Hi,

I am not sure where to start and do not know if i am being too anxious but i will try and keep it short.

A while back, i recieved a ** day possession order for time to sell due to my mortgage company arrears.

I found a buyer and there is a huge shortfall, the mortgage company were aware of it and a few days before exchange they stated that they havent given consent!!

In the meantime they applied to the court for eviction warrant, and I went to court and ask the judge to suspend this and i was granted an additional ** days. The judge advised the claimants solicitor to take the offer from the current buyer and make the decision promtly or I am entitled to go to the high court and apply for an "order of sale".

In the meantime, i asked the claimant if i paid a HLC fee at the commencement of the mortgage and they said "no"....i was sure i did so i asked them to confirm this in writing, then a few weeks ago i get a letter stating the opposite and infact it was added to my account at the very beginning but they do not have details of any "possible insurance (or MIG)" being taken out......I spoke to the other mortgage company who originally sold the mortgage to them and they say that my existing mortgage company DO KNOW THIS INFO AS ALL WAS PASSED ONTO THEM WHEN IT WAS SOLD ON....This all sounds suspicous to me and maybe explains why they are stringing out the sale process as they know at the end of the day i am responsibly in the end and they will claim more and more from an insurance company!

They tell me they cannot agree to sell it at shortfall until i complete a "sale at short fall application form" and they have an "independant valuation" completed. why wait to this far down the line, why not do all this at the very beginning when i went under offer and the shortfall figures were quite clear?

My question is, i am so worried about the shortfall and how i will pay it back! at the moment i have no income and do not know what i could possibly offer them, will this effect there decision as to whether they will let it sale? also by signing this form, am i "admitting" to the shortfall (not 100% confirmed yet till all goes through)?

For your info,I have other creditors who at the moment recieve a token payment as i have no income and the property is vacant and unoccupied and exposed to desrepair or squatters!

I hope the above helps you understand my situation....any advice is appreciated.....

I have never heard of a "sale at shortfall application form".... and would be reluctant to sign it this late in the day until/unless it was something I fully understood. From the sound of things, it may be best to follow the advice of the Judge and go for the Order of Sale.

Hopefully, someone who's heard of this doc. or knows more about these things can advise you better.... but re. the shortfall; if you haven't got it, then they can't have it..... so stop stressing.

Well I just did a googly and I cant see any reference to this form. Have they sent you a copy ?

Well I just did a googly and I cant see any reference to this form. Have they sent you a copy ?

I asked them what the contents consists of and they mentioned one being "How do you propose to pay back the shortfall and how much per month do you propose to pay? who are your other creditors? etc".......

I was wondering if i should not acknowledge the form and/or verbally tell them i refuse to complete and sign as i do not understand it/do not see its purpose (as they could pursue me years down the line and my finances could have changed etc)

why inform them of my current financial info and proposals to pay back now by completing the form until the sale is complete.....

.....shall i give them all the paperwork i have regarding the prospective buyers, and how much they are willing to pay but i am awaiting their "decision for consent" to allow the sale to go through knowing the estimated shortfall figures themselves.......

I have never heard of a "sale at shortfall application form".... and would be reluctant to sign it this late in the day until/unless it was something I fully understood. From the sound of things, it may be best to follow the advice of the Judge and go for the Order of Sale.

 

Hopefully, someone who's heard of this doc. or knows more about these things can advise you better.... but re. the shortfall; if you haven't got it, then they can't have it..... so stop stressing.

 

I 'think' they intend to produce a consent or tomlin designed to tie you up with a cca regulated agreement to cover any shortfall in negative equity situation...... have a good read of it first, post copy on here [less personal identifiers] and try to get an appointment with CAB in the meantime.

Do you have any other assets/equity?

You say the property is vacant so I assume there are no individuals [including you] at risk........Whilst repossession may not be a pleasant thought you have to ask yourself if you are able to use their greed to your advantage.

Gez

I am not sure how to post docs on here but i sure will and get advice/opinions

I should recieve it in the post tomorrow. I asked them what the contents consists of and they mentioned one being "How do you propose to pay back the shortfall and how much per month do you propose to pay? who are your other creditors? etc".......

There's no way I'd sign that until I knew how legally binding it was. Be careful with Citizens Advice.... 'coz they don't know everything.

From what you've posted.... they either agree to the sale or go for a repossession and if they block the sale, then they'll have to repossess.... so it would seem that they're trying to tie you into something unsavoury here to "allow" you to do something that'll happen one way or another anyway. The only difference being that you'd be signing some kind of "agreement" here to enable them to chase you afterwards with fewer problems.

