Help – I’ve been caught using my husband’s Travelcard by FCC Revenue Inspectors and I’m in a complete mess!

I had been with my husband visiting his sick mother when our childcare arrangements fell through at short notice. I had to get the next train back home from Kent to Croydon as my husband was staying at his mother’s and needed the car. In the rush to the station I asked my husband for some cash for the fare – I didn’t have any money in my own purse. He handed me his plastic ticket ‘pouch’ which contained his annual Travelcard, a credit card and some cash. I had fully intended buying a ticket to cover the journey home but the ticket office at the (overground) station wasn’t open and I could see that another customer was having problems using the ticket machine.

When I got off the train at London Bridge an East Croydon train was on a nearby platform. It was about to leave so I jumped onto it. I should have stopped to buy a ticket but again my only thought at that moment was to get back home as quickly as possible to pick up my children.

When the inspectors asked me for my ticket I panicked – I didn’t want to admit that I didn’t have the correct ticket and showed my husband’s Travelcard. When asked for a photocard to back it up I panicked again and said I didn’t have it on me but when challenged told the truth and offered to pay the maximum penalty fare. I wish I had been honest with them at the first opportunity and admitted I didn’t have a ticket but as I said, I panicked. They then questioned me under caution.

Next I received a letter from FCC asking for my comments on the allegations of

• travelling without a valid ticket
  
• receiving a ticket with intent
  

both breaches of national railway bye-laws. The letter said they would always push for the maxim penalty and that this could be criminal record, fine of up to £1000, prison sentence, suspended sentence, community service, seizure of any computer equipment (if involved) (??), compensation and costs. I am so scared.

I replied to FCC Prosecutions to explain what had happened. I stressed how remorseful I was and

• that what I did I did in the heat of the moment, at a stressful time for both me and my husband, when my only thoughts were getting home to collect my young sons;
  
• that the whole incident has left me distraught, ashamed and even more stressed;
  
• that I guaranteed it will never happen again;
  
• that they would receive my full co-operation;
  
• that I’ve never been in any trouble before and certainly never fare-dodged;
  
• that I’m a mum of two young kids trying to get back into teaching after starting a family and that a conviction would destroy any hope of me getting a teaching job.
  

I also offered to immediately pay the maximum penalty fare due and any reasonable amount deemed appropriate to cover the administrative costs incurred by FCC as a result of this incident.

I also explained that I was so stressed and panicked when confronted on the train and questioned under caution that I couldn’t clearly remember everything I said to the Inspectors and what I signed. I just wanted to get away from them and the humiliating situation I found myself in. With regard to the ‘receiving a ticket with intent’ allegation I think I told the Inspectors that my husband knew I had his ticket. He did know this in as much as he had handed me his ticket pouch which, of course, contained his Travelcard. I wrongly assumed that he wouldn’t mind me using it.

I am not a bad, dishonest person. I made a mistake and I feel that my life in about to be ruined. Both me and my husband have been in a living hell since the incident happened 2 weeks ago. We haven’t been able to sleep waiting for FCC to contact us and it has actually been making us ill.

Well, I’ve received a letter today from FCC. They acknowledge my remorse but they say that the prosecution will proceed and that next correspondence I’ll receive will be a court summons and that upon receipt I should either seek legal advice or write directly to the court.

Sorry for the long post but this is the biggest crisis I’ve ever faced in my life and I’m so scared. Can anyone give me any advice on what they would do in my position please?

• Is it still worth persisting asking FCC to settle out of court?
  
• If I get the summons I intend pleading guilty by post – I could not deal with going to court and I admit that didn’t have a valid ticket, had my husband’s Travelcard on me and used it. (Can anyone explain how pleading by post works?)
  
• What can be put forward as evidence as well as my husband’s ticket and the statement I signed? Records of any subsequent phone conversations with the FCC? My letter of explanation? I’m worried that contradicting what the statement I signed is going to really stitch me up.
  
• Is a guilty plea likely to be accepted for the ‘receive with intent’ charge if I told the FCC in my letter that my husband gave me his ticket pouch but didn’t tell me to use the ticket?
  
• If I plead guilty to the charge of ‘receiving a ticket with intent’ what will that mean for my husband? Could he be charged with an offence? That could have serious consequences for his job.
  
• How quickly is this likely to be dealt with by a court?
  
