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    • If you are buying a used car – you need to read this survival guide.
      • 1 reply
    • Hello,

      On 15/1/24 booked appointment with Big Motoring World (BMW) to view a mini on 17/1/24 at 8pm at their Enfield dealership.  

      Car was dirty and test drive was two circuits of roundabout on entry to the showroom.  Was p/x my car and rushed by sales exec and a manager into buying the mini and a 3yr warranty that night, sale all wrapped up by 10pm.  They strongly advised me taking warranty out on car that age (2017) and confirmed it was honoured at over 500 UK registered garages.

      The next day, 18/1/24 noticed amber engine warning light on dashboard , immediately phoned BMW aftercare team to ask for it to be investigated asap at nearest garage to me. After 15 mins on hold was told only their 5 service centres across the UK can deal with car issues with earliest date for inspection in March ! Said I’m not happy with that given what sales team advised or driving car. Told an amber warning light only advisory so to drive with caution and call back when light goes red.

      I’m not happy to do this, drive the car or with the after care experience (a sign of further stresses to come) so want a refund and to return the car asap.

      Please can you advise what I need to do today to get this done. 
       

      Many thanks 
      • 81 replies
    • Housing Association property flooding. https://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/topic/438641-housing-association-property-flooding/&do=findComment&comment=5124299
      • 160 replies
    • We have finally managed to obtain the transcript of this case.

      The judge's reasoning is very useful and will certainly be helpful in any other cases relating to third-party rights where the customer has contracted with the courier company by using a broker.
      This is generally speaking the problem with using PackLink who are domiciled in Spain and very conveniently out of reach of the British justice system.

      Frankly I don't think that is any accident.

      One of the points that the judge made was that the customers contract with the broker specifically refers to the courier – and it is clear that the courier knows that they are acting for a third party. There is no need to name the third party. They just have to be recognisably part of a class of person – such as a sender or a recipient of the parcel.

      Please note that a recent case against UPS failed on exactly the same issue with the judge held that the Contracts (Rights of Third Parties) Act 1999 did not apply.

      We will be getting that transcript very soon. We will look at it and we will understand how the judge made such catastrophic mistakes. It was a very poor judgement.
      We will be recommending that people do include this adverse judgement in their bundle so that when they go to county court the judge will see both sides and see the arguments against this adverse judgement.
      Also, we will be to demonstrate to the judge that we are fair-minded and that we don't mind bringing everything to the attention of the judge even if it is against our own interests.
      This is good ethical practice.

      It would be very nice if the parcel delivery companies – including EVRi – practised this kind of thing as well.

       

      OT APPROVED, 365MC637, FAROOQ, EVRi, 12.07.23 (BRENT) - J v4.pdf
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Log Book Loan Guidance


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Do you have a problem with a Logbook Loan?

 

With Citizens advice estimating that over 60,000 of these loans were taken out in 2014 alone

an increasing number are causing severe difficulty and distress for borrowers.

 

In this guide we explain what a logbook loan is, and how they work. What you can do if you have a repayment problem,and what you can do if you have unknowingly bought a car with a logbook loan attached.

 

Three golden rules for Logbbok Loans

 

1)No matter how desperate you are to purchase a car, or raise cash, NEVER consider this type of Finance

These loans are designed purely for the benefit of the lenders. With APRs of 400+%, little consumer protection, and aggressive debt collection practices

they should be avoided at all costs.

 

2)When purchasing a used car from whatever source,private or trade, ALWAYS do a FULL GENUINE HPI CHECK

costing around £20, these come with a guarantee against any form of existing finance, including lbl's

 

3)If you have any problem with a Logbook Loan, your first step is ALWAYS to check that the Bill Of Sale has been registered with the High Court. You can do this here-

 

to check if registered

 

Contact Details

 

QB Enforcement Section

Room E15-17

Royal Courts of Justice

Strand

London

WC2A 2LL

DX 44450 Strand

 

Telephone: 020 7947 7772

Fax: 0870 324 0024

Email: [email protected].g ov.uk (No Spaces)

 

You may read on the internet that your bos will be void if witnessed by an employee of your lbl lender

 

Since the OFT( as was) lost the attestation case on appeal by 2 to1 this is NOT the case

 

full details here http://www.bailii.org/cgi-bin/markup.cgi?doc=/uk/cases/UKUT/AAC/2011/280.html&query=nine+and+regions+and+v+and+oft&method=boolean

 

Logbook loans are a form of credit dating back to the Victorian era, derived from the 1878/1882 Bills Of Sale Acts, with terms and conditions to match in many cases.

