I have been moved from IB to ESA WRAG. I went for my first Work Focused Interview (WFI) yesterday and freely admit to being totally stressed out to the point I broke down crying. The lady I saw was pleasant enough. However she said I had to go to an interview with a company called Seetec and was told I only had to attend the one interview and decide where to go from there. But from reading around this is the Work Programme. She even gave me a sheet which says 'The Work Programme. When you've volunteered to take part'. I did not volunteer for anything! I have read so much confusing information about these work programmes. Being on ESA I cannot be forced to apply for jobs etc. But why would she say it's only one interview? Or is it the second of 6 interviews throughout the WFI period? I'm supposedly on income related ESA not contributions based but I am sure I saw something about a 12 month limit on her computer screen somewhere. I am totally confused about what is being expected of me here. I cannot cope with being forced into work or having to attend the work programme on a daily basis right away. I was thinking of doing some voluntary charity work to try and get over my fear of being outside working with others. This is as far ahead as I can envision right now. My head is spinning! Any advice and support welcome. Thanks in advance.

Hi,

First of all don't volunteer for anything especially the work programme.

You are obliged to attend six WFI's and that's it, don't worry about what you saw on the computer screen, 12 month limits only apply to contribution based ESA.

So what do I do when I get a letter from this Seetec or a phone call from them? Do I tell them I have not volunteered and ignore them? Will I get sanctioned if I don't attend?

So what do I do when I get a letter from this Seetec or a phone call from them? Do I tell them I have not volunteered and ignore them? Will I get sanctioned if I don't attend?

Establish if the Seetec interview is a WFI if it is you must attend, or you could be sanctioned, with regard to volunteering.

She even gave me a sheet which says 'The Work Programme. When you've volunteered to take part'

OK thanks. I will ask if it's a WFI and not a work programme (hopefully they won't lie to me. I refuse to sign anything that indicates a work programme regardless).

I am still somewhat confused. I am on ESA WRAG not ESA support. I am in the work related activity group. I cannot find ANYWHERE that says that I DO NOT have to attend the work programme. Only that if you are on the work programme you do not have to apply for jobs etc. So do I have to attend the work program or not whilst on ESA 'WRAG'? If you can also point out any citation saying YES I must attend or not whilst on ESA WRAG I would be very grateful. I know I have to atend WFI's but that is all I can gather. Thanks. EDIT: OK I found this page. http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/employment/jobseekers/programmesandservices/dg_197781 It says... "ESA and the Work Programme If you’re getting ESA and are in the work-related activity group you may have to take part in the Work Programme. There are some exceptions to this, like if you’re a: full-time carer lone parent with a child under five" So basically I do have to attend if the JC adviser tells me to? Notice the 'may' part. EDIT3: Also found this. http://www.sandwell.gov.uk/info/189/welfare_rights-advice/849/welfare_rights/6 "Work Related Activity Group If you are able to undertake some form of work related activity, then you will enter the Work Related Activity Group. You will receive a weekly payment of ESA. If you receive income-related ESA, you may be able to claim extra money for your husband, wife or civil partner. Anyone in the Work Related Activity Group will be assessed as being able to prepare for work, will be required to take part in a return to work programme. You will be assigned a personal adviser who will help you overcome any specific barriers to work, including having a skills check and getting involved in work experience opportunities and training. " So it looks like I must attend the work programme from everything I can find.

Hi,

I seems that things changed in the summer of 2011 and I was not up to speed with events, according to the information here http://www.cpag.org.uk/welfarereform/benefits_and_work_programme_factsheet.htm

You can be directed to engage in work related activity, but you cannot be forced to take a job or apply for one, apologies if I misled you in any way.

Yes this I already knew. But that does not exclude you from doing unpaid work (or basically working for you benefit at below minimum wage and effectively taking a job away from someone who WOULD get paid). If the company who is in charge of your particular work programme says so they can force you into doing unpaid work that may be totally unsuitable for your experience or health condition(s) as part of the 'work experience'. So they bit about not being forced to apply for jobs etc is irrelevant and totally misleading. I found the other part of the letter (It had two parts) I was so confused I did not see it. Basically it says I am in the work programme and it's pretty much compulsory. They changed it all with the welfare reform bill a couple of months ago. I could end up filling shelves in Wilkinsons up to 7 days a week or up to 30 hours a week depending. There is nothing about what happens if you have an eccident whilst working at these places or if you cause an accident who is going to cover insurance etc. Everything I read about it is a horror show. Here is a good article on it and the comments giving more info on it are just plain scary! http://johnnyvoid.wordpress.com/2012/04/02/vulnerable-people-forced-to-beg-and-steal-due-to-work-programme-claims-charity/ Oh and even if you do manage to find a job you can still be hounded by the work programme indefinitely apparently. It's madness!