• If I face the two charges does that mean I could get two lots of fines?
  

From what I've seen of this site there are some really decent, helpful people out there. I'd be grateful for any steer you can give me and/or anything you can say that will in some way ease the stress I'm feeling at the moment.

Your questions are quite common but maybe you could wittle it down a bit to a few main points, to be honest, nearly every story from someone who has been caught fare evading has a similar 'sob' story, I'm not saying yours has no merit, but search around and you will see what I mean.

I'm not sure if travelling and using someone else's ticket is considered to be more serious than simply not buying a ticket. There are some experts on here who will hopefully pop along soon and help.

Personally if it was me I would of said I had no ticket, and point out the difficulty of buying one at the station, train guidelines do point out they there are time limits that customers should expect to wait to buy a ticket, these could be used in mitigating circumstances if you travel without buying one.

Andy

it will be viewed as deliberate fraud.

pleading letter to settle out of court is the only way

if you have done that, then all i can suggest is read a few threads in this forum, & wait for our resident experts RPI & oldcoja tp pop in.

dx

Hi there,

I work in the passenger transport industry although be it buses. Public transport ticket regulations are pretty much the same be it buses or trains. In the main, tickets are not transferable which is stated on 99% of tickets. Unfortunately, using someone elses travel card/pass is regarded as fraudulent under any circumstances and there is very little acceptable defence. As Andy has pointed out, your best option would of been to come clean at the very beginning, stating you neither had the time or opportunity to purchase a ticket on the station.

As Andy has also said; the revenue protection unit will have heard all manor of excuses and will probably give very little consideration to your story. (I am not for one minute disputing that what you are saying is true by the way). As for your husband, he would have to say you used it without his knowledge (which appears to be true) otherwise, he could have the travelcard withdrawn.

It looks like they will take you to court so all I can advise is that you state the circumstances as you have here and hope the mags will be sympathetic.

Come back when you receive the summons and we will try and advise you how to proceed in court.

Thanks for your replies so far. Really appreciate you taking the time to reply even if it sounds pretty grim for me.

My husband's Travelcard was confiscated from me so we're assuming that as it's evidence he won't be getting it back come what may. Of course, it's costing him loads of money to buy replacement weekly/monthly tickets, a sort of additional 'fine' - a point I did mention to the FCC.

Does anyone know if he'll be blacklisted from getting a ticket in future? Not sure if it makes any difference but he bought the ticket from a TOC other than FCC.

Also do you think if I plead guilty to 'receiving a ticket with intent' and told FCC in my response letter that he knew I had the ticket but not that I was going to use it (the truth even though I can't prove it), the plea would be accepted by court? If I plead guilty and don't say anything about my husband not knowing, I'm worried about the implications for him and his job. Isn't that 'admitting' aiding and abetting?

Thanks for your replies so far. Really appreciate you taking the time to reply even if it sounds pretty grim for me.

 

My husband's Travelcard was confiscated from me so we're assuming that as it's evidence he won't be getting it back come what may. Of course, it's costing him loads of money to buy replacement weekly/monthly tickets, a sort of additional 'fine' - a point I did mention to the FCC.

 

Does anyone know if he'll be blacklisted from getting a ticket in future? Not sure if it makes any difference but he bought the ticket from a TOC other than FCC.

 

Also do you think if I plead guilty to 'receiving a ticket with intent' and told FCC in my response letter that he knew I had the ticket but not that I was going to use it (the truth even though I can't prove it), the plea would be accepted by court? If I plead guilty and don't say anything about my husband not knowing, I'm worried about the implications for him and his job. Isn't that 'admitting' aiding and abetting?

Too late now I know, but thats why you should of said you had no ticket, now you are down one Travelcard !

I was prosecuted many years ago and I foolishly handed over my Oyster card, this had nothing to do with it, they were no doubt checking if there was any suspicious activity on it, but it was a right pain to get back again.

I eventually was found guilty and received a smallish fine of £115, I didnt please any mitigating circumstances but did point out I had spent many thousands of pounds on travelcards in the previous years.

I'm unaware of any travelcard blacklisting, in my last year of employment I decided to ditch it anyway and pay weekly, daily, it actually was cheaper and as I then lost my job it was a wise move (due to the travelcard having no refund value after 40 weeks).

Andy

Firstly, I'm not going to go through all the reasons why you have been so terribly foolish, you know that and don't need reminding again, but you do need to know what you can do from now on.