Not good.

I agree. I think maybe just give them all the details of the buyer, let them do an "independant valuation" and then let them base their decision on what they have before them and decide whether to let me sell or not based on me not signing this "form".....

Im not sure when i should apply to the high court? as the warrant was suspended, what if i do not get the same buyer...the more they drag this out the more i will owe after! its in their favour to, to just let the sale go through.......at what point shall i apply to the high court?

As for the HLC, why are they denying this and then when i request this in writing i get a confirmation that i did in fact pay and why are they not telling me about possible insurance? i paid this fee and paid interest ever since over the whole term of my mortgage so far, if they never got insurance then that means they recieved this fee for no purpose at all, right? (:

sorry, i am getting so axious over what i am going to owe at the end of it, the longer they drag it out, the more i will have to pay back........

I owed £56K once on an ex-repo debt..... and paid less than 2% to settle it (full and) finally. Focus on what you need to know now and let the future take care of itself.

I can't answer your questions without coming out of my comfort zone, so to speak..... but would think that the first part of your last post is the place to start.

I asked them what the contents consists of and they mentioned one being "How do you propose to pay back the shortfall and how much per month do you propose to pay? who are your other creditors? etc".......

This sounds pretty much like and Income and Expenditure form to me ?

Although someone has mentioned it might be in respect of a Tomlin order in order to ensure they are first in the pecking order of your debtors after sale/repossession.

It seems to me it might be worth your having one of these half hour free chats with a solicitor who understands this type of claim.

Could it be that they know i have another property and this "form" is associated with this, but as its a sole debt and my other property is jointly owned is it true they cannot obtain a charging order?

One thing to remember that with repossession it is their DUTY to obtain the best price available

So lets say for example - they stop the sale, the property is vandalised whilst stood empty and they then sell it for a lower offer than is currently on the table.

This means that they did not perform the DUTY required of them.

They cannot chase you for a shortfall which was due to their error in not taking a better offer

even better that you have evidence of this in your current court case.

So they could be digging their own grave......

By forcing the sale (if that is what you do) you are effectively relieving them of that duty (or that is what they will claim) so think twice about that (or at least get professional advice)

I see your point here.

.....so, am i right in thinking that i should not sign this form (i have it now but not sure how to upload on here!) "shortfall sale application form"

1.Should i just give them details again of the buyer and tell them to make there decision based on this info alone?

2.In there covering letter they mention they are charging me £255 for an "independant valuation" although i have 3!

3.they state "that a legal convenant will in due course be provided to you for signature in the presence of a solicitor as confirmation that you acknowledge the outstanding debt"..........

4.Q4 asks me to give details of my "other property", how much my mortgage is, how much i pay per month,whther its joint ownership and whether i have debts on it....

5.Q5 on this form it says "PROPOSALS-please let us know how you intent to replay the shortfall by means of monthly instalments?"...does this mean i am admitting to the debt?

Do not sign the form, it is a backdoor way of making you liable for any shortfall, whether you are LEGALLY liable for the whole of the shortfall claim or not. I had one some years ago from the Abbey and refused to sign it, especially after the way they had behaved.

I'd take it to the next level legally and leave them to foot the bill. Technically if you do get a shortfall you can go bankrupt and they would not receive anything.... just another option.

Thank you for your reply. At this stage bankruptcy is not an option to me as I do not know the implications and the "stigma" in the long-term. I will look more into this option though.

Will they refuse to give consent to sell if i do not sign "their" form? They have full details of the buyer so should they just make their decision from that info and not rely on me signing the form?

That sounds too hypothetical to answer.... you'll need to approach them. In writing.

I see your point. Well, i took the plunge and sent them all the necessary documents to make a final decision without me signing "their form"...wish me luck...i am so stressed with it all....

I have been looking through all references I have

and can't find any such document official or otherwise,

until clarified I would not sign.

Glad i mentioned it now on here, as another poster said, maybe its another piece of "liabillity for shortfall" documents under their belt!

IMHO there's a GREMLIN somewhere making

a great living out of producing ''official'' documents

for the financial industry.

Yes, i realise this now. o effectively, i was not "legally" obligated to sign it!

It certainly looks that way, if the

guys and girls on here can't find

a reference for that form with the

combined years of experience and

knowledge available then I think it's

a convenient invention.

Brig.

Phew! I am just glad i never completed it for the sake of it, with hope they give consent for the shortfall to reduce my big bill at the end...

I've looked on the net and in books no trace.

Hmm, i wonder what is was going to be used for!........