Ok, after refelecting on some advice from upto the eyeballs, I agree it is going to be best if I add seperate threads for all my cca requests, so that I can post replies and images ect... I have sent 11 cca requests, so far only one returned and subsequently sent 11 non compliance letters. So here goes for the reply from RBS MINT.

Advice if they are correct in what they say??, and should I reply in any way??

I would have thought if they had it, they would have sent it within the 12 day period. Seems to me they are wanting the extra time to put one together with their new "art & crafts pack" they got for christmas

Thank you, Taz11

YAWN:lol::lol:

this is the same H E Bower that writes for Natwest tooo

he is talking utter rubbish, the Consumer Credit (Prescribed Periods for Giving Information) Regulations 1983 (SI 1983/1569) clearly state 12 WORKING DAYS FULL STOP.

thanks pt2537, so do I just sit tight, or advise them of their inaccuracy ?? I am initially thinking, give them enough rope....etc...

Could someone please clarify what is meant by the 12+2 day ruling??. Does it just mean the account is in dispute after this time, but they can still produce a cca in the forseeable future. Is there in fact a cut off time for the creditor to produce it?? I'm slightly confused with this law. They obviously think they have another month only, but from what I've been reading, they have as long as they like to produce it??, am I wrong ??

Thanks

Taz11 .........and have a great new years eve

The Consumer Credit Act specifically says 12 days before they slip into default of your request....12+2 working days is the 12 days plus 2 days grace for postage....there isn't a cut off time to produce it unfortunately it will just remain in default of the request you made while they haven't produced it.

thanks 42man for clarifying that. So in effect, as long as they don't produce it, the debt is "hanging" over you as such. At what point is it deemed to be "wiped" out. Can this only be done at court level, either by you or the creditor taking court action or is it down to the debitor to request the account to be returned to zero by the way of failing to produce the cca by the creditor.

What I'm trying to say is, is the debt ever "wiped" or does it just end in a stalemate situation, wheras you decline to pay anything, they decline to send a valid cca, but the debt is still there. Can it ever be GONE as such ??

thanks

Taz11

I have CCA'd some DCA's and NEVER heard back ever, and after 6 years, then obviously it becomes statute barred...!! some will try and enforce without the CCA issue, but as long as you know your stuff and are prepared for a possible court date...well..

thanks 42man, most of mine are well over 10-12 years old, so I think as Rory said in one of my threads, they are all likely to be unenforceable. I'm happy for a fight, I just wish I had found this site and all the information on here so much earlier...........but you gotta start somewhere. I'll just have to wait and see what drops through my letterbox, as with all the information and support on here, I feel I can now challenge most things as long as I have the ammunition.

Anything that isn't an enforceable cca will sit in a folder or be ignored, especially threat-o-grams.

thanks 42man and happy new year

Hi Taz, I have a letter almost word perfect to yours only dated 1 week earlier. On my one they have put "We dont consider any account to be in dispute, or void and your indebtedness on the account remains due and payable. Non payment of the account will result in a default being registered against you."

I noticed that your letter is dated the 27th December 2008, mine is dated the 20th December 2008.

Do you think that is a threat that cannot be carried out and is a bulling tatic which they have realised they had better remove?

I am going to create a thread and it will be called dtjim v mint rbs, would like to have you on board and we can compare notes.

Hi dtjim,

thanks, yeah I'll keep it up to date as and when I get anything from them and view your thread when you start it. We should both be at the same point roughly. I have begun to understand from well advised people on here, that they can do bugger all, until they produce the valid cca, (unless its barclaycard, see my other thread...lol) I've now stopped payments, and they can chase as much as they like until they produce that cca.

cheers

Taz11

ok, so far with this one, sent cca, got nothing, sent "account in dispute", got snotty letter saying they have 30 more days (which I find quite amusing as this has now passed and the 30 day thing isn't even valid anymore..lol) etc... (see above) and now I get this. I'm assuming its not a Default Notice, just the fact that they like to use the word "NOTICE".............and still no cca !!!

Should I just ignore again?

thanks

Taz11

rbs mint.pdf

Taz, panic not. New legislation that came in last year means this type of letter HAS to be sent out every 6 months on defaulting accounts. It is a legal requirement.

OH had one on his loan account. Several other CAGers have started to receive them as well.

