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    • Thank you for that "read me", It's a lot to digest, lots of legal procedure. There was one thing that I was going to mention to you,  but in one of the conversations in that thread it was mentioned that there may be spies on the Forum,  this is something that I've read quite some time ago in a previous thread. What I had in mind was to wait for the thirty days after their reply to my CCA request and then send the unenforceable letter. I was hoping that an absence of signature could be the Silver Bullet but it seems that there are lot of layers to peel on this Onion.  
    • love the extra £1000 charge for confidentialy there BF   Also OP even if they don't offer OOC it doesn't mean your claim isn't good. I had 3 against EVRi that were heard over the last 3 weeks. They sent me emails asking me to discontinue as I wouldn't win. Went infront of a judge and won all 3.    Just remember the law is on your side. The judges will be aware of this.   Where you can its important to try to point out at the hearing the specific part of the contract they breached. I found this was very helpful and the Judge made reference to it when they gave their judgements and it seemed this was pretty important as once you have identified a specific breach the matter turns straight to liability. From there its a case of pointing out the unlawfullness of their insurance and then that should be it.
    • I know dx and thanks again for yours and others help. I was 99.999% certain last payment was over six years ago if not longer.  👍
    • Paragraph 23 – "standard industry practice" – put this in bold type. They are stupid to rely on this and we might as well carry on emphasising how stupid they are. I wonder why they could even have begun to think some kind of compelling argument – "the other boys do it so I do it as well…" Same with paragraph 26   Paragraph 45 – The Defendants have so far been unable to produce any judgements at any level which disagree with the three judgements…  …court, but I would respectfully request…   Just the few amendments above – and I think it's fine. I think you should stick to the format that you are using. This has been used lots of times and has even been applauded by judges for being meticulous and clear. You aren't a professional. Nobody is expecting professional standards and although it's important that you understand exactly what you are doing – you don't really want to come over to the judge that you have done this kind of thing before. As a litigant in person you get a certain licence/leeway from judges and that is helpful to you – especially if you are facing a professional advocate. The way this is laid out is far clearer than the mess that you will get from EVRi. Quite frankly they undermine their own credibility by trying to say that they should win simply because it is "standard industry practice". It wouldn't at all surprise me if EVRi make you a last moment offer of the entire value of your claim partly to avoid judgement and also partly to avoid the embarrassment of having this kind of rubbish exposed in court. If they do happen to do that, then you should make sure that they pay everything. If they suddenly make you an out-of-court offer and this means that they are worried that they are going to lose and so you must make sure that you get every penny – interest, costs – everything you claimed. Finally, if they do make you an out-of-court offer they will try to sign you up to a confidentiality agreement. The answer to that is absolutely – No. It's not part of the claim and if they want to settle then they settle the claim as it stands and don't try add anything on. If they want confidentiality then that will cost an extra £1000. If they don't like it then they can go do the other thing. Once you have made the amendments suggested above – it should be the final version. court,. I don't think we are going to make any more changes. Your next job good to make sure that you are completely familiar with it all. That you understand the arguments. Have you made a court familiarisation visit?
    • just type no need to keep hitting quote... as has already been said, they use their own criteria. if a person is not stated as linked to you on your file then no cant hurt you. not all creditors use every CRA provider, there are only 3 main credit file providers mind, the rest are just 3rd party data sharers. if you already have revolving credit on your file there is no need to apply for anything just 'because' you need to show you can handle money. if you have bank account(s) and a mortgage which you are servicing (paying) then nothing more can improve your score, despite what these 'scam' sites claiml  its all a CON!!  
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RBS/Carter claimform - Mint Card - CCA Is This Enforeable?


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Hi,

Ive CCA'd Mint for my card agreement and they have seemingly sent a good copy of a signed agreement.

They also attached a 3 pages of a photocopied set of Terms & Conditions.

Lots of very small print that will not scan & copy very well so have not included it here at the moment.

 

Could someone please have a look at the Credit agreement an tell me if you think that it is enforceable or what action to take next to try and verify it.

