Jump to content


  • Tweets

  • Posts

    • Better version attached with the late appeal explained more clearly for the judge. This will sound silly, but I think it would be a good idea to e-mail it to the court and UKPC on Sunday.  It's probably me being daft, but Sunday is still March, and as it's late, sending it in March rather than April will make it sound like it was less late than it really is.  if you get my drift. You can still pop in a paper version on Tuesday if you want. E-mail address for the court: [email protected] And for UKPC: [email protected]   [email protected] Defendant WS.pdf
    • Update 15th March the eviction notice period expired, and I paid my next month rent along with sending them the message discussed above. After a short while they just emailed me back this dry phrase "Thank you for your email." In two weeks' time I'm gonna need to pay the rent again, and I have such a feeling that shortly after that date the contracts will be exchanged and all the payments will be made.  Now my main concern is, if possible, not to end up paying rent after I move out.  
    • they cant 'take away' anything, what ever makes you believe that?  dx  
    • The text on the N1SDT Claim Form 1.The claim is for breaching the terms and conditions set on private land. 2. The defendant's vehicle, NumberPlate, was identified in the Leeds Bradford Airport Roadways on the 28/07/2023 in breach of the advertised terms and conditions; namely Stopping in a zone where stopping is prohibited 3.At all material times the Defendant was the registered keeper and/or driver. 4. The terms and conditions upon  entering private land were clearly displayed at the entrance and in prominent locations 5. The sign was the offer and the act of entering private land was the acceptance of the offer hereby entering into a contract by conduct. 6.The signs specifically detail the terms and conditions and the consequences of failure to comply,  namely a parking charge notice will be issued, and the Defendant has failed to settle the outstanding liability. 7.The claimant seeks the recovery of the parking charge notice, contractual costs and interest.   This is what I am thinking of for the wording of my defence The Defendant contends that the particulars of claim are vague and are generic in nature which fails to comply with CPR 16.4. The Defendant accordingly sets out its case below and relies on CPR r 16.5 (3) in relation to any particular allegation to which a specific response has not been made. 1. Paragraph 1 is denied. It is denied that the Defendant ever entered into a contract to breach any terms and conditions of the stated private land. 2. Paragraph 2 and 4 are denied. As held by the Upper Tax Tribunal in Vehicle Control Services Limited v HMRC [2012] UKUT 129 (TCC), any contract requires offer and acceptance. The Claimant was only contracted to provide car park management services and is not capable of entering into a contract with the Defendant on its own account, as the car park is owned by and the terms of entry set by the landowner. 3. It is admitted that Defendant is the recorded keeper of the vehicle. 4.  Paragraph 6 is denied the claimant has yet to evidence that their contract with the landowner supersedes  Leeds Bradford airport byelaws. Further it is denied that the Claimant’s signage is capable of creating a legally binding contract. 5. Paragraph 7 is denied, there are no contractual costs and interest cannot be accrued on a speculative charge.   I'm not sure whether point 4 is correct as I think this side road is not covered by byelaws? Any other suggestions/corrections would be appreciated.
    • Dear EVRi parcelnet LTD t/a evri   evri parcelnet isnt a thing also you say defendant's response which is a bit of a weird format.   Something like   Dear EVRi, Claim no xxxx In your defence you said you could not access tracking. Please see attached receipt and label Regards
  • Recommended Topics

  • Our picks

    • If you are buying a used car – you need to read this survival guide.
        • Like
      • 1 reply
    • Hello,

      On 15/1/24 booked appointment with Big Motoring World (BMW) to view a mini on 17/1/24 at 8pm at their Enfield dealership.  

      Car was dirty and test drive was two circuits of roundabout on entry to the showroom.  Was p/x my car and rushed by sales exec and a manager into buying the mini and a 3yr warranty that night, sale all wrapped up by 10pm.  They strongly advised me taking warranty out on car that age (2017) and confirmed it was honoured at over 500 UK registered garages.

      The next day, 18/1/24 noticed amber engine warning light on dashboard , immediately phoned BMW aftercare team to ask for it to be investigated asap at nearest garage to me. After 15 mins on hold was told only their 5 service centres across the UK can deal with car issues with earliest date for inspection in March ! Said I’m not happy with that given what sales team advised or driving car. Told an amber warning light only advisory so to drive with caution and call back when light goes red.