You dont have to do anything with this particular notice

thank you cb, its little snippets like this that newbies like myself are not aware of

I am pleased I am able to help.

If you still get regular monthly statements from creditors, you might find some of them put the information on those. I think Lloyds do that.

Well, after RBS Mint advising me that they will forward the information I asked for , here it is,

a covering letter as such;

then, two pages stapled together (1 sided only) with I suspect current T&c's stating on the secong page that the principal account holder is: name and address overleaf (nothing on reverse!!!)

Then a third set of paperwork, stapled in the order I have shown, which I can only describe as historic, one sided, with "agreement betwen us and you, the principal account holder".

They have sent one statement from JANUARY 2009.

There are no dates on any of the terms, no sigs, nothing. I suspect again this is unenforceable, but again your opinions and advice welcomed.

Thanks

Taz11

Covering Letter.pdf

current t&c's.pdf

current t&c's page 2.pdf

historic t&c's page 1.pdf

historic t&c's page 2.pdf

third page here

historic t&c's page 3.pdf

Exactly the same response I received from Mint.

As your account is 10 or 12 years old, was it originally an RBS Advanta card? I'm beginning to wonder if they are deliberately not sending out the old agreements because they know a) they are faulty (no prescribed terms) or b) the old agreements won't cover the new card??? Of course it could be c) they're just too lazy to go and look for it;)

I did read on another thread that the debtor was offered an upgrade on their card to a platinum account, and the cred enclosed an agreement for them to sign to access the new card account. This was around 2005, when most creds finally started to get clued up on the CCA - maybe I'm mistaken, but I would interpret this to mean that creds have to issue a new agreement for a different type of card.

Best of luck to you:)

Thanks Underdog, yes indeed it was an RBS Advanta. How are you progressing with yours?? with Mint/RBS I mean. Will be intersting to see what stages we both get to??.

regards

Taz11

My account has been terminated and passed to Triton (RBS inhouse DCAs); they have said they will keep the account at Triton or sell on to another DCA - maybe they are trying to get rid of it as they know it is unenforceable??? There was no mention of court action.....

lol...good old Triton (see my Taz11 v Natwest/Triton). They bullied me into paying them, as I knew no different until I joined CAG. I sent them a cca request, they sent it to Newmans, I sent the same to Newmans, Newmans sent it back to Natwest. Natwest sent me a letter saying the debt was unenforceable, but would I keep paying (yh course ). If this RBS Mint goes the same way, I'll be quite happy , but I won't count my chickens yet.

I'm not sure wether to reply, or just sit tight and let them try to assign it to someone else, then hit them with another dispute letter??

thanks

Taz11

Thanks Taz - I'll have a read through of your other thread:)

lol...good old Triton (see my Taz11 v Natwest/Triton). They bullied me into paying them, as I knew no different until I joined CAG. I sent them a cca request, they sent it to Newmans, I sent the same to Newmans, Newmans sent it back to Natwest. Natwest sent me a letter saying the debt was unenforceable, but would I keep paying (yh course ). If this RBS Mint goes the same way, I'll be quite happy , but I won't count my chickens yet.

 

I'm not sure wether to reply, or just sit tight and let them try to assign it to someone else, then hit them with another dispute letter??

 

 

thanks

Taz11

I would sit tight, Taz. Let them make the first move

Hi CB,

lol.... just a little too late , four cc's got another in dispute letter all for different reasons, but basically for covering letters and T&C's which a) do not conform to an agreement in any way, and b) t&c's cannot be shown to be relevant to the "agreement" in question. I await their reply...lol, as i'm sure they'll have some answers. No post this morning, quite dissappointed

thanks

Taz11

Ok, having sent MINT a letter stating that a covering letter does not constitute an agreement I've received this (see attached). It basically says they have complied with my request. I fail to see how they have as they haven't even enclosed an application form (see previous attachments) let alone an agreement.

What would your course of action be now. I'm getting fed up with this to and fro of letters which result in nothing. Would you request a SAR or CPR request. I want to put them on the back foot, so that they are aware that in order to enforce the agreement they must have an original and I must be shown to me in order to evaluate whether it is executed correctly and enforceable. I pretty much have in my head the type of covering letter I will send them, but not sure if I should go SAR route or CPR.??

Thanks for any information/advice

Taz11