I will make clear that I am involved in prosecuting such matters daily and I do fully support the practice of pressing for the strongest penalties to deter deliberate fraud.

Very occasionally, I concede that there might be a case for looking again even when the evidence points strongly toward a deliberate act of fare evasion.

Now, let's see what if any help I can give to assist you in mitigating the effect of this incident.

Firstly, FCC have already advised you that they have considered your expression of remorse and still intend to prosecute. Of course they are at liberty to do so, BUT that does not mean that the possibility of avoiding a conviction has passed completely.

Let's deal with this little piece first so as to try to ease the fear a little:

The letter said they would always push for the maxim penalty and that this could be criminal record, fine of up to £1000, prison sentence, suspended sentence, community service, seizure of any computer equipment (if involved) (??), compensation and costs. I am so scared.

If you have been told that you are being prosecuted for a ticketing offence under the Byelaws there is NO possibility of a prison sentence nor community service sentence being imposed.

Such a sentence is only possible for cases of deliberate fare evasion and then the charge would have to be laid as a breach of The Regulation of Railways Act 1889, The Theft Act or other similarly serious legislations.

Railways Byelaws are a powerful piece of legislation in their own right, but the penalty for conviction will be a fine.

Given that FCC have made clear that the next thing you will receive will be a Summons, you should prepare your response to that and to the Court.

I have sent you a PM that includes a suggested letter, which you might like to send to FCC and to the Legal Advisor at the Court where your case is listed to be heard.

Don't give up on the possibility of avoiding prosecution and don't lose any sleep over threats of dire consequences that have no basis in fact.

Thanks Old-CodJA - I really appreciate and value your opinion. Did you send the PM? Can't see it's with me.

If I can't settle this before the hearing did you have any comments on where my husband stands if I plead guilty to 'receiving a ticket with intent'? Is he likely to face action? Would the fact that I wrote to FCC explaining that my husband knew I had the ticket but not that I was going to use it contradict any plea of guilt.

I'm worried that both of our future job prospects will be bleak.

P.S. On the phone and in the most recent FCC letter the 2 offences are said to be breaches of the 'national railway bye-laws.' Sorry I'm really ignoant about the way this works - if there are 2 offences could that mean 2 lots of fines??

Yes, you should have the PM by now

The position with your husband's season ticket is that; the ticket always remains the property of the rail company and any breach of the conditions of issue and use may result in the facility being withdrawn.

It is technically possible, though very unlikely, that the company could refuse a future issue, but would only be considered if your husband was also charged with transferring a ticket to aid an offender to avoid a fare.

Yes, two offences can mean two fines if convicted.

If you enter a guilty plea to the Summons and then say that your husband knew you had the ticket, but did not know you might use it and that you did not set out with any intention to offend,, then your plea may be considered to be equivocal.

Is it likely that my husband will be charged:

- given that whilst under caution and feeling intense pressure and humiliation I said he knew I was going to use it;

- if I plead guilty to the 'receive with intent to use' offence?

Any idea how quickly TOCs like FCC generally take to issues summons? Does it tend to be in days, weeks or months? Is it likely to be my local magistrates court (Croydon) or could it be anywhere in London?

Any views on getting legal advice. Today I was quoted a fixed fee of £500 + VAT by one for them to send a letter and negotiate to settle out of court. Sounded like the letter was going to rely on the disproportionate effect a conviction would have on my career prospects and the 'is it in the public interest to prosecute a first time offender?' arguments. I've already sent a letter putting these arguments forward but the solicitor said the Prosecutions Manager would listen to them more than me. Do you think this is true or would I just be throwing money away? they said they had around about a 50% success rate in getting prosecutions settled before court.

Any idea how quickly TOCs like FCC generally take to issues summons? Does it tend to be in days, weeks or months? Is it likely to be my local magistrates court (Croydon) or could it be anywhere in London?

 

Any views on getting legal advice. Today I was quoted a fixed fee of £500 + VAT by one for them to send a letter and negotiate to settle out of court. Sounded like the letter was going to rely on the disproportionate effect a conviction would have on my career prospects and the 'is it in the public interest to prosecute a first time offender?' arguments. I've already sent a letter putting these arguments forward but the solicitor said the Prosecutions Manager would listen to them more than me. Do you think this is true or would I just be throwing money away? they said they had around about a 50% success rate in getting prosecutions settled before court.