      I’m not happy to do this, drive the car or with the after care experience (a sign of further stresses to come) so want a refund and to return the car asap.

      Please can you advise what I need to do today to get this done. 
       

      Many thanks 
      • 81 replies
    • Housing Association property flooding. https://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/topic/438641-housing-association-property-flooding/&do=findComment&comment=5124299
        • Like
      • 160 replies
    • We have finally managed to obtain the transcript of this case.

      The judge's reasoning is very useful and will certainly be helpful in any other cases relating to third-party rights where the customer has contracted with the courier company by using a broker.
      This is generally speaking the problem with using PackLink who are domiciled in Spain and very conveniently out of reach of the British justice system.

      Frankly I don't think that is any accident.

      One of the points that the judge made was that the customers contract with the broker specifically refers to the courier – and it is clear that the courier knows that they are acting for a third party. There is no need to name the third party. They just have to be recognisably part of a class of person – such as a sender or a recipient of the parcel.

      Please note that a recent case against UPS failed on exactly the same issue with the judge held that the Contracts (Rights of Third Parties) Act 1999 did not apply.

      We will be getting that transcript very soon. We will look at it and we will understand how the judge made such catastrophic mistakes. It was a very poor judgement.
      We will be recommending that people do include this adverse judgement in their bundle so that when they go to county court the judge will see both sides and see the arguments against this adverse judgement.
      Also, we will be to demonstrate to the judge that we are fair-minded and that we don't mind bringing everything to the attention of the judge even if it is against our own interests.
      This is good ethical practice.

      It would be very nice if the parcel delivery companies – including EVRi – practised this kind of thing as well.

       

      OT APPROVED, 365MC637, FAROOQ, EVRi, 12.07.23 (BRENT) - J v4.pdf
        • Like
  • Recommended Topics

Goods on HP - a Judge says they can be sold


style="text-align: center;">  

Thread Locked

because no one has posted on it for the last 3134 days.

If you need to add something to this thread then

 

Please click the "Report " link

 

at the bottom of one of the posts.

 

If you want to post a new story then

Please

Start your own new thread

That way you will attract more attention to your story and get more visitors and more help 

 

Thanks

Recommended Posts

As mentioned above, the correct procedure should be to make an initial 'informal' claim by letter to the enforcement company outlining the reason why the debtor considers that their vehicle should be 'exempt' and provide evidence. This evidence could be a copy of the finance agreement or supporting documentation outlining the reason why the vehicle is considered 'necessary' to the debtors self employments etc.

 

Yesterday I heard from two debtors who had wrongly been advised to issue injunctions and in both cases, the court were extremely annoyed at the way in which the cases had been dealt with.

 

Case number one

 

The debtor used her car to drive to work. The car was worth approx £4,500 and she had 5 unpaid parking tickets. Her car was clamped, notices given and as she could not pay her car was taken. She paid £395 in total for an injunction and in court the judge was very harsh indeed and advised her that she had made the wrong application and that the correct procedure was under CPR 85.8. and he read her the opening sentence from CPR 85.8 which states:

"A debtor making a claim to exempt goods
must
, as soon as practicable and in any event within 7 days of the removal of the goods, give notice in writing of the claim to exempt goods"

The Judge advised her that as she failed to give the local authority an opportunity to address her claim using CPR 85 that she would not be able to reclaim her courts costs. He ordered that the case be transferred to her local court under CPR 85. The judge also stated that she should reconsider her position very carefully as a vehicle that is used for work cannot normally be considered exempt as otherwise everyone in paid or self employment would claim exemption. Her car will now remain at the sale location awaiting a further court date and directions.

 

Case number two.

 

Once again this debtor issued an injunction. He has a small self employed building company. He has two vehicles and a car that he and his wife drive. One of the vehicles was clamped and eventually removed. He paid for an injunction. In court on Monday the judge questioned him as to why he had not used CPR 85 as expensive court time should not be taken up with such matters and that injunctions should be reserved for very important emergency applications. He allowed the injunction (to stop his vehicle being sold) and listed the case to be heard at the next available open date.

