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    • I have received a PCN from Euro Car Parks for MFG - Esso Cobham - Gravesend. I was completely unaware that there was any such limit for parking and always considered this to be a service station. I stopped there to use the toilet, have a coffee and made a couple of work calls. I have read the previous topics on this location which suggest I can ignore this and ECP will not take legal action. The one possible complication is that the vehicle is leased by my employer so I do not want to involve them with the associated reminders and threatening letters. The PCN was first issued to the leasing company Arval who have notified ECP of the hiring company. I have attached a copy of the PCN Notice to Hirer with details removed as per instructions. What options do I have or should I just pay the PCN promptly at the reduced rate of £60? img20240424_23142631.pdf
    • What you have uploaded is a letter with daft empty threats from third-party paper tigers.  Just ignore it. What we need to see is the original invoice you received last October or November.
    • Thanks for posting the CPR contents. i do wish you hadn't blanked out the dates and times since at times they can be relevant . Can you please repost including times and dates. They say that they sent a copy of  the original  PCN that they sent to the Hirer  along with your hire agreement documents. Did you receive them and if so can you please upload the original PCN without erasing dates and times. If they did include  all the paperwork they said, then that PCN is pretty near compliant except for their error with the discount time. In the Act it isn't actually specified but to offer a discount for 14 days from the OFFENCE is a joke. the offence occurred probably a couple of months prior to you receiving your Notice to Hirer.  Also the words in parentheses n the Act have been missed off. Section 14 [5][c] (c)warn the hirer that if, after the period of 21 days beginning with the day after that on which the notice to hirer is given, the amount of unpaid parking charges referred to in the notice to keeper under paragraph 8(2)(f) or 9(2)(f) (as the case may be) has not been paid in full, the creditor will (if any applicable requirements are met) have the right to recover from the hirer so much of that amount as remains unpaid; Though it states "if any applicable ...." as opposed to "if all applicable......" in Section 8 or 9. Maybe the Site could explain what the difference between the two terms mean if there is a difference. Also on your claim form they keeper referring to you as the driver or the keeper.  You are the Hirer and only the Hirer is responsible for the charge EVEN IF THEY WEREN'T THE DRIVER. So they cannot pursue the driver and nowhere in the Hirer section of the Act is the hirer ever named as the keeper so NPC are pursuing the wrong person.  
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      On 15/1/24 booked appointment with Big Motoring World (BMW) to view a mini on 17/1/24 at 8pm at their Enfield dealership.  

      Car was dirty and test drive was two circuits of roundabout on entry to the showroom.  Was p/x my car and rushed by sales exec and a manager into buying the mini and a 3yr warranty that night, sale all wrapped up by 10pm.  They strongly advised me taking warranty out on car that age (2017) and confirmed it was honoured at over 500 UK registered garages.

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    • We have finally managed to obtain the transcript of this case.

      The judge's reasoning is very useful and will certainly be helpful in any other cases relating to third-party rights where the customer has contracted with the courier company by using a broker.
      This is generally speaking the problem with using PackLink who are domiciled in Spain and very conveniently out of reach of the British justice system.

      Frankly I don't think that is any accident.

      One of the points that the judge made was that the customers contract with the broker specifically refers to the courier – and it is clear that the courier knows that they are acting for a third party. There is no need to name the third party. They just have to be recognisably part of a class of person – such as a sender or a recipient of the parcel.

      Please note that a recent case against UPS failed on exactly the same issue with the judge held that the Contracts (Rights of Third Parties) Act 1999 did not apply.

      We will be getting that transcript very soon. We will look at it and we will understand how the judge made such catastrophic mistakes. It was a very poor judgement.
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      This is good ethical practice.

      It would be very nice if the parcel delivery companies – including EVRi – practised this kind of thing as well.

       

      OT APPROVED, 365MC637, FAROOQ, EVRi, 12.07.23 (BRENT) - J v4.pdf
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Alternative Dispute Resolution (Mediation)


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Mediation is a must if you want to stay on the right side of the judge and avoid the opposing party using a refusal to mediation against you during the case.