I have sent you a lengthy explanation by PM, but for general interest of other users, the rules concerning summary offences make clear that the charge must be laid within 6 months of the alleged offence being detected.

In practice that means the Summons has to be sent to the Court administration for authorisation within 6 months and bearing in mind the workload the average is probably around 10 - 16 weeks to a Court date.

As far as getting legal representation is concerned that really is the classic 'how long is a piece of string' question.

There is an old saying in legal circles that says 'A man who defends himself has a fool for a client'. Well that may be the case in very complex, serious criminal cases, but if you can articulate your case well and can be confident and assertive without being aggressive nor straying from the factual issues in hand, then most people will save themselves a great deal of money that they need not spend.

Once a Summons is issued, there is one area in which professional legal advice may be beneficial and that is in spotting procedural irregularities, but in my experience these are very much rarer than many untrained observers often believe. They do happen of course, but there is always ample time to examine all of the material in detail before the hearing date.

Don't get confused with a wrongly made out Penalty Fare Notice here. That's a civil remedy matter and should be sorted without any need for Court involvement. I'm talking about fare evasion cases that are reported for prosecution in this instance.

As a non-legally trained person, if you opt to plead not-guilty to any charge, you will be helped through the procedural aspects of defending yourself by the Court Legal Advisor.

I do not ever advise people categorically not to engage representation because is a matter for you, but I think it important to look at the whole picture. Paying a Solicitor £500 plus to negotiate does not guarantee a settlement out of Court, it might, but you've already been told that it's a 50/50 chance. Furthermore, if you then pay more for legal representation in Court you add to the bill with no guarantees of success either especially if the Solicitor is a poor performer in Court.

On the other hand, if he/she wins the case for you, then he may be able to get the Court to order the prosecution to pay your costs.

I must be brutally honest and say that from what you have posted so far, I think that is very unlikely.

If the case against you is strong and well put by the prosecutor, you will be convicted.

If you plead guilty at the earliest opportunity you will be given credit for that and any penalties imposed by the Magistrates will be reduced accordingly.

If you plead not-guilty, but are convicted, you will not get that credit.

However, NO-ONE SHOULD NEVER PLEAD GUILTY FOR EXPEDIENCY.

If you genuinely don't believe that you are guilty of an offence then say so.

If the train companies had a ticket machine that issued a ticket with just the time on it and that the ticket office is closed. Thats all that is needed. If a train is on it's way, it's so easy to think I'll pay at the other end, it's wrong but that does go threw the mind. There could be a big queue for numerous reasons. The ticket machine has broken down, the ticket office is closed. You are automatically guilty of travelling without a ticket.

The lady has already admitted that shes in the wrong, she is willing to pay a reasonable fine. By taking it to court, the train companies want a bit more plus. The other thing is that this lady hasn't been in trouble before - so thats a big plus for the lady.

When you write to the court make sure you mention that you've offered to pay a reasonable fine. That you have never ever been in trouble before. That the ticket office was closed. The ticket machine wasn't working. That you made a mistake, an error of judgement and thats easily done. And your not sure why the train company want to take it to court when you've agreed to pay the fine.

If the train companies had a ticket machine that issued a ticket with just the time on it and that the ticket office is closed. Thats all that is needed. If a train is on it's way, it's so easy to think I'll pay at the other end, it's wrong but that does go threw the mind. There could be a big queue for numerous reasons. The ticket machine has broken down, the ticket office is closed. You are automatically guilty of travelling without a ticket.

A permit to travel machine is what you are refering to, these should be turned on when there is no staff at the station.

There may be some mitigating circumstances for travelling without a ticket if you look under TOC guidelines that point out that there are limits of the time that a passenger should have to wait to buy a ticket depending on wether its peak or off peak, these are not legally binding though.

Andy

People shouldn't be scared to travel, if you lose your ticket, again your travelling without a ticket. Your in breach of the law as soon as you lose it. They will fine you straight away. Then you clearly have to prove otherwise.

Another port of call might be the Citizen Advice Bureau.

All of the most recent posts on this thread are completely irrelevant in this particular case.

I have already gone into this case with ABC1 in depth both through PMs and this forum.