 

Problems are manyfold from extortionate charges by lenders for calling a customer, to repossessions where owners have been left at the side of a busy road, unable to get to work, and even sexual harassment via debt collectionYou should hide your car or put it on your private drive way. If they attempt to move it they are committing an offence as they need a court order to remove their possession off of private property! On a public road etc they don't as they can't be penalised by possessing what they already possess by way of a valid BOS.

 

Other Poor practices abound, unsurprising when there is no incentive for lenders to ensure their customers understand the terms or can afford the repayments.

 

In fact the very nature of this form of finance could be seen to encourage bad behaviour – why carry out affordability checks if a single missed payments means you get to keep the money and takeaway the car?

 

How does it work?

 

When you take out a logbook loan you will be asked to hand over your vehicle’s logbook or vehicle registration document, which proves you are the registered keeper of the vehicle.

 

You’ll also have to sign a credit agreement and a form called a ‘bill of sale’. This means the lender now owns your vehicle on a temporary basis but you are still able to use it so long as you meet all loan repayments. These documents are recognised by law in England, Wales and Northern Ireland but are not used in Scotland.

 

The law only recognises a bill of sale if the lender registers it with the High Court. If it’s not registered, the lender must get a court’s approval to repossess your vehicle. You should check if the bill of sale is registered.

 

What you should do if you have a repayment problem

 

1) check your Bill Of Sale is registered as above

 

2) the lender must send you a default notice which complies with the requirements of s87(1)cca1974

allowing you fourteen clear days to remedy any default (which can be after one missed payment)

 

You should , if your lender will not negotiate a reduced payment, straight away on receipt of the default notice look to take out a time order. This gains you the protection of the court, which can look into the overall loan--

 

https://www.nationaldebtline.org/EW/factsheets/Pages/06A%20EW%20Time%20order%20on%20an%20unsecured%20credit%20agreement/Default.aspx

 

What you can do if you have purchased a car with an existing logbook loan

 

If you receive a letter threatening to repossess the car or an enforcement officer turns up at your home to take it, you may not be able to stop them.

 

 

 

  • ask to see proof of their identity and their authorisation to take the car
  • ask to see the bill of sale document – they have to show you this if you ask for it
  • if you feel threatened by how an enforcement officer is behaving, call the police
  • ask for written confirmation of what has been taken
  • get the contact details for the logbook loan company.

If the lender has taken your car, you can try to get it back and reclaim your money from the seller. However, this can be a costly and time-consuming process and is not guaranteed to succeed.

 

If you want to get the car back, you could pay off the outstanding loan and then take the person who sold you the car to court, to try to get your money back.

 

If you just want to get your money back, you can take the person who sold you the car to court.

 

Always get independent advice before you decide to take someone to court.

 

Some lenders are members of the Consumer Credit Trade Association (CCTA), which has a code of practice covering logbook loans. The code of practice says the lender must register the logbook loan on a register, so it will show up when you carry out a history check on the car. It also says they must obey certain rules when they repossess a car.

 

If you are unhappy with the way a logbook loan lender or its enforcement officers have behaved, find out whether they are a member. If so, you can complain directly to the CCTA. However this code is regularly ignored

 

http://www.ccta.co.uk/content/our-code.aspx

 

Finally both the Financial Conduct Authority and the Law Commission are investigating Logbook Lending

and the associated legislation, full details here--

 

http://lawcommission.justice.gov.uk/news/bills-of-sale.htm

 

 

Logbook Loan Guidance.pdf

 

Before Printing the PDF TIP

 

If you DO NOT wish to print Page 1 (Cover Page) of the PDF, please ensure to do the following:

 

Ensure you go to your Printer Settings and set it to 'Print from Page 2' (this way Page 1 (Cover Page) should not print out).

 

Note: This will save you Ink & Paper

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Any help I am able to give is from my own experience only. Should you have any doubt you should contact a qualified professional.

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