hi all

new to this site but so desperate for advice. Recieved letter last week explaining that i am being called to an interview under caution for living together with a partner. i am without a shadow of a doubt not living with anyone, however there are a few spokes to this wheel, i will list each one and then explain:

1: i am an adviser for jcp on carers leave for 5 years to care for my two children one who is 9 eating disorder and epilepsy, and one who is 4 asthma and eczema regular hospital a and e trips for attacks. no dla in payment as it keeps being refused working on this at min. i would not jepordise my own job and used to work on fraud so i know whats right and whats wrong.

2: I have a boyfriend who lives 11 miles away from me, he had been unemployed for 6 months and he was becoming increasingly depressed and has a history of self harm, i let him in december use my address too secure a job at a factory local to here on the provision that he changes it if he got the job, hes such a idiot sometimes and we argued about it every week and he still didnt change it due to poor sleeping pattern and bad memory he is on strong anti depressents as he has a mental health problem they cause memory loss and tiredness etc no excuse i know but he knows how angry i am that he ommited to do it, no other mail comes here as he dosnt live here, he is on the electoral roll at his home address and applied for a bank account from his home address only a few weeks ago. he offers me no financial assistance, he dosnt eat here or sleep here 2 x week max every other week i stay at his parents house with him . he uses my car at the min as he lent me his and i broke it so i feel obliged to help him. its my car my insrance policy.

he has written me a statement explaining that it is his fault and that i was unconsenting to him leaving it in my address, i am livid actually that he clearly disobeyed my instructions.

3. i am very ill, keep being taken into hospital for various things, due to my ex husband and his family living in yarmouth, i live 180 miles away !!!, i have to rely on my mum for help she is the only family i have also my friend helps if im ill, and my boyfriend and his mum and sister helps when i ask them. i am, due to thyroid problems awaiting an operation to have it removed however at the min i suffer from crippling pain in my hands hips and legs to the point i cant grip, undo buttons stand properly in a morning sometimes takes me up to an hour to get going, i never sleep due to my thyroid exhaustion ensues all the time, so occasionally he comes from work in a morning (he is on a permenant 5 night nightshift) to help me get up and be there incase i cant sort kids out, he is not the only one who does this my mum and friend come to, they share it, i cannot claim any care as i am under hospital care and can be remidied when i have my sugery, not a long term condition. im embarrassed 34 and i need help its soul destroying. i am ok in the latter part of the day when my body has warmed up. so if they have surveillance this is all they will have, him coming in a morning as he works nights i dont see him alot at all, he occasionally gets his dad to drop him off at night about an hour before he starts work so we can see each other !!!

i have all his mail stating that he lives at his home address, electoral roll etc, his car was parked outside opposite my house on a public freeway for 2 months due to the fact i broke it when i borrowed it, he sorned it but failed to move it, that as far as im concerned is not my business as its a public highway not a driveway, i live on a main road. He has given me his sorn to prove that. he has also written a statement to say that the use off address for a job he has abused against my will. i have a statement from his parents stating that he lives there pays board etc im quite willing to be interviewd in my home as i have nothing to hide. there are lots of other bits of evidence emails to employers etc, all my bills go out of my account dd and there is no evidence that he gives me money anywhere cuz he dosnt...... i do think that its the tax match they will of called me in on

i have sought legal advice today and he said his gut feeling was with all the evidence it will not go any further however because i am staff to make an example of me they may go ahead with prosecution, im devastated, not eaten for 7 days feel dreadful tearful, my daugther is now suffering she is now refusing food and medication, my boyfriend is so distraught he has refused to come here at all now and im under house arrest scared im being watched totally paranoid to the point i have had tendencys to do somthing silly, i am not a criminal, i have done nothing wrong, so why am i scared out of my mind ?? how much surveillance do they do ?? he never stays here at all 1 to 2 nights or none a week depends on how ill i am or if i have to drive the kids half way across the country to see thier dad he shares the driving because of my hand and joint problems. i know im rambling im just bemused in all of this ?

anyone help please ??

Welcome to the site.