There is never an excuse for using someone else's season ticket to avoid paying a fare. Please read the OP.

rebel11. The rail company isn't 'asking for more' simply by saying we wish to prosecute people who avoid paying their fare as defined by the law of the land. That law was written 120 years before FCC came into existence and has been continually updated to take account of the changing world in which we live. It is also worth remembering that it is the Courts that set 'fines', not the rail company. There is no fine to pay for 'fare-evasion' unless convicted of that offence and that is the Court's decision entirely.

Yes, in some cases the TOC may choose to agree an administrative penalty instead of prosecution, but they are never obliged to do so.

The writer started by saying that she knows that she committed an offence and compounded it by being untruthful when questioned.

She has asked for help in mitigating the effect of her actions and some contributors have attempted to be helpful in trying to assist her to avoid a prosecution, but if that isn't possible, to minimise the penalty.

The points raised by others have some merit in relating to entirely separate issues, but that is not the point of this thread and there becomes a danger of creating confusion.

How much does it cost for the train company to take the matter to court,

the person taken to court clearly has to pay that. Plus, it's good for the

rail companies stats. There are probably prosecution targets in place.

I'll leave it at that.

How much does it cost for the train company to take the matter to court,

the person taken to court clearly has to pay that. Plus, it's good for the

rail companies stats. There are probably prosecution targets in place.

 

I'll leave it at that.

Completely and utterly wrong.

The decision whether or not to proceed to prosecution is based on case merit.

You clearly do not understand the process. The person taken to Court never pays anything if they are not convicted!

In the 30 years that I have been involved I can categorically state that there are and have been NO prosecution targets that I have ever heard of

The cost of issuing a Summons is purely the cost of administration time, postage and sundries. There is no charge levied by the Court for authorising that Summons. The further costs are in the Prosecutor's time and dealing with any lengthy correspondence plus expenses in attending Court.

Across the board, less than 40% of these are ever recouped.

There is NO profit in taking cases to Court unnecessarily and the TOCs generally avoid it unless there is a strong case to consider the matter a serious offence.

Completely and utterly wrong.

 

The decision whether or not to proceed to prosecution is based on case merit.

 

You clearly do not understand the process. The person taken to Court never pays anything if they are not convicted!

 

In the 30 years that I have been involved I can categorically state that there are and have been NO prosecution targets that I have ever heard of

 

The cost of issuing a Summons is purely the cost of administration time, postage and sundries. There is no charge levied by the Court for authorising that Summons. The further costs are in the Prosecutor's time and dealing with any lengthy correspondence plus expenses in attending Court.

 

Across the board, less than 40% of these are ever recouped.

 

There is NO profit in taking cases to Court unnecessarily and the TOCs generally avoid it unless there is a strong case to consider the matter a serious offence.

Yep, the sort of reply I expected. Theres nothing completely or utterly wrong in what I've said. Defending your corner I have no problems with that.

Yep, the sort of reply I expected. Theres nothing completely or utterly wrong in what I've said. Defending your corner I have no problems with that.

It seems a pity that you couldn't 'leave it at that' as your earlier sign off had stated

Please substantiate for all to see on here your wild claims of 'prosecution targets' relating to 'rail companies stats' .

I came on here to try to help people understand the process better and to give suggestions as to how they might mitigate the effects of any report that they are subject too.

I try to do that by stating facts in relation to the legislation and sticking to them.

Obviously, those of us that actually work in the process have far less knowledge of this subject than you.

Please share your expert knowledge with these good people so that I can now save giving up any more of my time to do so

Thank you.

Good luck all

Theres a site called penaltyfareappeal.co.uk worth a read.

.co.uk/wordpress/?tag=penalty-fare"]Penalty Fare

Attempting to open this link failed. However, my system did give a clear warning about it's content

I am sure that we are all aware of some very old and discredited articles written on these subjects.

More importantly, by referring to Penalty Fares, this is clearly another example of a poster who does not know the difference between a 'Penalty Fare', which is a civil matter and 'Fare Evasion' which is not and may be alleged as a Summary offence put before a Magistrates Court.

No Penalty Fare Notice was issued to ABC1 and neither was there any obligation on the rail company to do so.

Please read fully:

The National Railways Byelaws (2005),

The National Conditions of Carriage (Railways),

Section 5 of The Regulation of Railways Act (1889)

The Conditions of issue & use of Rail Season Tickets.

I'll take no further part in this.