 

He too advised the debtor that he should consider his position very carefully given that he has two vehicles that he uses in his self employment and furthermore, that the vehicle that has been taken is valued at approx £3,600 and that under the new regs vehicles may only be considered 'exempt' if the aggregate amount is under £1,350. The Judge agreed to the injunction (to stop his van being sold) but ordered that the vehicle remain with the bailiff company and if he loses his case when it eventually goes to a full hearing he will also be liable for daily storage fees of £25 per day.

 

Sadly, yet another debtor was encouraged by internet sources to foolishly issue an injunction and not only lost in a London court this afternoon but worse still, his case will have very serious repercussions indeed for all debtors who consider that a vehicle subject to finance is supposedly 'exempt' from seizure.

 

The new regulations have only been in place for one year and it simply beggars belief that debtors are being led into court proceedings with new and untested regulations. In the first instance, it was unknown why the person advising the debtor to issue an injunction would have suggested such a risky course of action given that the debtor had already filed an Out of Time witness statement and accordingly, all enforcement was already on hold !!!

 

The debtor's vehicle (a sports car) was supposedly 'used' to transport a disabled person (not the debtor). This of course does NOT make the vehicle exempt (exemption only applies if the vehicle was 'displaying a valid Blue Badge' (which it was not).

 

The debtor claimed in his injunction that the vehicle should be 'exempt' as it was subject to finance and accordingly, was not considered by him to be 'goods of the debtor'. The judge disagreed and instead, referred the debtor to Regulation 3.(2) (a) (General Interpretations) of Schedule 12 which provides that in Schedule 12 of TCEA 2007, any references to goods of the debtor or another person are references to goods in which the debtor or that person has an interest.

 

The implications of this judgment for all other debtors (and companies) is truly awful and this is evidenced by the various emails and calls that I have been receiving about this case since early evening. The bailiff industry are overjoyed with this result.

 

The debtor was ordered to pay the enforcement agencies costs of over £3,200. This was in addition to the court fees for the injunction of £395 and the fees paid to the individual who drafted his legal case (approx £1,000).

 

Given the seriousness of this judgment I will start a new thread on the subject over the weekend.

Link to post
Share on other sites

  • Replies 199
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

Top Posters In This Topic

If I am not mistaken BA then

 

"The judge disagreed and instead, referred the debtor to Regulation 3.(2) (a) (General Interpretations) of Schedule 12 which provides that in Schedule 12 any references to goods of the debtor or another person are references to goods in which the debtor or that person has an interest."

 

Vehicles on HP might by application of this if confirmed in the Higher Courts, become available for seizure and sale as although not the absolute property of the debtor, the debtor "has an interest" in the vehicle as per the judge's reasoning in the case you quoted BA. I wonder what the Finance Companies will make of this one if they can potentially lose out. This is going to be interesting.

We could do with some help from you.

PLEASE HELP US TO KEEP THIS SITE RUNNING EVERY POUND DONATED WILL HELP US TO KEEP HELPING OTHERS

Have we helped you ...?         Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group

If you want advice on your thread please PM me a link to your thread

The bailiff: A 12th Century solution re-branded as Enforcement Agents for the 21st Century to seize and sell debtors goods as before Oh so Dickensian!

Link to post
Share on other sites

Sadly, yet another debtor was encouraged by internet sources to foolishly issue an injunction and not only lost in a London court this afternoon but worse still, his case will have very serious repercussions indeed for all debtors who consider that a vehicle subject to finance is supposedly 'exempt' from seizure.

 

The new regulations have only been in place for one year and it simply beggars belief that debtors are being led into court proceedings with new and untested regulations. In the first instance, it was unknown why the person advising the debtor to issue an injunction would have suggested such a risky course of action given that the debtor had already filed an Out of Time witness statement and accordingly, all enforcement was already on hold !!!

 

The debtor's vehicle (a sports car) was supposedly 'used' to transport a disabled person (not the debtor). This of course does NOT make the vehicle exempt (exemption only applies if the vehicle was 'displaying a valid Blue Badge' (which it was not).