 

They sent current T&C's plus a Card re-issue letter with associated T&C's

Also current outstanding values owed to the account.

The signature, dates, my information and name all seem to be correct.

Have also attached the letter they sent with it.

 

Hope you can give me some good news.

Thanx

Murph

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Thanx Cerberus,

Appreciated the fast reply and clear help pointers.

I'll read through that and see where i go next.

O/S balance approx £10k

Will I need to CPS to get docs or SARN them?

Yours

Murph

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You could try them with this first;

 

Dear Sirs,

 

Account no xxxxxxxxxxxxxx

 

 

Re: my request under the Consumer Credit Act 1974

 

This account is in Dispute .

 

On xx/xx/2009 I wrote to xxxxxxxxx requesting that xxxxxxx supply me a true copy of the executed credit agreement for this account.

In response to this request I was supplied a mere application form which did not comply with the requirements of the Consumer Credit Act 1974.

 

The document sent purporting to be a credit agreement does not contain any of the prescribed terms as required by section 60(1) Consumer Credit Act 1974. The Consumer Credit (Agreements) Regulations 1983 (SI 1983/1553) made under the authority of the “1974 Act” sets out what the prescribed terms are, I refer you to Schedule 6 Column 2 of SI 1983/1553 for the definition of what is required. Suffice to say none of the terms are present in the document

 

Since this document does not contain the required prescribed terms it is rendered unenforceable by s127 (3) consumer Credit Act 1974, which states

 

127(3) The court shall not make an enforcement order under section 65(1) if section 61(1)(a)(signing of agreements) was not complied with unless a document (whether or not in the prescribed form and complying with regulations under section 60(1)) itself containing all the prescribed terms of the agreement was signed by the debtor or hirer (whether or not in the prescribed manner).

 

This situation is backed by case law from the Lords of Appeal in Ordinary (House of Lords) the highest court in the land. Your attention is drawn to the authority of the House of Lords in Wilson-v- FCT [2003] All ER (D) 187 (Jul) which confirms that where a document does not contain the required terms under the Consumer Credit Act 1974 the agreement cannot be enforced.

 

In addition should you continue to pursue me for this debt you will be in breach of the OFT guidelines, I draw your attention to the Office of Fair Trading’s guidance on debt collection

The OFT guidance which was issued July 2003 (updated December 2006) relating to debt collections and what the OFT considers unfair, I refer to page 5 of the guidance which states;

 

2.6 Examples of unfair practices are as follows:

 

h. Ignoring and/or disregarding claims that debts have been settled or are disputed and continuing to make unjustified demands for payment.

 

I require you to produce a compliant copy of my credit agreement to confirm I am liable to you or any organisation, which you represent for this alleged debt, if you cannot do so I require written clarification that this is the case. Should you ignore this request I will report you to the Office of Fair Trading to consider your suitability to hold a credit licence in addition to a complaint to Trading Standards, as you will be in breach of the Administration of Justice Act 1970 section 40

 

Since the agreement is unenforceable and the default notice is non compliant, it would be in everyone’s interest to consider the matter closed and for your client to write the debt off. I suggest you give serious consideration to this as any attempt of litigation will be vigorously defended and I will counter claim for all quantifiable damages

 

I respectfully request a response to this letter in 14 days

 

 

I trust this out lines the situation

Print name do not sign

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Hi Cerberus,

Thank you for pointing out the missing aspects that are required.

I wouldn't have known what I was looking for.

I've done a letter as suggested and will send it recorded delivery.

On the 19th june I received a letter advising of my account termination.

See copy of 2 pages here.

 

Do I need to respond to this and in what way please?

I much appreciate all this help as things were getting pretty bad all round.

Yours

Murph

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Hi Cerberus,

Yes, they sent me a default notice way back on the 20th May 2009, received 23/05/09, along with OFT Leaflet

 

They also sent a letter acknowledging my I & E financial statement separately on the same day.

 

Where does this leave me now?

