Hi just wondered if anyone can help

i made a claim for ppi well PBP from a old Monument account,

bit strange really just found my old card one day and then found this forum then within a couple of days all this happens

i made a call to monument made a claim for pbp they said yeah no probs we will deal with your claim

you need to do nothing, and to be honest so far after 3 weeks i have spoke to them only twice

then the other day a letter arrived dated 05/08/2014 Final Response

Says

Dear Mr

I write further to your recent correspondence

we have reviewed your account and can confirm you subscribed to the payment break plan ("PBP") product

Without admission of liability, we are prepared to refund to you these fees plus compound interest (at today,s account interest rate of 28.82%)

from the date of the fee, as shown below:

Charges £624.54

Account rate interest £417.27

8% statutory compensation £477.46

less income tax at 20% £95.49

Total Refund £1423.78 (charges plus interest)

Now i thought great happy days

Then i remembered didnt i owe them a couple of hundred pounds

so i called them up at customer relations and the lady said

a cheque was rasied on the 06/08/2014 for £963.00 (about that)

because you owed us money on the account (big jump from £200)

which was being chased by a third party company called JCIA

now the reason for my long boring post is, is this legal ??

can they take this money without first showing me what i owed them

second take money from me to pay a third party company that they sold the debt to ??

i would have thought they should be made to pay me

and then i do a deal with JCIA who i do recall sending me a letter once 5 years ago

if anyone knows if Monument can do this please let me know

Cheers

no they cannot

the debt has been sold on.

dx

from the FOS website

where the business has “written off” or “sold on” the consumer’s debt

Some businesses make a commercial decision to “write off” or “sell on” a consumer’s debt when it is significantly in arrears.

But different businesses use different terminology.

For example, a business may say that it has “sold on” or “written off” a debt when it has actually transferred it from one part of its own business to another.

Where a business has genuinely “written off” a debt

– meaning that it has agreed not to seek repayment in any circumstances

– it might say that it is unfair for it to pay compensation to the consumer for the mis-sale of the PPI

when the consumer did not pay the contractual payments on their debt.

The business might say that the compensation should be offset against the amount of the debt it has written off.

Where this happens, the consumer will usually say that because the debt does not exist any more they should receive all of the compensation.

In order to fairly compensate the consumer we will consider the position they would have been in if they had not taken out the PPI.

We might conclude that the consumer would have fallen behind with the payments to their debt anyway

and the debt would ultimately have been written off

– but we will consider any evidence that the consumer has that this would not have been the case.

Where we decide that the debt would ultimately have been written off anyway

we will usually tell the business to restructure the loan to remove the effect of PPI

– that is, reduce the amount written off to what would have been written off

if the consumer had taken out the loan without PPI.

If there is any remaining compensation owed to the consumer because they have paid more than they would have done without PPI,

we would usually say it is fair for the business to offset that compensation against any remaining amount it wrote off.

Where a business simply moved a consumer’s debt from one part of its business to another,

rather than selling it on, we would usually apply the approach we take when a consumer is in arrears

– set out above.

We would also apply this approach if a business chose to buy back a debt it had previously sold on to a third party.

But if the debt was sold on to a third party and it cannot be bought back,

or the business chooses not to buy it back,

we might take a slightly different approach.

That is because the consumer does not owe the business money

– it owes money to the third party that bought the debt instead.

When selling the debt the business made a commercial decision and accepted an agreeable price for the debt.

In those circumstances, we would usually tell the business to calculate the compensation as normal at the point it sold on the debt

– and to pay all parts of the compensation to the consumer.

The business should also consider the possibility that the consumer might have incurred further losses

since the debt was sold on as a result of PPI being included on their debt.

Based on examples of good practice we have seen, the example below shows how a business might set out

how it has calculated compensation for a mis-sold PPI policy alongside a loan that has been sold on to a third party:

what we know

• in 2006 you took out a loan for £10,000 over a term of seven years;
  
• we added the cost of your PPI premium to your loan. That was £2,000, so your total loan was for £12,000;
  
• you stopped making payments to your loan in 2008 and made no further payments until we sold your loan on to a third party in 2010; and
  
• you have not been charged any further interest or incurred any further charges as a result of the PPI being added to your debt since we sold it on.
  

what we have assumed

• if you had taken out your loan without the PPI policy, you would have stopped making payments to it in 2008 and we would have sold it on to a third party in 2010.
  

If you do not think that this assumption should be used in your circumstances, please let us know why not.

what we have calculated

• when we sold your loan to a third party, the outstanding balance of your loan was £11,250;
  
• if you had instead taken out your loan without the PPI policy, the outstanding balance at the point we sold your loan to a third party would have been £9,500; and
  
• your loan repayments were £190 per month – without PPI they would have been £160 per month (a difference of £30 per month).
  

what we will do

• We will pay you the difference between the balance of your loan when we sold it to a third party (£11,250) and what the balance of the loan would have been without PPI (£9,500), which is £1,750. We will also add interest at 8% per year simple to that amount from the date we sold your loan until now, which is a further £280.
  
