Over 2 months ago i tried to claim all the charges that Monument had levied on my account, Stupidly i accepted a part payment from them as a full and final settlement, which i now regret as i should have gone for the lot.

I then set up a payment plan for several months and Monument agreed to freeze interest and and charges on the account. The agreed term has now run out on the payment plan. I have wrote to Monument to try and set up another Payment plan, unfortunately to date they have not responded.

I am now being bombarded by an American call centre 2 to 3 times a day. They ask me to confirm my name and then become rude, aggresive and arrogant. Apart from confirming my name no other security checks are done to confirm my identity.

I have now asked them not to telephone me and that i will only deal with this matter in writing. They reply "We will phone you when we want to" I then asked them are they are aware of the English law of telephone harrasement. they replied "Are you aware of the American law" At this point i bit my tounge and simply hung up.........

I am looking for a bit of help on what options i have.......

> Even though i accepted a Full anf Final part settlement am i able to

start a fresh claim for unfair charges???

> Do i send them another telephone harrasement letter???

> Do i complain to a regulatory body if so whom???

>Monument are now owned by Raphaels Bank, does any one have any

addresses for Monument???

Many Thanks in advance for your help

let them ring,and just set the phone down and go about your business......rile them as much as they rile you......

then fire of a letter about telephone harrassment

also,why not tell them you are recording their calls??

Monuments address is;

Monument Credit Services

PO Box 6476

Northhampton

NN4 1ZN

I too have a reduced payment plan with monument, which they set up in June last year. They did not stipulate a time period on it and have never heard from them since they aggreed to it.

Maybe I have your experiences to come shortly

Even though Monument is now owned by Raphaels Bank is it the same address???

Monument Credit Services

PO Box 6476

Northhampton

NN4 1ZN

Sent off my £1 postal order to Monument for a copy of the CCA and received the following reply>>>>

"The agreement we have enclosed in this letter is a copy of your credit agreement which we are providing to you in accordance with our obligations under the requirements of section 78(1) of the Consumer Credit Act 1974 (as ammended) (the CCA). Section 78(1) requires that we provide you with a copy of your executed agreement within 12 days of receiving your request for such a copy and upon the payment of £1.00"

"It is perhaps worth us explaining a little about the "copy of the executed agreement" section 78(1) requires us to provide to you. "Copy" for the purpose of the CCA does not refer to an exact copy of the agreement you signed. We are therefore not required by the CCA to provide you with a photocopy of the agreement showing your signature. Section 78 requires us to provide you with a copy of the agreement that looks like the one you signed but which has been updated to contain the terms and conditions which currently apply to your agreement (rather than those which applied at the time you signed the agreement) Importantly, the copy is not required to include your name or signature".

"We hope that you are now satisfied with the documentation we have provided and that you will now recommence payments on your account"

Yours Sincerely

Naomi Wort.

All that monument have sent along with the letter is Monument Visa Conditions and a copy of the Monument Conditions. Can anyone comment on the above reply from Monument and advise me on how i should reply to Monument?????

I have attatched what they have sent me.

Monument Visa Conditions0001.pdf

Monument 20001.pdf

Mon30001.pdf

I am no expert but I think what they have sent is a load of tosh. Can't see what the first attached file is as it will not open but the other two are just terms and conditions, which may or may not be the ones that were current when you opening the account.

I don't think there is any way they could enforce this debt with what they have sent.

Someone more in the know will be along shortly I expect

Many thanks for your reply

alfwithhair

Please can someone advise on how i should reply to Monument??

tell them if what they think they have sent you constitutes a credit agreement,they have another think coming.....

and as Monument are part of Barclaycard,get in touch with Northampton TS and tell them what is going on....as a lot of others have done it would seem!!

As far as im aware Monument are now part of Raphaels Bank and not Barclays hence the annoying and clueless American call centre.

I also asked for a statement with all transactions that they alledge i owe. They told me that they do this every month. They can't get into there head that that is a monthly statement that just shows the alledged balance and does not list any transactions.

Are they really this stupid or are they pulling the wool over my eyes?

HI,

Monument (or rather part of Monument) was sold by Barclays in April last year to an American company called CompuCredit Corporation. Their UK arm is CompuCredit UK Ltd.

I would suggest writing to these people.

Also, some other things to consider are if the t&cs actually allow them to send your data outside of the EC or not. If not then they have messed up big time by sending your data to the States. However (I did used to work for Barclaycard) it is likely that the t&cs would allow them to do this.