OK this 'blog' written in April seems to contradict what I have read elsewhere. https://community.maggiescentres.org/blogs/blogviewentry/605405134311029 In it she seems to believe that those on the WRAG cannot be forced into unpaid slave labour. At least initially from what I can gather and that you are not forced into the work programme unless you are in the WRAG, have been assessed as being fit for work in the next 6 months and are now 3 months from that date (I have no idea if I am). She also indicates that even if you are in the work programme you cannot be forced into unpaid work (the non-existent workfare scheme but everyone still calls it that). It just gets more and more confusing and I reckon the government have deliberately made it this way to push this scheme through without people being able to fight it! EDIT: Addiotnal info. http://www.dwp.gov.uk/docs/wp-pg-chapter-2.pdf This is a guide for providers of the work programme. I am not sure when it is dated or if it is still relevant. But from the guide it says. "Mandatory ESA participants - All mandatory ESA participants (regardless of whether they have opted for early entry) can be required to undertake work-related activity that is reasonable in their circumstances. You can support ESA participants to apply for and take up work, but you may not mandate these participants to apply for jobs, undertake medical treatment, take up work or unpaid work experience. • Voluntary participants - Voluntary participants are not required to take part and their participation remains on an entirely voluntary basis. You may not mandate voluntary participants to undertake activity." I do so hope this is the case as even if I am forced to attend the work programme hopefully I should NOT be forced into doing unpaid work. But we shall see.

There still appears to be a lot of confusion surround the 'Work Programme'. I understand I have to attend the initial interview. I have read elsewhere that I do not have to sign a consent form allowing them to use my data and I do not have to consent to anything as regards to giving them the ability to confirm, deny or change the data they already hold on me. In fact from the site refusewp.com it appears I can even ask them to delete any data they have on me?

All I really want to know is. Do I have to attend the work programe on a regular basis or not? I can't seem to find concrete answers with regards to ESA claimants.

These guys seem to know a lot but there is no contact address for me to ask them some pertinent questions.

http://www.workprogramme.org.uk/

It seems I am going in circles with this :/

I have got my first interview under this programme on Thursday and I am terrified they will force me into something I am not able to do.

Did you find anything out OP?

I have got my first interview under this programme on Thursday and I am terrified they will force me into something I am not able to do.

Did you find anything out OP?

Not a great deal. Consensus seems to be that they can make you participate on either a monthly, fortnightly or even weekly basis. You must complete the action plan they provide or face sanctions. But don't make it easy for them by signing or verbally agreeing to consent in any way as it makes it harder for them and they cannot sanction you for not consenting. Only if you do not complete the action plans (That may include attending CV classes and other BS but not sure yet). I get seen Wednesday and will update you on what I have to do.

It's worth mentioning that if a sanction is applied to anyone on WRAG, it only effects the WRAG element of the benefit, the assessment rate would still be paid, little consolation for anyone on the receiving end of a sanction I know, but worth remembering.

It's worth mentioning that if a sanction is applied to anyone on WRAG, it only effects the WRAG element of the benefit, the assessment rate would still be paid, little consolation for anyone on the receiving end of a sanction I know, but worth remembering.

I am curious as to how this affects housing benefits. When I was switched from IB to ESA WRAG I forgot to tell HB and was promptly cutoff from receiving my HB. I had to go down to the HB office and prove I had been switch to ESA WRAG and have it reinstated and it took me another month to get the backdated payment. If this causes your HB to get 'mugged' everytime you are sanctioned this could be a real pain in the backside!

I got a my first interview tomorrow (WRAG) what I read so far they seem a bit clueless.

I had a letter from council saying my HB had been stopped because my ESA was stopped but I was appealing.

In fact ESA was starting and I never needed to appeal.

I am curious as to how this affects housing benefits. When I was switched from IB to ESA WRAG I forgot to tell HB and was promptly cutoff from receiving my HB. I had to go down to the HB office and prove I had been switch to ESA WRAG and have it reinstated and it took me another month to get the backdated payment. If this causes your HB to get 'mugged' everytime you are sanctioned this could be a real pain in the backside!

I think this would count as a change in circumstances but only as a technicality, the core benefit would still trigger the HB payment, but you are probably right in assuming that a 'mugging' would happen if HB was not informed!