 

The debtor claimed in his injunction that the vehicle should be 'exempt' as it was subject to finance and accordingly, was not considered by him to be 'goods of the debtor'. The judge disagreed and instead, referred the debtor to Regulation 3.(2) (a) (General Interpretations) of Schedule 12 which provides that in Schedule 12 of TCEA 2007, any references to goods of the debtor or another person are references to goods in which the debtor or that person has an interest.

 

The implications of this judgment for all other debtors (and companies) is truly awful and this is evidenced by the various emails and phone calls that I have received about this case since early evening. The bailiff industry are overjoyed with this result.

 

The debtor was ordered to pay the enforcement agencies costs of over £3,200. This was in addition to the court fees for the injunction of £395 and the fees paid to the individual who drafted his legal case (approx £1,000).

 

Given the seriousness of this judgment I will start a new thread on the subject over the weekend.

 

This is crazy and must be challenged.

 

The hirer does not have an interest in a vehicle on HP nor does he have title, any more than any other goods that may be on hire,.

The HP act 1965 and the subsequent CCA 1974 is very clear that title to the vehicle does not pass until either the last payment or the optional purchase fee(conditional sale).

Untill this payment is made the goods are 100% the property of the lender

DO NOT PAY UPFRONT FEES TO COLD CALLERS PROMISING TO WRITE OFF YOUR DEBTS

DO NOT PAY UPFRONT FEES FOR COSTLY TELEPHONE CONSULTATIONS WITH SO CALLED "EXPERTS" THEY INVARIABLY ARE NOTHING OF THE SORT

BEWARE OF QUICK FIX DEBT SOLUTIONS, IF IT LOOKS LIKE IT IS TO GOOD TO BE TRUE IT INVARIABLY IS

Link to post
Share on other sites

The debtor claimed in his injunction that the vehicle should be 'exempt' as it was subject to finance and accordingly, was not considered by him to be 'goods of the debtor'. The judge disagreed....

That would depend on the type of finance. A car on hire purchase cannot be put into the class of the 'debtor having an interest in it'. The car is solely owned by a finance company and hired to debtor and must be treated in the same manner as any other hire goods.

If goods are going to be classed as the debtor having an interest, then nothing is exempt and the only way to keep them will be by way of an injunction.

 

 

Yet another judge making judgement above his station and who obviously does not have a clue about the law. He should be sacked immediately.

Link to post
Share on other sites

You have to wonder if it was not a case of a judge being "miffed" at the debtor for coming into court and using the incorrect procedures. (it does happen).

 

On a HP agreement the debtor/ hirer can return the goods and terminate the agreement at any time before the last payment, since only goods of the debtor are bound, the answer would be presumably for the debtor simply to return the car to the lender, and then sort out the remaining contractual obligations for the finance.

DO NOT PAY UPFRONT FEES TO COLD CALLERS PROMISING TO WRITE OFF YOUR DEBTS

DO NOT PAY UPFRONT FEES FOR COSTLY TELEPHONE CONSULTATIONS WITH SO CALLED "EXPERTS" THEY INVARIABLY ARE NOTHING OF THE SORT

BEWARE OF QUICK FIX DEBT SOLUTIONS, IF IT LOOKS LIKE IT IS TO GOOD TO BE TRUE IT INVARIABLY IS

Link to post
Share on other sites

He has no right to be 'miffed', personal feeling don't enter into it at all. By what he is saying, does that mean the bailiff can clamp a bus where a bus driver has a debt, would it include company cars.

I have never ever heard anything so stupid come from a court.

 

 

Are you classed as having an interest in your kids moped because you maintain it, utter crap.

Link to post
Share on other sites

He has no right to be 'miffed', personal feeling don't enter into it at all. By what he is saying, does that mean the bailiff can clamp a bus where a bus driver has a debt, would it include company cars.

I have never ever heard anything so stupid come from a court.

 

 

Are you classed as having an interest in your kids moped because you maintain it, utter crap.

 

We know that he has no right but sometimes they are nevertheless.

 

This goes against the thinking of all the authorizes on bailiff law, i know for that John Kruse for instance believes that HP vehicles are exempt.

 

The fact is that particularly in the early stages f a HP agreement the hirer is in negative equity, so even if he were to return the car he would owe money to the lender, the idea of taking control of goods was to seize assets, or so I always thought.