First of all you are not the first with these issues and deff wont be the last.

No one is here to judge so please be patient for a response.

Hi hunni, you'll get some good advice soon I'm sure.

As you must know, there is no hard and fast rules as to what constitutes 'living together' and each case is assessed on it's own merits.

From what you have posted, you have a plethora of good and well documented supporting evidence. Take it with you, be honest and forthright in your discussion.

I don't feel you have anything to worry about.

Best wishes

Rae.

thank you, both for your encouraging words, still awake as you can see and have to be up with 2 small children in a few short hours !! hope your right rae, altho you never know what they will pull out of the bag....... altho i have racked my brains for every possible senario that may look a lil odd and am struggling really, cant believe i got to wait till 16th of april feelin like this, not sure if i can make it that far.

my main concern is my little girls health, she is seriously suffering as a result of my depression im tryin not to let it show but im poorly too and im exhausted and find it so difficult she isnt silly she knows when somthing is wrong, she will end up in hospital again through not eating and drinking and its frightning, they dont see the effect it has on innocent 3rd partys

Hi hunni,

I know this must be worrying and upsetting for you. But the 16th of April is only a week on Friday. Not that far away...

Just try to relax - so much easier said than done! You really do seem to have a lot going in your favour.

Best wishes

Rae.

Why dont you contact the investigator and ask if its possible to bring the interview forward? They have to give you an opportunity to seek legal advice which is why they give you a reasonable amount of notice but if they are able to fit you in I can see no reason why they shouldn't.

Have found some past threads from CAG on this;

Benefit fraud. Interview under caution! - The Consumer Forums

18 posts - 11 authors - Last post: 12 Dec 2008

On Friday I have to go to an interview under caution with the DWP. Why should I be nervous? Because I know I have been commiting fraud! ...

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/.../172236-benefit-fraud-interview-under.html - Cached - SimilarBenefit Fraud Interview Under Caution - worried sick - Page 2 ...‎ - 4 Mar 2010

Benefit Fraud Interview Under Caution - worried sick‎ - 2 Mar 2010

My Experience of interview under caution for benefit fraud and the ...‎ - 21 Aug 2009

Invited to Interview Under Caution Jobcentre Plus‎ - 20 May 2009

This may also be worth a look;

How to handle an interview under caution 13

A copy of the living together section of the Fraud Procedures and Instructions manual is attached. Some information you will see has been excluded - this includes examples of how to commit fraud which could jeopardise investigations, and as such it is not available in the public domain. the full version attached is the version I have.

LTAHAW.doc

thanks everyone, im still so upset, and reading that has made me feel worse i hate to think they have been watching mine and my kids every move !! they will of got him on surveillance coming and going however he does this cuz of my health conditions being so dibilitating at present and the sheer pressure looking after my epileptic daughter brings on is sometimes too much for any parent to handle, my mum helps too when she is here , so does my friend who is gay she comes up loads does that mean im having a relationship with her ??

Hey hunni,

Please relax! Any surveillance that may - or may not - have occurred will purely be a snapshot of your life. Not a 24/7 feature film.

Don't get upset. I know that is easier said then done. But you have such a strong case going for you. Concentrate on your documentation. On your proof. Forget the flim flam the 'other side' may believe they have.

Remain strong for yourself and your family.

I honestly believe you will find that this is all simply a storm in a teacup. They have to go through the motions and react the way they need to. You can prove you have done nothing wrong.

Best wishes

Rae x

Surveillance is only used in some very few cases (in the grand scheme of things) of potential fraud. There is a rigorous procedure that they have to go through to be granted authorisation to perform surveillence because they must be able to demonstrate good reason for carrying it out, due to the convention. Focus on the whole manual rather than tie yourself up in knots about the bits that may apply to you.

They will only prosecute where it can be demonstrated that any potential overpayment is in excess of £2000.00, and where a prosecution would be in the public interest. The evidence they have must be robust enough for the departmental solicitors to be convinced that the case can be proven in court beyond all reasonable doubt. Taking a case to prosecution is an expensive spend for the department, they will only do this where they have a very strong case against a person.

