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    • I have had a secondary thought.  I borrowed £s from a completely separate entity 6y ago. It was personal and unsecured. I was going to repay upon sale of the property. But then repo and I couldn't.  Eventually they applied and got a charging order on the property.  Their lawyers wrote that if I didn't repay they may apply for an order for sale.  I'm not in control of the sale.  The lender won't agree to an order for sale.  The judge won't expedite it/ extract from trial.  Someone here on cag may or may not suggest I can apply for an order v the receiver?  But could I alternatively ask this separate entity with a c.o to carry out their threat and actually make an application to court for an order for sale v the receiver instead?
    • You left the PCN number showing, but no worries, I've redacted it. Euro Car parks are very well known to us.  I've just skimmed through the titles of the latest 100 cases we have with them (I gave up after 100) and, despite all their bluster and threats, in not one have they taken the Cagger to court. You stayed there for 2 hours &:45 minutes.  I'm guessing the limit is 2 hours and 30 minutes, right?  
    • If the claimant fails to draft directions the court can order a Case Management Hearing to set them but normally in Fast Track claims the claimant sets the directions...Unlike small claims track which are always set the court.
    • Not Evris offer, the court offers mediation service.   All claims proceed to hearing if mediation fails /not happen.   Why do you not wish to attend in person to stand your claim ?     Absolutely you must comply with the courts directions or your claim risks being struck out. Preparation for a hearing should happen irrespective of mediation.   https://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/topic/460613-suing-a-parcel-delivery-company-when-you-dont-have-a-direct-contract-with-them-–-third-party-rights-copy-of-judgment-available/#comment-5255007   Andy  
    • LPA.  (I'm fighting insolvency due to all the stuff that he and lender have done).  He appointed estate agents - (changed several times). Disclosure shows he was originally appointed for a specific reason (3m after repo) : using his powers as acting for leaseholder to serve notice on freeholders (to grab fh).  There was interest from 3 potential buyers. He chose one whose offer depended on a positive result of the notice.  Disc also shows he'd taken counsel advice - which was 'he'd fail'.  He'd simultaneously asked to resign as his job (of serving notice) was done and he'd found a buyer.  Lender asked him to stay on to assign notice to the buyer.  Notice failed, buyer didn't buy.  So receiver stayed.  There was 1 buyer who wanted to proceed w/o fh but receiver/ lender wasted 1y trying to get rid of them!  Disc shows why. But I didn't know why at the time. In later months Lender voiced getting rid of receiver. Various reasons - including cost.  But there's a contradiction/ irony: as I've seen an email (of 4y ago) which shows the receiver telling lender not to incur significant costs and to minimize receiver costs.    Yet lender then asked him to serve another notice - again counsel advice indicated 'he'd fail'.  And he did fail.  But wasted 3y trying and incurred huge legal costs - lender trying to pass on to me. Lender interfered - said wanted to do works.  Receiver should have said no.  But disc. shows he agreed to step aside to let them do the works - on proviso lender would discuss potential costs first (they didn't), works wouldn't take long (took 15m), and lender would hold interest (they didn't) (this last point is crucial for me now - as I need to know if I can argue that all interest beyond this point shouldnt be allowed?)   I need to check receiver witness statement in litigation with freeholders to see exactly what he said about 'his position'. But I remember it being along the lines of - 'if the works increased the value of the property he didn't have a problem'.  Lender/ receiver real problems started at this point. The cost of works and 4y passage of time has meant there is no real increase in value. Lender (or receiver) didn't get any permissions (statutory or fh) (and didn't tell me) and just bulldozed the property to an empty shell.  The freeholders served notice on me as leaseholder for breach of covenants (strict no alterations).  The Lender stepped in (acting for me) to issue notice for relief of forfeiture - not the receiver.  That wasted 2y of litigation (3y if inc the works) and incurred huge costs (both sides).  Lender's aim was to do the works that every potential buyer balked at due to the lease restrictions.  Lender and receiver knew couldn't do works w/o fh permission. Lender did them anyway; receiver allowed.  Receiver remained appointed.  I'm arguing lender interfered in receiver duties.  Receiver should have just sold property 4-5y ago w/o allowing any works.  Almost 3y since works finished the property remains unsold (>5y from repo). The property looks brand new - but it was great before.  The lender spent a ton of money - hoping that would facilitate a quick sale.  But the money they spent and the years they have wasted has meant they had to increase sale price.  It's now completely overpriced.  And - of course - the same issues that put buyers off (before works) still exist.   The receiver has tried for 2y to assert the works increased value. But he is relying on agents estimates - which have proved highly speculative. (Usual trick of an agent to give a high value to get the business - and then tell seller to reduce when no-one buys.). And of course lender continues to accrue interest (despite 4y ago receiver saying pause interest). Lender tried to persuade receiver to use specific agent. Disc shows this agent was best friends with the lender's main investor in the property.  Before works this agent had valued it low.  After works this agent suggested a value 70% higher!  The lender persuaded receiver to sack one agent and instead use this agent.  No offers. (Price way too high).   Research has uncovered that this main investor has since died.  I guess his investment is part of probate? And his family want it back?    Disc shows the sacked agent had actually received a high offer 1y ago.  Receiver rejected it.  (thus I don't know if the buyer would have ever proceeded). He was relying on the high speculative valuation the agents had given him to pitch for the business. The agents were in a catch-22.  The receiver sacked them. Disc shows there has been 0 interest ever since (inc via new agent requested by lender). I don't think lender or receiver want all this to come out in public domain via a trial.  It will ruin their reputations. If I can't get an order for sale with lender - can I apply separately against receiver?
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      The judge's reasoning is very useful and will certainly be helpful in any other cases relating to third-party rights where the customer has contracted with the courier company by using a broker.
      This is generally speaking the problem with using PackLink who are domiciled in Spain and very conveniently out of reach of the British justice system.