DO NOT PAY UPFRONT FEES TO COLD CALLERS PROMISING TO WRITE OFF YOUR DEBTS

DO NOT PAY UPFRONT FEES FOR COSTLY TELEPHONE CONSULTATIONS WITH SO CALLED "EXPERTS" THEY INVARIABLY ARE NOTHING OF THE SORT

BEWARE OF QUICK FIX DEBT SOLUTIONS, IF IT LOOKS LIKE IT IS TO GOOD TO BE TRUE IT INVARIABLY IS

Link to post
Share on other sites

I know they do, because a lot of them believe themselves to be a class above the rest of us.

 

 

I can just picture the courts being full of finance companies if they try that one on.

Link to post
Share on other sites

I struggle to understand how the Judge made this decision. For the past hour or so I have been speaking with the litigant (Mr O R) and during the call I noticed that Schedule 2 states that an 'interest' is a 'beneficial interest'. Way outside of my limited training I'm afraid !!!

 

What is difficult to understand as well is that the finance agreement had only been in place for little more than 6 months !!!

 

The debtor is an extremely nice person and he realises that he should not have issued an injunction without first issuing a proper legal notice (Notice to Claim to Exempt Goods) under CPR 85 etc but that to one side, we are where we are and on Tuesday he will speak with the Finance Company given that any claim should really have come from them (as owners of the vehicle) and not him personally. Another error I'm afraid.

 

The litigant has given me permission to state that despite what may be written elsewhere, he has not decided to appeal the case and will not be making any decision until after speaking with the finance company on Tuesday.

 

Given the subject matter I will post back later (going out for the day) but would like to stress that any discussions should only be on the subject of whether a vehicle subject to finance can legally be taken.

Link to post
Share on other sites

There is also the problem of section 90 of the Consumer credit act to consider, which says that goods under a hire purchase agreement, once over one third of he contractual payment have been made become"protected goods".

 

This means that they cannot be reclaimed by the lender without an order form the court. The act goes on to say that should the lender ignore this and reclaim the car in any case he will have to reimburse the lender all payment made on the contract up until that date.

 

There is case law which states that the status of protected goods also permits action for the commencement of proceedings under the tort of conversion should the goods be removed from the hirer.

DO NOT PAY UPFRONT FEES TO COLD CALLERS PROMISING TO WRITE OFF YOUR DEBTS

DO NOT PAY UPFRONT FEES FOR COSTLY TELEPHONE CONSULTATIONS WITH SO CALLED "EXPERTS" THEY INVARIABLY ARE NOTHING OF THE SORT

BEWARE OF QUICK FIX DEBT SOLUTIONS, IF IT LOOKS LIKE IT IS TO GOOD TO BE TRUE IT INVARIABLY IS

Link to post
Share on other sites

I struggle to understand how the Judge made this decision. For the past hour or so I have been speaking with the litigant (Mr O R) and during the call I noticed that Schedule 2 states that an 'interest' is a 'beneficial interest'. Way outside of my limited training I'm afraid !!!

 

What is difficult to understand as well is that the finance agreement had only been in place for little more than 6 months !!!

 

The debtor is an extremely nice person and he realises that he should not have issued an injunction without first issuing a proper legal notice (Notice to Claim to Exempt Goods) under CPR 85 etc but that to one side, we are where we are and on Tuesday he will speak with the Finance Company given that any claim should really have come from them (as owners of the vehicle) and not him personally. Another error I'm afraid.

 

The litigant has given me permission to state that despite what may be written elsewhere, he has not decided to appeal the case and will not be making any decision until after speaking with the finance company on Tuesday.

 

Given the subject matter I will post back later (going out for the day) but would like to stress that any discussions should only be on the subject of whether a vehicle subject to finance can legally be taken.

 

Good to hear the litigant is in safe hands finally.