Prosecution involves a trial - which must be fair like any other, it is the court who would decide if the evidence is strong enough for a conviction in the case of a prosecution, not the DWP. So far, it is just an IUC. Please do not tie yourself up in knots worrying about anything beyond the IUC at the moment - easier said than done, I know. You and your solicitor believe that the evidence you have in your favour is strong.

Has your solicitor sought a disclosure from DWP?

Sorry people but it seems that goldfish are more important then....we have to pay for these people gold plated pensions from our council tax about 3 or 4 hunderd of our council tax goes towards these pensions. Do not matter circumstances or how old a council debt is they will go after it.

http://www.express.co.uk/posts/view/166216/-1-000-fine-for-selling-a-goldfish

My borough also clocks up 3.3 million for CEO's of deparments and there are 8 of them. There is over 30 borough in Greater London and if each of the top CEO's of departments gets over 3.3 million then that is a hell of lot of gold plated pensions to pay out for these people what cosy number to have...they are better paid than the PM and his lot of corrupt MP's:mad:

Hi ErikaPNP

You appear to be knowledgeable in the what they can and cant do when interviewing you under caution - I have to attend interview next week - however one of my neighbours came to my door this morning to tell me the DWP (Fraud Investigation) dept were looking for info on me and my partner! do u know if they are able to say where they are from and why the want the info??? absoloutly terrified -being investigated for living with partner - I am now but only after I moved house 18 months ago!! so why are they investigating me now, not on benefits - but they are trying to say I was living with partner for the past 10 years!!!! can you give me any advice, I know it prob looks bad but I am not agreeing to anythng they say just for the sake of it. Karen

thanks everyone, another 6 days to go still tho just want it over with, read lots of things, been told lots of things and still very confused. as for disclousure i wasnt aware i could get it until the solicitor asked for it a few mins before my interview starts, been back to the docs and they have put me on stronger meds, unfortunatly at present i have very active hyperthyroidism, fybromyalgia and being tested on and injected with hormones for other stuff, and still recovering froma recent operation, im 36 and feel dreadful, the help my boyfriend and family were giving me has stopped because they are all scared of getting me into trouble, i havnt seen my boyfriend at all for a while i keep in contact via phone but he is devastated that his caring for me has got me in this mess, i dropped a kettle full of boiling water this morning and also knocked a frying pan of hot oil onto the floor thank god my children were in the living room, all this i cant get a penny more or help because it isnt long term enough and will all go when i have my surgerys!! will they care about me being unwell, he may come round more to help but he certainly dosnt sleep here or pay my bills i have all the proof i need that i do that !!!

just done a calculation on what the income of the household would be if we claimed as a couple (which i hasten to add i havnt done as i never thought about it ) and we would be almost £600 better off !! while that still dosnt make me want him to move in surly this would suggest no wrong doing ???? !!!!

its hard to say not to worry, and to face an interview with any one from the DWP is hard, but when its your employer its worse, but are you worrying yourself to much for nothing, what you have put in your post suggests you have nothing to hide

Please take a breath and try to stop panicing.

Write things down, and try to look at them rationally.

Did he claim JSA from his own address, is he registered to vote at his own address.

What do neighbours know these days, anything they say will be here say nothing else.

I dont think they are going to make an example of you. You have nothing to hide and have done nothing wrong.

Stand back, and look at the situation again.

Please try to eat and look after yourself.

Its an allegation and you know you are innocent

I hope everything goes well

Can you involve your union

I have had this happen before and the interview wasn't nearly as bad as I was expecting, I hope it is the same for you. With my experience the people were there to gather information - not accuse me of anything - and were very understanding.