Secondly, debts are sold (or assigned) under the Law of Property Act 1925 and this states that you have to be given notice and that this notice has to be left at your property personally or sent by recorded delivery. Otherwise it is not effective.

If it is not effective then Compucredit do not actually own the debt (even though they think that they do). However it might be wise not to remind them of this fact until / unless they take you to court and then use it as part of your defence.

Had a quick look at the T&C and it states the following>>>>>

Monument is a trading name of Raphaels Bank PLC, can you tell me what the connection is to CompuCredit UK ???

It also states that "We will store and process information on the Raphaels Bank Computer" so does that allow them to store my information outside the EC???

It may also be worth mentioning to them that they are responsible, under the OFT Guidance, for the actions of any debt collector they use. Also, any business carrying out debt collection in the UK requires a consumer credit licence - unlicenced activity is a criminal offence.

Had a quick look at the T&C and it states the following>>>>>

 

Monument is a trading name of Raphaels Bank PLC, can you tell me what the connection is to CompuCredit UK ???

 

It also states that "We will store and process information on the Raphaels Bank Computer" so does that allow them to store my information outside the EC???

Hi,

I've had a look at the t&cs that you posted and I can't see any mention of Raphael anywhere. Could you post the document you have that mentions Raphael?

Barclays made a press statement at the time that it was selling to Compucredit. However, if you google this you'll find that at the same date there was also a sale from Raphael to Compucredit of the right to receive the receivables (ie your payments). So, it may be that teh deal was set up in some strange way to sell it to Raphael and then to sell it on to Compucredit.

Raphael Bank are part of a private group that also owns Southern Finance and a big currency exchange operation. So, given that it's a private company there's no indication who owns them.

Who you need to contact depends on who is writing to you, but if you just look on google you will find that "Raphael Bank" (without the plc - there is no company called Raphael Bank plc) is a trading name of:-

R. RAPHAEL & SONS PLC

ALBANY COURT YARD

47-48 PICCADILLY

LONDON

W1J 0LR

Company No. 01288938

This is the document that mentions Raphaels Bank

Mon30001.pdf

That makes more sense now - you posted the wrong document earlier - you just posted two copies of the same side. I'll have alook at it now

Just to throw another spanner in the works !!!!!! I have just checked my credit report and it states the Lenders name as Raphaels Bank.

It also marks the account as delinquent, and the delinquent date is 30th December 1899

No defaults have been registered

They are a strange bunch Monument.

I have an credit card account with them, which at the time of issue was part of Barclays group, Plus 2 Barclaycard accounts.

When I could not afford the repayments in March last year I contacted Monument with a token payment offer and they accepted immediately and seemed quite happy to have their £1.50 a month and even suspended all interest and charges, I have never heard anything from them since March last year.

Barclays on the other hand are complete A Holes, would accept nothing I offered, banged on the interest and charges, then famed it out to the various DCA's, could supply no proper CCA, just application froms and are still adament that the application form is the executed agreement.

So it would appear that Monument are bangin the same drum here. Write to them as advised and inform them of their misgivings.

My credit file also had a entry as Raphaels Bank, same as you delinquent 30th Dec 1899. No default issue on my account either

Ok, you need to write to Monument at either of the addresses that they gave you. You can either write to the PO Box 504 address that they give for complaints in the About Us section in the top right hand corner or you can write to the registered office of the company which is given in the paragraph below. All ltd companies have to give a registered office so that legal or other documents have a definite place that they can be served.

Looking at the bottom of the How we use your information box it clearly has a bit about what will happen if they transfer your data overseas so that is ok.

You mentioned about requesting your statements in an earlier post. You need to do this with an sar otherwise they are quite within their rights to tell you to get lost.

With the Full and Final settlement of charges earlier, if you signed anything to agree that it was full and final then there is nothing you can do about it. However, if they’ve put any more charges on since then you can still claim those back.