 

The protected goods issue is one that needs to be raised with the finance company, as they cannot give authority for the vehicle to be removed without an order of the court, to do so would leave them open to an action for conversion.(section 90 consumer credit act)

DO NOT PAY UPFRONT FEES TO COLD CALLERS PROMISING TO WRITE OFF YOUR DEBTS

DO NOT PAY UPFRONT FEES FOR COSTLY TELEPHONE CONSULTATIONS WITH SO CALLED "EXPERTS" THEY INVARIABLY ARE NOTHING OF THE SORT

BEWARE OF QUICK FIX DEBT SOLUTIONS, IF IT LOOKS LIKE IT IS TO GOOD TO BE TRUE IT INVARIABLY IS

Link to post
Share on other sites

....on the subject of whether a vehicle subject to finance can legally be taken.

 

 

If someone decides it can, then that 'must' open collections up to everything. So and so is not home so we will take possessions from their neighbour.

Link to post
Share on other sites

I am glad that someone else has picked up what I stated ages ago that "the debtor has an interest in the goods" may be liable to action. This is covered in many Acts and is complicated.

 

 

In some Acts its a breach of contract in others, like the PoCA its different and so on the CPS lists one version the Sherriff's list another the Police yet another where does it all end?

 

 

One rule for one and another well you know the rest....

If I have been of any help, please click on my star and leave a note to let me know, thank you.

Link to post
Share on other sites

In TCG its schedule 12 Part 1 (3)©(a)/(b)

 

 

See here http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2007/15/schedule/12

 

 

Partial quote

 

 

"General interpretation

 

 

3(1)In this Schedule

 

  • “amount outstanding” is defined in paragraph 50(3);
  • “control” (except in paragraph 5(4)(a)) means control under an enforcement power;
  • “controlled goods” means goods taken control of that—
    (a) have not been sold or abandoned,
     
    (b) if they have been removed, have not been returned to the debtor (unless subject to a controlled goods agreement), and
     
    © if they are goods of another person, have not been returned to that person;
  • “controlled goods agreement” has the meaning given by paragraph 13(4);
  • “co-owner” in relation to goods of the debtor means a person other than the debtor who has an interest in the goods, but only if the enforcement agent—
    (a) knows that the person has an interest in the particular goods, or

    (b) would know, if he made reasonable enquiries;
  • “the court”, unless otherwise stated, and subject to rules of court, means—
    (a) the High Court, in relation to an enforcement power under a writ of the High Court;
     
    (b) a county court, in relation to an enforcement power under a warrant issued by a county court;
     
    © in any other case, a magistrates' court;

If I have been of any help, please click on my star and leave a note to let me know, thank you.

Link to post
Share on other sites

I agree that on the face of it, this should be challenged. It appears an incorrect judgment.

 

I would like to understand better the term 'beneficial interest', as I know enough to know it is not as simplistic as being being owner or part owner of something (which the debtor here was not). It covers other areas like beneficial usage and is an area of law which is way beyond what I will ever understand.

Link to post
Share on other sites

I have come across the term in relation to land mortgages and charges, where the owner of the title creates a charge on his property and assigns it to the lender, who then has a beneficial interest in his land, although not the title.

 

In the case of a HP agreement the hirer does not have title but he does have use of the car, is that a beneficiary interest in the goods, not sure TBH.

DO NOT PAY UPFRONT FEES TO COLD CALLERS PROMISING TO WRITE OFF YOUR DEBTS

DO NOT PAY UPFRONT FEES FOR COSTLY TELEPHONE CONSULTATIONS WITH SO CALLED "EXPERTS" THEY INVARIABLY ARE NOTHING OF THE SORT

BEWARE OF QUICK FIX DEBT SOLUTIONS, IF IT LOOKS LIKE IT IS TO GOOD TO BE TRUE IT INVARIABLY IS

Link to post
Share on other sites

That is what I'm wondering - as beneficial usage comes under the umbrella of beneficial interest, does that cover this event? As stated above, I'm out of my depth and know enough to know that, so it would be daft of me to try to comment.

Link to post
Share on other sites

What is beneficial interest?

 

Beneficial interest is an interest in the economic benefit of property. It can give you a right to live in a property, a financial share in it, or both. Beneficial interest can arise if some form of trust has been created.

This can be a very complex area of law and you'll need the help of a solicitor if it applies to you.