You can also call and arrange an interview at a different date and place thats more convenient for you - we didn't know this at the time and they told us afterwards we could have had them come much closer to us. You can also have someone accompany you to the interview if it helps.

mikey yes when he claimed jsa he claimed from his own address and he is on the electoral roll at his own address, everything is in his home address even the payslips that got me here in the first place !!! found out however this morning that not only could i of claimed dla for both my children i can also claim it for myself, spoke to the solicitor this morning who said that they could still prosecute, even tho better of calculations show that if we did decide to move in together we would be at worst case senario £100 per week better off !! surly that would count as a mitigating circumstance ??

still sat up and just gone through the whole of my bank statments from the day i claimed is in may to today highlighting all the supermarket, rent, bills etc there is absolutly no evidence of financial link, ive done a full breakdown of my incoe and expoenditure and my partner has emailed me the same for him showing where his money is going every month, he is currently setting up his own business with a partner and all his cash is mainly being ploughed into that !!! lol websites etc, think ive gathered far far far too much info but im not leaving anything to chance x

Aww hunni, I'm sure you have more evidence than you need. I have a picture in my mind of a poor highly frazzled interviewer wading through a mountain of supporting documentation!

I'm sure you'll be fine hunni.

Best wishes to you.

Rae

thanks rae , i hope your right xxxxx

well had the interview, found there had been 2 allegations 1 in june of last year (bearing in mind we had only just met then) and one in november, investigators claimed they didnt know who it was however they asked me for any possible names of people that may of done it. !! ?? they did surveillance on me in nov and jan described my partner as stocky thats the only descriptoin they gave he is 6ft 4 and well built but not stocky but i have loads of friends and relatives who would match that description !!!!

they did have the tax match which i knew they would and i explained that and gave them the statement from my partner that was that...i explained about the bank and that i helped him when his account was shut down by miss management, they didnt want all the statments from the bank i had prepared and colour coded with incomings outgoings and direct debits etc and showing i gave him his money back. why??????

the surveillance is very sketchy, i explained about the car breaking i thought id said end of jan but they confused me, it was end of jan as i had a new car then, there was 4 days the car didnt move they tried to say he was on holiday from work maybe and i said no the car had broke like i first said !!!! i told them the truth that he was letting me use his car and that on the first period of surveillance he came to help me as i had just come out of hospital after five days admission i could not manage and that the second period was purly because of my health condition and to help me in a morning which has been ongoing for 6 months (had evidence of all admissions appointments and conditions but they didnt want them). they did not use surveillance on the back of my house (they did not disclose they did and been told because i said he left by that door they would of had to of mentioned it which is the exit he leaves cuz i only have 1 key for each door he leaves slightly after nme cuz of the times he is picked up or his bus or train arrves he drops the keys to my mum on his way into town as i only got 1 back door key (well they didnt say anything) everyone said if it was a iuc they would of had to of disclosed if they had, i saw no photographs or video, does this mean that it was just jotted down on a not pad ?? everyone is saying that if they had they would of had to of let me see it ? so i could defend it ???

also they were obviously watching the house for my partner coming in and out of the house they knew if he was in there but.... they followed me alone with my kids to school and then me to college in a morning .........why ?? if the issue is me livin with my partner then should they not watch the house to watch his movements ???

they also hung onto the first allegation for 5 months if no evidence was there it should of gone to compliance for home visit??? why hang onto it for that long..

at the end of the interview they didnt want any of the evidence i prepared no proof he had his money back, only 1 letter from his address, the statement from his mum and himself the sorn for his car to prove it was off road at end of jan, kept tellin me not to worry as i wanted them to have the whole lot of evidence to prove i was innocent !!!

solicitor said that i did well and he thinks ill not hear anymore and that their dates were not consistant at all, i didnt notice this but he did,

its caused massive stress and worry and now i got to wait for a dm to decide my life !!!

if anyone got any answers to my questions i would be grateful x

* would they have to disclose all evidence

*why follow me to college when they thought partner was inside

* should i have seen any vidoe photo evidence they had (they didnt say it was either they just said surveillance)

*why hang onto allegation a normal customer would of had a visit from compliance

also they said that because the first allegation was just after i had claimed(bearing in mind we was not together then!!) that if an o/p was decided that it would go from the first allegation!! ??

surly if there was no evidence from the first to the 2nd then no fraud can be proved??? not that the evidence they have now is any more than circumstantial ?? and that i have done anyhting wrong !!! im so confused