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    • Should this to be take into court with him or should he send something in earlier?
    • This is the other sign  parking sign 1a.pdf
    • 4 means that they need to name and then tell the people who will be affected that there has been an application made, what the application relates to (specificially "whether it relates to the exercise of the court’s jurisdiction in relation to P’s property and affairs, or P’s personal welfare, or to both) and what this application contains (i.e what order they want made as a result of it) 5 just means that teh court think it is important that the relevant people are notified 7 means that the court need more information to make the application, hence they have then made the order of paragraph 1 which requires the applicant to do more - this means the court can't make a decision with the current information, and need more, hence paragraph one of the order is for the applicant to do more. paragraph 3 of the order gives you the ability to have it set aside, although if it was made in january you are very late. Were you notiifed of the application or not?    
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Up until I stepped back, I had always looked after my mother and since her admission to the care home, I visit regularly.   .(c)    Sections -  4, 5 and 7  I am struggling to understand these as I don’t have a legal background.  I was wondering if there is anyone who might be able to explain what they mean.  It’s been a horrendous situation where I had to walk away from my mother at her most vulnerable because of; ss (not helping), scammer and groomer. I have no legal background, nor experience in highly manipulative people or an understanding of how the SS system operates, finding myself isolated, scared and powerless to the point I haven’t collected my personal belongings and items for my mother’s room in the care home.  Sadly, the court has only had heard one version of this story SS’s, and based their decision on that. My mother’s situation and the experience I have gone through could happen to anyone who has a vulnerable parent.    If anyone any thoughts on this much appreciated.  Thank you. ______________________________________________________  (Below is the Court of Protection Order)  COURT OF PROTECTION                                                                                                                                                                                   No xxx  MENTAL CAPACITY ACT 2005 In the matter of Name xxx ORDER Made by  Depty District Judge At xxx Made on xxx Issued on 18 January 2024  WHEREAS  1.     xxx Solicitors, Address xxx  ("Applicant”) has applied for an order under the Mental Capacity Act 2005.  2.     The Court notes (my mother) is said to be estranged from all her three children and only one, (me) has been notified.  3.     (Me) was previously appointed as Atorney for Property and Affairs for (my mother).  The Exhibity NAJ at (date) refers to (me) and all replacement Attorneys are now officially standing down.  4.     Pursuant to Rule 9.10 of the Court of Protection Rules 2017 and Practice Direction 9B the Applicant 2must seek to identify at least three persons who are likely to have an interest in being notified that an application has been issues.”  The children of (my mother), and any other appointed attorneys are likely to have an interest in the application, because of the nature of relationship to (my mother).  5.     The Court considers that the notification requirements are an important safeguard for the person in respect of whom an order is sought.  6.     The Court notes that it is said that the local authority no longer has access to (my mother’s) Property.  7.     Further information is required for the Court to determine the application.  IT IS ORDERED THAT  Within 28 days of the issue date this order, the Applicant shall file a form COP24 witness statement confirming that the other children of (my mother) and any replacement attorneys have been notified of the application and shall confirm their name, address, and date upon which those persons were notified.  If the Applicant wishes the Court to dispense with any further notification, they should file a COP9 and COP24 explaining, what steps (if any) have been taken to attempt notification and why notification should be dispensed with.   Pending the determination of the application to appoint a deputy for (my mother), the Applicant is authorised to take such steps as are proportionate and necessary to access, secure and insure the house and property of (my mother).   This order was made without a hearing and without notice.  Any person affected by this order may apply within 21 days of the date on which the order was served to have the order set aside or varied pursuant to Rule 13.4 of the Court of Protection Rules 2017 (“the Rules”).  Such application must be made on Form COP9 and in accordance with Part 10 Rules.              
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A breeder's guide to buying a kitten


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I have bred pedigree cats for over four decades and it breaks my heart every time I see someone taken for a ride when buying a pedigree kitten. The aim of this thread is to demystify the whole process, to let you know what we breeders do so you know what to look for beyond the obvious clean eyes, flea free coats, and only one litter a year stuff you already know to ask.