 

 

Referenced from https://www.citizensadvice.org.uk/wales/relationships/relationship-problems/relationship-breakdown-and-housing/if-you-live-with-your-partner-relationship-breakdown-and-housing/if-you-live-with-your-partner-and-you-own-your-home-relationship-breakdown-and-housing/relationship-breakdown-and-housing-beneficial-interest-if-you-own-your-home-jointly-with-your-partner/

 

 

Then it really gets complicated in as much as it can go to trust

 

 

See In TCG its schedule 12 Part 3(2)(a)(b)

 

 

(2)In this Schedule—

(a)references to goods of the debtor or another person are references to goods in which the debtor or that person has an interest, but

(b)references to goods of the debtor do not include references to trust property in which either the debtor or a co-owner has an interest not vested in possession.

If I have been of any help, please click on my star and leave a note to let me know, thank you.

Link to post
Share on other sites

See In TCG its schedule 12 Part 2(11)(2) what are your thoughts on this part?

 

 

11(1)Subject to paragraphs 9 and 10 and to any other enactment under which goods are protected, an enforcement agent

(a)may take control of goods anywhere in England and Wales;

(b)may take control of any goods that are not exempt.

(2)Regulations may authorise him to take control of exempt goods in prescribed circumstances, if he provides the debtor with replacements in accordance with the regulations.

If I have been of any help, please click on my star and leave a note to let me know, thank you.

Link to post
Share on other sites

It seems to me that the question of if the use of the car forms a beneficial interest is irrelevant.

 

The creditor will want to recover money from the debtor, so it is the financial interest in the property which would be the relevant factor.

 

If the car went to auction and was sold all money recovered would have to go to the finance company because it is their property, none would go to the creditor. It would be a farce.

 

The only purpose of using this loophole(if there is one) would be to inconvenience the debtor, IMO.

DO NOT PAY UPFRONT FEES TO COLD CALLERS PROMISING TO WRITE OFF YOUR DEBTS

DO NOT PAY UPFRONT FEES FOR COSTLY TELEPHONE CONSULTATIONS WITH SO CALLED "EXPERTS" THEY INVARIABLY ARE NOTHING OF THE SORT

BEWARE OF QUICK FIX DEBT SOLUTIONS, IF IT LOOKS LIKE IT IS TO GOOD TO BE TRUE IT INVARIABLY IS

Link to post
Share on other sites

It will be interesting to see how any appeal or precedent setting case pans out, lets hope that it doesn't turn out to be a can of worms we wished we had not opened.

DO NOT PAY UPFRONT FEES TO COLD CALLERS PROMISING TO WRITE OFF YOUR DEBTS

DO NOT PAY UPFRONT FEES FOR COSTLY TELEPHONE CONSULTATIONS WITH SO CALLED "EXPERTS" THEY INVARIABLY ARE NOTHING OF THE SORT

BEWARE OF QUICK FIX DEBT SOLUTIONS, IF IT LOOKS LIKE IT IS TO GOOD TO BE TRUE IT INVARIABLY IS

Link to post
Share on other sites

See In TCG its schedule 12 Part 2(11)(2) what are your thoughts on this part?

 

 

11(1)Subject to paragraphs 9 and 10 and to any other enactment under which goods are protected, an enforcement agent

(a)may take control of goods anywhere in England and Wales;

(b)may take control of any goods that are not exempt.

(2)Regulations may authorise him to take control of exempt goods in prescribed circumstances, if he provides the debtor with replacements in accordance with the regulations.

 

I suppose if the exempt goods are of a value which would merit them being removed and replaced with one of a cheaper but equally functional quality.

DO NOT PAY UPFRONT FEES TO COLD CALLERS PROMISING TO WRITE OFF YOUR DEBTS

DO NOT PAY UPFRONT FEES FOR COSTLY TELEPHONE CONSULTATIONS WITH SO CALLED "EXPERTS" THEY INVARIABLY ARE NOTHING OF THE SORT

BEWARE OF QUICK FIX DEBT SOLUTIONS, IF IT LOOKS LIKE IT IS TO GOOD TO BE TRUE IT INVARIABLY IS

Link to post
Share on other sites

  • Recently Browsing   0 Caggers

    • No registered users viewing this page.

  • Have we helped you ...?


×
×
  • Create New...