landlord?...BP

Many of life’s failures are experienced by people who did not realize how close they were to success when they gave up. - Thomas Edison

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not the relevant PP so that is why it is suggested you ASK them.

 

 

It is common that the lower grade council people wont have a clue what you are on about

until you press the point home and then they can be quite useful,

 

 

sometimes placing an enforcement order on the parking co (see Mansfield thread)

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Hi Ericsbrother,

 

I have tried in the past to talk with an actual person, without success,

but based on your thoughts I'll keep on trying!

 

What is the correct PP that they need to have in place?....BP

Many of life’s failures are experienced by people who did not realize how close they were to success when they gave up. - Thomas Edison

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They need PP for their signs and anything else under the Advertising Hoardings Regs of the Town and Country Planning Act 2007

 

If you have failed to talk to someone then you arent asking for the right person. Did you actually get through to the planning dept for instance? Do not give up at the first desk, demand to be put through to the chief executive if you cant get a sensible answer and complain at the person's failure to answer the question.

 

If you put it inwriting you can use the FOI legislation to get an answer within a certain time scale but this shouldnt be necessary, they should be able to just look it up in their records or archive (cant predate 2012 or the signage wouldnt comply with POFA so that gives a cut-off)

 

Anyway it is for the parking co to show they have a claim so you can put in your defence that you do not believe they have planning permission under the act, this being a criminal offence and therefore no contract can ever be entered into.

 

Let them prove their case.

Edited by honeybee13
Paras.
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Hi Ericsbrother,

 

I appreciate your help with this, I'll be a little bit more forceful when I call them again, thanks...BP

Many of life’s failures are experienced by people who did not realize how close they were to success when they gave up. - Thomas Edison

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Hi EB, Dx,

 

 

Earlier today I received an email from Gladstones, your thoughts on this would be appreciated:

 

 

We act for the Claimant and have notified the Court of our Client’s intention to proceed with the claim.

 

Please find enclosed a copy of our Client’s completed Directions Questionnaire, which will be filed with the court upon their request. You will note we intend to request a special direction;

 

i.That the case be dealt with on the papers and without the need for an oral hearing

 

This request is sought simply because the matter is in our Client’s opinion relatively straightforward and the costs incurred by both parties for attending an oral hearing would be disproportionate. We trust you agree.

 

You will note our Client has elected not to mediate. Its decision is not meant to be in any way obstructive and is based purely on experience, as mediation has rarely proven beneficial in these types of cases. Not with standing this, our Client would be happy to listen to any genuine payment proposals that you wish to put forward.

 

Kind Regards

 

L

Litigation Assistant

 

Gladstones Solicitors Limited

Enclosed with the DQ was this:

REQUEST FOR SPECIAL DIRECTION

The matter will be considered on paperwork without a hearing. The parties attendance is not required and the Judge will determine the matter based upon the documents and evidence supplied and any written representations received.

 

 

 

 

Many of life’s failures are experienced by people who did not realize how close they were to success when they gave up. - Thomas Edison

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IMHO you refuse?

 

Make them waste money and open themselves up to compo?

 

By a face to face thrashing?

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

Link to post
Share on other sites

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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Hi Dx,

 

Thanks for the response and your points taken on board. I reckon I'm more than happy to have an oral hearing at my local court...

 

Is it the AQ stage next?

Many of life’s failures are experienced by people who did not realize how close they were to success when they gave up. - Thomas Edison

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They dont want to have their paperwork challenged or their client actually have to turn up as that will ruin their chances of success.

 

 

the supposed costs can already be challened under CPR 27 as the claim seems to have things added that arent allowed and they are also hoping that will slip in under the radar.

 

 

They may well get an earwigging for all of this in a open court,

lose their client a fortune in their billed costs to the client all for something they have started recklessly just to make the IAS look like the big boys of the parking world.

 

So, respond to their email saying that you will oppose this and that you look forward to the oral hearing.

 

Note that they havent actually sent this because they havent been instructed to do so.

Makes you wonder what else they havent been instructed to do yet.

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Hi EB,

 

Thank you for your continued support and advice, it is, as always, appreciated. I've just replied to their email as per your advice and will read up on CPR 27.14 to see exactly what's allowed...BP

Many of life’s failures are experienced by people who did not realize how close they were to success when they gave up. - Thomas Edison

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  • 4 weeks later...

Hi EB, DX,

 

DQ filled out and sent back to the court and duly served on the Claimant's solicitor. I have requested my local court for the hearing.

 

My thoughts at the moment are to continue trying to get a definitive written answer from my local council regarding PP and to start getting a court bundle together.

 

I could not get through to anyone at the council prepared to tell me anything regarding PP, so I've sent in a FOI request.

 

As for the court bundle, I believe I should gather as much case law supporting my position as I can find!

 

Having said that,

I'm hoping that you will be able to advise me on the best course of action at this stage

and perhaps give me a bit of guidance on any applicable recorded case law that your aware of,

so that I can take my time getting up to speed on it, i.e. well before any hearing date is confirmed?....BP

Many of life’s failures are experienced by people who did not realize how close they were to success when they gave up. - Thomas Edison

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no better place than the parking prankster site

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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Share on other sites

it is all about Gladstones trying to show they are the big boys of the parking world. In reality, when this rash of claims is finished with they will lose a lot of members for their IPC and may well get into some serious bother with the regulatory authorities.

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Hi Dx, EB, Oddfellow,

 

I've been reading an awful lot of transcripts/cases on the Parking Prankster's site and the issues raised here on CAG over the last few days

 

 

have come to the conclusion that these parasites,

along with their sidekicks (in this case Gladstones),

hope we'll remain ignorant of the law and the BPA's code of conduct and just pay up!

 

Thanks all for your encouragement to fight on and your continued assistance....BP

Many of life’s failures are experienced by people who did not realize how close they were to success when they gave up. - Thomas Edison

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