Hello, I recently had some trouble with Bailiffs and found CAG , I got that sorted out, more or less and discovered a whole world of other stuff I never knew about.

I wrote to RBS in my own way

July 17 2009

The Manager

Royal Bank Of Scotland

Re: Account Numbers 16-17-** 100**** and 100*****

Dear Sir/ Madam

Some time ago I wrote requesting my 6 years statements on account 100******

I received them and was charged £10.00.

I then wrote to yourselves to formally demand that the charges be refunded as I believed them to be penalties and therefore unlawful.

In light of the high court judgement regarding penalties I will rely upon the fact that the charges are unfair and therefore invalid under the Unfair Terms in Consumer Contracts Regulations

if the charges are not penalties as alleged, then they are unfair within the meaning of the Unfair Terms in the Consumer Contracts Regulations1999 and therefore fully recoverable as they are invalid

I have had no response from you regarding this matter.

I don’t care what the FSA has to say about it I want the money you stole from me .

If I were to go into one of your branches with a shotgun and demand money it would be a far more honest way of getting cash than the royal bank employs.

My request

I am writing to demand you to refund to me bank charges and related interest which you have levied from my accounts since I have had them. I am aware of the limitations act “The Limitation Act 1980 says that claims in contract which relate to breaches more than 6 years old are barred from recovery because too long a time has passed.”

However, s.32 (1) (b) of the Act says:-

(1) .... where in the case of any action for which a period of limitation is prescribed by this Act, either-

(a) the action is based upon the fraud of the defendant; or

(b) any fact relevant to the plaintiff's right of action has been deliberately concealed from him by the defendant; or

© the action is for relief from the consequences of a mistake;

the period of limitation shall not begin to run until the plaintiff has discovered the fraud, concealment or mistake (as the case may be) or could with reasonable diligence have discovered it....

The High Court has recently decided that your charges are subject to the Unfair Terms in Consumer Contracts Regulations 1999. I consider that the regime of bank charges you operate is unfair within the meaning of these Regulations as they are not individually negotiated, they operate in much the same way as charges operated by other High street banks and therefore there is little alternative to myself but to agree to the charges. Furthermore the charges are contrary to the requirement of good faith and fair dealing as they lack basic standards of commercial moral practice and take an unfair advantage of the weak bargaining power of the consumer. They impose a significant imbalance in the rights and obligations between the contracting parties which is to my detriment. I also consider that the charges may be unlawful at common law.

Your responsibilities

I would draw your attention to the terms of the contract which you agreed to at the time that I opened my account. It is an implied term of that contract that you would conduct yourselves lawfully and in a manner which complies with UK law. Furthermore you are bound by the Banking Code to treat your customers fairly and it is evident that you do not so.

I am frankly shocked that you have operated my account in this way as I had always reposed confidence in your integrity and expertise.

I consider that your repeated representations that your charges are fair and reasonable are deceptive and that they have deceived me into agreeing to pay them.

Your concealment of the true nature of your charges has prevented me from asserting my right until now.

I am fully aware of the waiver which you are presently relying upon and which was granted to you by the FSA. However, this is an internal industry matter and has nothing to do with me. It is one-sided and I note that you continue to levy charges and to enforce them despite the weight of judicial and popular opinion against you.

I will give you 14 days to reply to me accepting, unconditionally, my request in principle and letting me know a date by which I will receive payment.

If you dispute that I am entitled to a refund of these charges, then please let me know within the above timescale the basis upon which you dispute together with the reasons why you consider your charges to be fair.

If you do not respond, or you do not respond positively, within this time period, I shall send you a letter before action giving you a further 14 days in which to reflect. I believe that these targets are more than sufficient for a large company such as yours with dedicated staff and departments.

After that, there will be no further communication from me and I shall issue a claim at the expiry of the second deadline.

In considering this request for repayment, your attention is drawn to the Press Release issued by the FSA on 27th July, which states:

"Consumers who are in very difficult financial circumstances - 'hardship cases'

Banks and building societies will have to conduct a filtering process to ensure that cases of genuine hardship are still dealt with during the waiver period. Cases of hardship would still be entitled to be referred to, and dealt with by, the FOS."

I believe that my personal circumstances fall within this category because we live on benefits and struggle to pay bills and food expenses.

My wife is very poorly and the stress your organisation is causing and has caused is making her worse.

If you would like to see a complete financial statement I would be happy to comply.

I await your response within the above timescale

If as a manager you are unable to deal with this I request that this is immediately forwarded to your relevant department at your earliest convenience.

..... Today I recieved two letters replying (one for each account ) quoted in the letter. (tried to paraphrase)

... We acknowledge reciept.... We believe your complaint concerns the level, fairness or lawfulness of the charges.

Normal approach = internal process, however now involved with legal proceedings (oft)... then goes on about the FSA suspending normal timetable of dealing with charge complaints but agrees that they are obliged to review accounts if customers may be experiencing difficulty meeting financial commitments.

In order for us to understand and review the full extent of your financial position please complete, sign and return the attached "customer financial statement form" together with an explaination of the circumstances leading to your inability to meet your commitments.

QUESTION: what have the circumstances got to do with RBS. I can provide a full financial statement prepared by Christians against Poverty.... how much detail do I need to give them ? Can I just proceed with action against them as they have not satisfacorily replied to my demand for repayment of the monies stolen ?

What do I do now ?

The above template is for standard claims process(and to be honest is pretty shoddy if truth be known). You needed the financial hardship letter.

You need to include an income and expenditure form(with household income and expenditure), notices of priority debt arrears(mortgage/rent, council tax, utilities) and then send it to them.

You mean my use of the template is shoddy ? lol I dont claim to know what I am doing and like so many people I just play it as it comes.

My reply to them will consist of a detailed financial statement along with a letter stating that the details about the cause of my hardship are not the banks business excepting the fact that the charges applied on my accounts have added to and indeed compounded my difficulties.

I will have a look for the hardship letter though (if I can find it) this site is like a maze sometimes.

On of the best FH letters on CAG is this one by Hme.4x4

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/abbey-bank/206129-total-charges-repaid-under.html#post2301473

Their letter is spot on with regards to financial hardship.

I'm an ex RBS employee, you got charged because you didn't state you haven't "received" your past statements - ring them and request them over the phone stating you never received them, if they say they can't give you statements that far back - tell the *** on the phone to use back-office. Meerely stating that you'll shock them into not bull****ting you