Will the letter that I've just done based on your suggestion above create a delay or should I be looking at going down the CPR route?

Thanks for your help.

Yours

Murph

Edited by MurphyW
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The Default Notice is defective because they are required to stipulate a remedy date, it is not sufficient just to state that it has to be remedied within 17 days of the date of the notice. When they terminate the a/c they will only be able to claim the arrears, the remaining balance will in effect have to be written off.

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  • 4 months later...

Hi Cerberus,

Well it has been quite quiet for some time.

They did respond to my SA request with a load of papers and the same application form as in my previous post.

 

No proper CCA with all the prescribed terms and signatures.

They have now sent me this letter threatening further action to sell the debt.

What 's the next possible course of action considering they have issued a duff default notice and there would not appear to be a true CCA?

 

Any help would be appreciated.

I'm not in a position to pay these people anything at the moment. I had hoped to be able to have a new business into profit by now but still struggling.

Murphy

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________________________________________________________________

ALL unsolicited PMs and E-mails should be posted up - Not all on CAG are who they appear to be

 

 

My views are my own. If in doubt, seek professional advice. If I can help though, I will. CAG helped me!!

 

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Hi everyone,

They have finally passed the debt onto their lackeys at Triton (Owned by RBS) to collect some money. I don't think so!!

 

I don't have any! They do not have a valid CCA, did not issue the default notice correctly and have now terminated the account.

 

Should I write to Triton?

Which is the best letter to use.

Refer them back to Mint?

How should I proceed with Mint now?

Sorry to ask so many questions.

Yours Murphy

Edited by MurphyW
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Thanks for the fast reply Cerberus,

I take it that I amend that letter and address it to triton but referring to all details that have occurred with Mint rather than RBS who were the original lender.

How would I find out what date they entered a default notice on my credit file please?

Yours

Murphy

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Hi Guys,

Don't be too exasperated with me!!

Thanks for the heads up over my name.

I usually try to check but must have been in a bit of a hurry with that one.

Have changed the links IMG's. Thanks for the tip.

Murphy

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Hi Cerberus,

I signed up for the credit file check.

There is an initial one off registration fee to pay of £2.50 but this gives you access to the key relevant bits of the different accounts and their status.

You can get more information by paying a wee bit more of £4.97 per year if anyone wants to.

I suggest that these are both great value when viewed avgainst the competition "Check my file" etc.

Yours

Murphy

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Hi There,

I sent the letter but took out the references to the data protection bit as they have not got a default registered with the credit reference agencies.

The flag has been set to Green OK rather than D even after the 6 months of missed / reduced payments.

I'll keep that bit for later if the indicator is changed.

Yours

Murphy

Letter as here: -

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  • 3 weeks later...

Hi again,

They've now passed my letter 17 back to Mint who have acknowledge it by saying that they are looking into the matter!

 

It will be interesting to see what they have to say next.

Will keep you up to date as and when.

Murphy

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  • 1 month later...

Well they've taken a while to enjoy their xmas break and Triton have decide they need to try and move things along.

I've not had any response from the enquiries that Mint were going to make yet!

Triton think they can push with this letter: -

 

 

I think I'll write and refer them to Mint's response and my last letter and tell them to stop chasing me for payment.

Has anyone any other ideas how to treat this please?

Yours

Murph

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Empty threats M. Will do no harm to write and keep that paper trail going but no harm in ignoring it. Personally, i'd ignore it. It's empty :)

 

M

________________________________________________________________

ALL unsolicited PMs and E-mails should be posted up - Not all on CAG are who they appear to be

 

 

My views are my own. If in doubt, seek professional advice. If I can help though, I will. CAG helped me!!

 

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  • 3 months later...

Hi again,

Well time goes on and on 24th March 2010 Mint finally replied to my letter of contention basically refuting what i said and looks like challenging me to make the first move in a legal action on the second page ...

 

I decided to wait and see what they would do next.

No point in starting legal costs on my side.

Yours

Murph

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