 

There's nothing special or magic about a breeder. Anyone can be a breeder and with cats it's quite normal for a breeding girl to be kept as any pet cat would be. What makes us different to a pet owner who simply doesn't bother to get their cat spayed/neutered is a passion for a particular breed partnered with acceptance of a set of rules and recommendations set by our chosen registry. By far the biggest in the UK is the Governing Council of the Cat Fancy (GCCF). Breeders can and do register kittens with others eg The International Cat Association (TICA) and the Federation Internationale Feline (FIFe). None is in any way better or worse but throughout I'll use the GCCF for links and examples because I understand them the best and know where to look on the website. None of them are statutory bodies but they have become accepted as a benchmark of proof that the kitten you buy is a pedigree. That's what a registry is, a database carrying details of every pedigree kitten ever bred by breeders who choose to belong to that particular 'club'.

 

So how do you become a member of that mysterious club? You join a cat club which is affiliated. There are specialist breed clubs (sometimes more than one for a breed) and there are area clubs eg the Suffolk & Norfolk Cat Club. Membership will cost you less than a tenner a year in most cases. Once you've paid this princely sum you can apply to the GCCF for your 'prefix' - a name unique to you within that registry which nobody else can use. All you need to get this prefix is the signature of a breed or area club secretary confirming your membership and a fee of £75. Many then feel having a GCCF prefix means they can refer to themselves as 'registered breeders'. It's meaningless. It's nothing more than a word they have chosen to identify themselves and their cats. No checks are done. You don't even have to own a cat.

 

What's the lesson to be learned from this? Ask your breeder if they are a current member of a cat club. It's the clubs which make policy on any given breed, recommend various health tests and disseminate information to breeders so the true enthusiast won't have joined for just a single year in order to call themselves a 'registered breeder' and don't be fooled by the term. It definitely doesn't mean the breeder is experienced or knowledgeable. There are plenty of wonderful breeders who never bothered with a prefix and plenty of bad ones who paid the money for one. In between there's the vast majority of us who are prefix holders but don't claim it makes us anything special - because it doesn't.

 

One of the safest places to find a breeder is the breed club lists. Everyone listed will at least be current members. Just google your chosen breed followed by 'breed club' or 'cat club'. There are some lovely breeders who choose not to be members of a club but you need to know what you're looking for - hence this thread.

 

OK, so you've found a breeder and they have kittens available soon(ish). Don't expect a pedigree kitten to be available straight away. You may just hit lucky, it does happen that there's a kitten not booked by 13 weeks old but it isn't the norm. What would you need to check?

 

Well first of all have a look at adverts to get an idea of the price you'd expect to pay. Sites like pets4homes show prices so you can get a good idea of the range. If one person is asking £1000 when everyone else is sticking to the more normal £400 - £600 range you need to ask why. It tends to be the con artists who ask the most.

 

If they claim to be a prefix holder you can check here that the prefix is indeed registered with the GCCF

 

http://www.gccfcats.org/Portals/0/PrefixesAtoM.pdf

 

http://www.gccfcats.org/Portals/0/PrefixesNtoZ.pdf

 

and if it is that must at least mean the breeder has not been the subject of any complaints or disciplinary action, right? Wrong, so wrong. Once paid for that prefix is for life and cannot be taken away. The GCCF can (and do) suspend members and won't then allow them to register kittens but they can't remove that prefix from the list. The next check you need to do is here

 

http://www.gccfcats.org/About-GCCF/Suspension-List

 

The lists aren't that long because for minor offences it works a bit like a CCJ - pay the fine without delay and your name doesn't hit the list. I know perfectly nice breeders who have been there, myself included. A mistake in filling out a show entry form cost me £50. It's in the rules I signed up for that you get it right so I accepted the slap on the wrist and paid up. You don't get off that easily if you are found guilty of knowingly selling a sick kitten or the like so it's a list worth checking. It's still worth a look if your breeder says they use one of the other registries. It isn't unheard of for a breeder to migrate if they're on a disciplinary list for one and there are no checks in place between the different registries.