• In addition we will refund to you the extra monthly costs you paid as a result of having PPI added to your loan, which is £30 (for the period you actually made monthly payments). We will also add interest at 8% per year simple to each overpayment from the date it was paid until now. So in total, to refund these payments, we will pay you £690 plus interest of £275.
  
• The total redress we will pay to you is therefore £2,995 (including interest of £555).
  

Thanks for your response

any idea how or what i should do next

was thinking of just getting on the phone and telling them i believe they are wrong and should re-think their response

I would email them the relevant FOS page

from the site

they know full well they CANNOT offset

dx

sorry to seem dim

which page is that

and thanks for the help dx

Jay

you have checked they are correct on the refund have you?

you'll need the statements.

do you have them?

dx

Yes they sent me a breakdown of the pbp payments of when and how much i paid

from 13/112003 to 12/09/2008

but no details on how much they claim i owe them

any chance you can scan that up

it would be useful to us

**you can post up images/letters by this method immediately..you don't need 10 posts**

.

set your default scan page size to A4 less than 300DPI [150 will do]

scan the required letters/agreements/sheets - as a picture[jpg] file

don't forget you can use a mobile phone or a digital camera too!!

'

BUT......

ENSURE: remove all pers info inc. barcodes etc

but leave all monetary figures and dates.

.

************************* ************************* *******

{DO NOT USE A BIRO OR PEN OR USE SEE THRU TAPE OR LABELS]

************************* ************************* ***********

IPHONE only, take a pic and convert to pdf via an APP

.

DO IT IN MSPAINT.EXE or any photo editing program

goto one of the many free online pdf converter websites ...

http://freejpgtopdf.com/

http://www.convert-jpg-to-pdf.net/

..

if you have multiple scans/pics

put them in a word doc FIRST and convert that to PDF

or http://www.freepdfconvert.com/

or

use www.pdfmerge.com

convert existing PC files to PDF [office has an installable print to PDF option]

..

it would be better to upload a multipage pdf if

you have many images too rather than many single pdfs

.

or if you have PDF as an installed printer drive use that

or use word and save as pdf

or use Primo PDF.

.

try and logically name your file so people know what it is.

though DONT USE BANK NAMES or CAG in the title

i'e Default notice DD-mm-yyyy

.

open a new msg box here

hit go advanced below the msg box

hit manage attachments below that box

hit the add files button on the top right

hit select files, navigate to your file on your pc

hit upload files

...

YOU DONT have to put a link to the attachment in the msg box..just upload it ..job done

you can click on your links to check them too!

.

dx

the letter and breakdown

sure but it has my account number ?? and there maybe spies LOL

follow the guide

redact it please

dx

..

Hope that helps

just as a game I thought i'd check them.

So looks about right then ??

they are £50 more than our est.

not bad.

now who is jcia?

dx

Hi dx

JCIA monuments debt collectors jefferson international

jeffersoncapitalinternational com/uk/debt-collections-services.html

Spoke to Monument

and by some surprise they are now telling me the debt is now with them and not with JCIA

yet it was last week

Amazing

if they are in house then the debt always was with them.

I think you need to ask for a breakdown of the current balance

or p'haps an sar to get all the new statements.

if there are new PENALTY charges involved

then they need to be taken into account

bearing in mind what the FCA are saying about penalties and PPI refunds.

any charges that were as a sole result of PPI

I e if the PPI to that date is removed

then no penalty situation would have existed

then they should be refunded too within the PPI claim.

I strongly suspect if the PPI is removed

you would not have remained 'in debt' til now

dx

They are telling me

that they can offset debt because the the fos page you told me don't count for PBP only ppi

two different products and the same rules don't apply because PBP refunds are goodwill

makes me laugh really cause all i thought when she said that was, i must have paid the PBP in goodwill too

And your right i would not have been in debt with them if the pbp was paid back before

if you look at my breakdown i only run up the debt in the last 3 pbp payments if that might have only been 1

what load of tosh!!

all PPI refunds are goodwill anyway!!

pers i'd be ringing the FOS and telling them monument say their page is wrong!!

dx

But Monument say PBP is not the same as PPI

I can believe they told me last week my debt was with a third party dca and this week its not even on their system lol

but they took £480 out of my payment that was sent on the 06/0/014 which of course has been sent worldwide post

and i asked them why have they not shown me what i am supposed to owe them

they said hmmmmmm i'm not sure don't show or say anything on the system this week

Just got the cheque today in the post for the total of £939.90

so they helped themselves to the small amount of £483.88

and got a basic letter with it, nice of them

Ok i am happy with this for now

they did not sell the debt and they have now had their £380.00 i owed them plus charges

now its time to try and get some other money back of them see my new thread