 

Specific attention is being paid by courts to timescales in orders; and the use of Alternative Dispute Resolution (ADR) such as mediation. Practice Direction- Pre-Action Conduct section 1.2(2) and section 8 asks participants to consider ADR methods before going down a more formal route, and the Civil Procedure Rules (CPR) part 1.4(e) asks parties to explore the suitability to mediate. If a mediation offer is not considered or explored, refused or ignored, this is now being seen as unreasonable failure to comply with a rule, practice direction or a relevant pre-action protocol.

 

Recently ignoring a request to mediate (i.e. not responding one way or another) was seen as ‘an unreasonable refusal’ to mediate and incurred costs implications for the offending party (PGF ii SA – v – OMFS Company Limited [2013] EWCA CIV 1288 2nd October Court of Appeal.) Sanctions can be anything, at the judges behest.

 

The mediators opening gambit is to ask you 'what is the nature of your grounds to dispute the claim'. It is important you remember the burden of liability and strict proof. This is the ideal opportunity to find out exactly what the claimant has against you i.e. refer to the particulars of claim and do not deviate from them. Answer the claimant’s position and claim; and do not expand at this stage. The claimant will have to support their case and answer your disputed issues. This may sound like I am asking you to be difficult, not at all. You are the defendant and only have to defend the claimants claim but you will do no harm to your case by finding out what they have against you.

 

My point being, you don't want the claimant having the opportunity of obtaining all of your argument and then using the mediation to satisfy CPR but not taking it seriously; and then tailoring a WS to defeat your position whilst giving you no such information during mediation. So initially (first 15mins) use the time to gain some idea of the actual substantiation the claimant has against you. It will help you evaluate the need to settle and potential settlement you are willing to go to as the mediation progresses.

 

The mediation itself will be brief and probably seem rushed, as you only have an hour. It is important you get your matters of dispute out early, to leave enough time to negotiate. Take notes of their argument in case you don't settle, this will help others on here to advise re your WS.

 

The mediator will shuttle between the two parties passing information backwards and forwards. They may play devil’s advocate and challenge your position and you will feel under pressure, but don't. The mediator wants to settle and move on, they are paid a flat fee and work on volume, don't be pressured and do have yourself prepared for the mediation with everything you want to say and have ready your various negotiating positions.

 

Settlement can be financial i.e. a lower value over an agreed term of instalments, and can also be in relation to the actual terms i.e. the claimant with notify the defendant of a default in writing and will allow 14 days to remedy this default- as opposed to a term which states the claimant upon default by the defendant can go straight to court to claim the original amount due to a default of this agreement.

 

You really need to work out what you can afford and what you are prepared to pay, over what period and on what terms. That way you do not waste time with basic elements of negotiation. Start with a best case scenario offer and be prepared to narrow the gap between you. That may change the more you find out about their case.

 

Approach this mediation with an open mind and with an appetite to settle, if that is what you want. You have a great opportunity to bring closure on your terms, without having a judgement imposed on you by a judge; and avoid the possibility of attending court, avoiding a possible CCJ, avoiding the stress and the other issues that this dispute or possible judgement against you brings.

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In view of applying the new regulations with regards to European Regulations coming into force 2015/16 into UK Law...mediation will become more mainstream in the litigation process....how it will fit into Consumer Credit Law is yet to be fully established.

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  • 1 year later...

We could do with some help from you.

PLEASE HELP US TO KEEP THIS SITE RUNNING EVERY POUND DONATED WILL HELP US TO KEEP HELPING OTHER

 

Have we helped you ...?         Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group - The National Consumer Service

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  • 2 years later...

We could do with some help from you.

PLEASE HELP US TO KEEP THIS SITE RUNNING EVERY POUND DONATED WILL HELP US TO KEEP HELPING OTHER

 

Have we helped you ...?         Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group - The National Consumer Service

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  • 11 months later...

We could do with some help from you.

PLEASE HELP US TO KEEP THIS SITE RUNNING EVERY POUND DONATED WILL HELP US TO KEEP HELPING OTHER

 

Have we helped you ...?         Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group - The National Consumer Service

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