With the telephone harassment it might be worthwhile seeing if you can get the name of the company that are phoning you up to find out who it is. On a more practical note if you dial 1471 after the call and it comes up with a telephone number then you can use BT’s call barring service to bar all calls from that number – there’s also one for withheld numbers. But I’m not too sure if it works with overseas numbers – you’ll need to ask them.

nicklea, many thanks for your help. but have Monument satisfied my request for an executed CCA?? Is what they have sent me merely just terms & conditions?? This is what they have written in their reply>>

"The agreement we have enclosed in this letter is a copy of your credit agreement which we are providing to you in accordance with our obligations under the requirements of section 78(1) of the Consumer Credit Act 1974 (as ammended) (the CCA). Section 78(1) requires that we provide you with a copy of your executed agreement within 12 days of receiving your request for such a copy and upon the payment of £1.00"

"It is perhaps worth us explaining a little about the "copy of the executed agreement" section 78(1) requires us to provide to you. "Copy" for the purpose of the CCA does not refer to an exact copy of the agreement you signed. We are therefore not required by the CCA to provide you with a photocopy of the agreement showing your signature. Section 78 requires us to provide you with a copy of the agreement that looks like the one you signed but which has been updated to contain the terms and conditions which currently apply to your agreement (rather than those which applied at the time you signed the agreement) Importantly, the copy is not required to include your name or signature".

"We hope that you are now satisfied with the documentation we have provided and that you will now recommence payments on your account"

Yours Sincerely

Naomi Wort.

Im planning on sending the following reply in reference to their reply to my request for a CCA. Please can anyone have a look and advise??

DearMonument,

Before I continue I wish to establish that I am not seeking to avoid responsibility for any alleged debt or breach of any alleged agreement that I may have or have had.

Thank you for your recent letter sent to me dated April 8th 2008, the contents of which are noted. However, the reply received by me does not fulfill your requirements under the Consumer Credit Act 1974.

The Act demands that I am supplied with a true copy of any properly executed credit agreement that exists in relation to the above account. I may ask for this on demand providing that a fee of £1.00 is paid. This fee was sent with my original letter, dated 26th March 2008. I also asked for a full statement of my account

Upon receipt of the original request the specified account legally entered into disputed status.

You had until 9th April 2008 to provide me with the true executed copy I requested. You have now entered into default of my request. If the request is not satisfied after a further 30 days then you commit an offence.

Accordingly, it is my consideration that you have been unable to supply an agreement because no such agreement exists.

Your non-compliance with my request means that your company has committed an offence under Section 77 (4) of the Consumer Credit Act 1974, summarily punishable by a Level 4 fine on the standard scale.

Any court action you may take will be vigorously defended using Sections 61 and 127 of the CCA 1974, which will preclude a judge from making an enforcement order in this instance.

Should you nevertheless choose to initiate legal proceedings against me, I will expect to receive, with any Letter before Action, a copy of the document that you will be relying on as proof that a properly executed agreement, complying in all respects with the form and content requirements of the CCA was signed by myself in respect of this alleged debt

I hope that you will enter into a sincere dialogue with me about this matter and I am writing this letter to you on the assumption that you would prefer to do this than merely respond with standard letters and leaflets.

I look forward to hearing from you in writing.

Hi drob,

What you have been sent seems to be fine for the s78 request. You've got a document with all the prescribed terms on it - they don't have to show your signature or anything. Looking at the last page there is a reference 09/06 which would imply that this dates from Sept 2006. Was your account opened round about then or was it opened earlier? If it was opened earlier then they also need to send you the original t&cs as well in order to comply.

A s78 request is totally different from what they will have to supply if it goes to court - in that case they do have to supply you with everything. But for a s78 request, with the proviso of what I've said about it does appear that they have complied with your request.

I also note that there is no number 13 in the t&cs - very strange - is there a page missing or is this one of those American things of not using the number 13?

Also, and this is really strange, there is no mention of any charges anywhere in the document. So, in terms of this contract they cannot apply ANY charges to your account other than interest.

Just a thought about the opening para in bold of your letter, I don't think that is necessary

The account with monument was opened in February 2004. So am i correct in saying that unless they send me the old t&c they have not complied with my request for an executed CCA?

that is my understanding - yes

However, you don't need to go writing them letters, I personally don't believe it achieves much. Also, don't get too hung up on the whole s78 thing. For example, Morgan Stanley sent me this sort of rubbish when I did a s78 request and then, when it came to court they provided the actual agreement itself.

The best way to get information from a company - including the actual agreement itself - is to do an sar.

I am dissapointed that if you pay £1 you should receive a "true and executed" copy of your CCA and not terms and conditions. So without sensing off a Subject Access Request it is just guess work, do they or don't they have a "true and executed" copy.

I have previously requested a S.A.R from a previous dispute from Monument but have recently shredded the information and to be honest i do not remember seeing a true and executed copy of a credit agreement.