Not a great deal. Consensus seems to be that they can make you participate on either a monthly, fortnightly or even weekly basis. You must complete the action plan they provide or face sanctions. But don't make it easy for them by signing or verbally agreeing to consent in any way as it makes it harder for them and they cannot sanction you for not consenting. Only if you do not complete the action plans (That may include attending CV classes and other BS but not sure yet). I get seen Wednesday and will update you on what I have to do.

Thank You - I would appreciate that.

Lilly

I am scuppered then as my illness is depression and there is no way I could attend any weekly sessions.

My attention spat is that of of a gnat - so I am in fear of this.

I also worry that I will cave in and sign something.

Basically then I have had it, if that is the case.

I also would need to do a round trip of 45 miles, on the bus so would need to be up at 6am as the buses are every 3 hours - I could not mentally handle that.

It pretty much went as expected. It's a job club by any other name. No voluntary about it. I got thrown in with a load of other people. Given a bunch of stuff to fill in. I wrote 'I refuse to sign' on the consent form and had a bit of a ding dong about what I could and could not be expected to do (and what to sign) with the people there. I have to attend on what looks like a fortnightly basis and was given an activity sheet telling me I have to create a CV, some proof of who I am (last bill etc) and login to their web****e and go through some of the propaganda before the next 'session'. They now have me by the gonads for the next 2 years basically. If I do not show up or do not do any of the activities they assign me my benefit will get cut.

If you feel you have a good case appeal the decision for WRAG if you can. I don't know if I would be worse off if I appealed or not though.

Heck I could not do any of that (throw me in with a group of people) and I would freak out.

I have got a CV it was done by connections some months ago, what good it is - as non of it applies any more.

I am even more stressed know, as I though this was a 1 to 1 with my advisor.

Heck I could not do any of that (throw me in with a group of people) and I would freak out.

I have got a CV it was done by connections some months ago, what good it is - as non of it applies any more.

 

I am even more stressed know, as I though this was a 1 to 1 with my advisor.

It may depend on who you are with and where you are. I am with Seetec. You get a 1 to 1 with someone but mine was with a bunch of other people in an open room.

It pretty much went as expected. It's a job club by any other name. No voluntary about it. I got thrown in with a load of other people. Given a bunch of stuff to fill in.

I am also confused as to the process. I have just been put on WRAG, so still awaiting first interview. From the documentation I can find, anyone on WRAG with 12+ months prognosis, the entry point is optional. But with this being run privately, I would think they want everyone in they can get to make more money.

At the first interview, did you put forward, that due to health issues, you would find interviews etc at this time would be detrimental to your mental and physical well-being? They are only allowed to mandate reasonable tasks based on your circumstances. They are also required to give you in writing what is mandatory.

Regards,

The entire system is 'rigged' so that you don't actually know what they have decided. They did not send me a letter telling me that they 'believe' I will be fit enough to work in 6 months time. But from the way my case has been handled it appears that this is what they have indeed decided. I cannot find any reference to the stuff about 12+ months prognosis and not having to attend you have implied. From reading it only seems to matter if you are a single mother or are part of ESA support. Then it is voluntary.

They did not send me a letter telling me that they 'believe' I will be fit enough to work in 6 months time.

I cannot find any reference to the stuff about 12+ months prognosis and not having to attend you have implied. From reading it only seems to matter if you are a single mother or are part of ESA support. Then it is voluntary.

Have a look at these:-

(Hope OK to post direct download links for documents (pdf format).

www.dwp.gov.uk/docs/wp-pg-chapter-2.pdf

check page 4 (entry/access point)

I cannot get the link to work for another pdf that shows entry points for JSA / IS and WRAG. Do a Google search for entry access point to work programme

Regards,

You must of been informed at some time as to how long you where on WRAG?

---

Not that I know of. I went from IB to ESS WRAG after a paper exercise. I never had a medical. I don't recall them giving any specific timeframes on the letter I receieved but I can always dig it out and have a better look.

ESA support and single mother yes, but also for WRAG with 12+ month prognosis, entry point is "optional from WCA outcome" (well from what I can find), so is optional(but may be seen as optional for job center referral?). But they may well of changed everything.

From what I can tell there is no optional if you are mandatory attend. I got them to check and they say I am down for mandatory.

Have a look at these:-

(Hope OK to post direct download links for documents (pdf format).

 

www.dwp.gov.uk/docs/wp-pg-chapter-2.pdf

check page 4 (entry/access point)

 

I cannot get the link to work for another pdf that shows entry points for JSA / IS and WRAG. Do a Google search for entry access point to work programme

 

Regards,

I'll have to dig into them thanks.