 

Done all that and we've made an appointment to visit the breeder. You must visit the breeder and see those kittens before you commit to buy. I'll say it again - you must visit. Do not be talked paying a deposit to secure a kitten you've never seen. Before you go check if there are any required health tests for your chosen breed. The GCCF website has a page with every breed of cat they recognise.

 

http://www.gccfcats.org/Cat-Breeds

 

Click on your chosen breed and scroll down to the section on health where you'll find the information. As an example we'll take the Persian because most people know what that is and among other information this is what you'll see

.................... Persians can carry a gene that leads to kidney failure (calledautosomal dominant polycystic kidney disease) through the development of cysts in the kidney. This condition was found in more than a third of all Persian and Exotic shorthaired cats in the 1990s when screening tests became available. Using DNA screening, breeders are now working to try to eradicate the problem – always ask the breeder to show the PKD certificates for the cats used to produce your kitten ............................................

How many hopeful Persian kitten buyers do you suppose insist on seeing PKD certificates? I'm pretty confident the answer is not enough! Arm yourself with the information and be prepared to walk away if you don't get the answers you want.

 

Ask what other paperwork you'll get.

 

You should expect a pedigree certificate complete with the registration numbers of every cat for at least the last three generations. This is constructed by the breeder, many of us use specialist software these days. Anyone can make one up - it's those all important registration numbers, unique to each cat, which can be checked and verified. Without them it's a worthless piece of paper.

 

You should also get a vaccination certificate, signed by a vet, showing your kitten has had a course of two vaccinations, three weeks apart.

 

Every breeder I know insures kittens for new owners. The two main players in this are Petplan and Agria. I know Petplan cover for 4 weeks, Agria may do for a little longer because they are trying to break the Petplan stronghold. There's no excuse, no possible reason for a kitten to leave a breeder without that cover.

 

And then that all important registration document. It's a pretty insignificant looking card but this is your real proof of pedigree. It's actually a transfer certificate with the space to fill in your details if you wish to transfer the kitten into your ownership according to the GCCF. It is nothing to do with legal ownership and unnecessary for pet owners, it's only an internal administrative move and of course will involve paying the GCCF a further fee.

 

The GCCF runs two registers, active and non-active. Breeders only place kittens intended for breeding on the active register and the GCCF will not register the progeny of cats on the non-active register. If a breeder is telling you the parents are registered pedigrees but is making any excuse for not registering the kittens then ask to see the parents' registration certificates(not the pedigree certificates) and check for 'active' status. If they're non-active or the breeder won't show you the documents then walk away. Those parents won't have been subject to any of the proper health tests if they aren't on the active register and shouldn't be bred from.

 

Don't be conned into paying a much higher price if you want the 'papers'. Registration costs £9/kitten, it's the smallest breeding expense by many a country mile, so there's not a reason on this earth for asking a buyer to pay an extra £100+ as I've seen on some adverts - except maybe to put you off asking all those awkward questions. The price without documentation may seem a bargain but would you pay it for a barn born kitten off the local farm? Unregistered kittens are no different to the local litter of non pedigrees with no proof of parentage, delightful to have but they shouldn't cost hundreds of pounds.

 

Remember most breeders are ordinary people with a passion for their breed, it's the con artists who can spin a good tale, have all the excuses and will try to convince you that there's someone else coming later who will take this last kitten if you don't make a decision NOW. Whatever they say, there will always be another kitten and if you know what to look for you will find the one you deserve.

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Excellent post hightail

 

As suggested on another thread by Bankfodder..I will sticky this as guidance for others.

 

Regards

 

Andy

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  • 3 weeks later...

Fascinating, thank you for that information.

 

 

I did breed highland 'mogs', as my avatar shows, but having had over 30 pet cats 'disappeared' in the past 18 years, by the surrounding shooting estate keepers ( although I cannot prove that ) I have had to stop. I have a single house cat, that I cannot allow out, because he will be slaughtered !

 

Sadly the police will not even take a note of the 'disappearances', so there is no record of how just many pet cats are killed locally, but there are few cats older than a couple of years.

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