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CAG CRA S.A.R Club


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If I wanted to S.A.R - (Subject Access Request) a Credit Reference Agency - Experian is the one I have in mind right now, as "SCOR – Access to full data is now available to all DBSG Members. Get maximum benefit." - will be a Focus Session led by the Director of Regulatory Affairs, Experian, at a beanfeast for Debt Collectors everywhere in September... And Experian - aka 'CreditExpert' is advertising everywhere with it's one month 'free trial' credit report for Consumers all over the World Wide Web it seems...

So, if I wanted to get all of the information they hold about me, including who they have divulged ('shared') this information with, and why - as I think is my right, how would I word the request, anyone?

I'm thinking it will cost me £10.00.

I'm thinking it would be worth it.

Debt collectors appear to have more access to data about me than I do.

After that it'll be Experian and CallCredit. But Experian seems the most timely right now.

Any help with the wording would be much appreciated! :)

We will not be intimidated.

'The pen is mightier than the sword'.

Petition to Outlaw Debt Sale and Purchase

- can't read/post much as eye strain's v.bad.

VIVA CAG!!! :)

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There have been a couple of other CAGers that have S.A.R - (Subject Access Request)'d the CRA's and received a shed load of paperwork.

It's on my list for the next project once I have everything under control ;)

Sosumi, I'll happily move up my plans if you want some support.

We can both attack this.

Be VERY careful whose advice you listen too

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There have been a couple of other CAGers that have S.A.R - (Subject Access Request)'d the CRA's and received a shed load of paperwork.

It's on my list for the next project once I have everything under control ;)

Sosumi, I'll happily move up my plans if you want some support.

We can both attack this.

Do you know the thread CB coz this is also gunna be one of my missions. Would be interesting to see what someone else has said about it :-|

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CB, I'd really appreciate it. :) It disgusts me that DCAs should have greater rights than I do over my personal information. And that anyone who answers an advert for a free credit check, is then at risk of having their personal data exposed to the nastiest groups of people I've ever encountered!

It's a Catch-22. You're struggling with your finances, worried about your credit rating, there's a company offering a free credit report, you take up the offer and... just like that, Grubb and Co. can have a good look through your credit file, see what might be worth chasing up! Stands to reason that anyone struggling with money will take up a free offer, equally likely that they'll fall behind in payments, and... bye bye data protection!

It really would be worth a tenner! You know the Law CB, it'd really help! :D

We will not be intimidated.

'The pen is mightier than the sword'.

Petition to Outlaw Debt Sale and Purchase

- can't read/post much as eye strain's v.bad.

VIVA CAG!!! :)

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CB, I'd really appreciate it. :) It disgusts me that DCAs should have greater rights than I do over my personal information. And that anyone who answers an advert for a free credit check, is then at risk of having their personal data exposed to the nastiest groups of people I've ever encountered!

It's a Catch-22. You're struggling with your finances, worried about your credit rating, there's a company offering a free credit report, you take up the offer and... just like that, Grubb and Co. can have a good look through your credit file, see what might be worth chasing up! Stands to reason that anyone struggling with money will take up a free offer, equally likely that they'll fall behind in payments, and... bye bye data protection!

It really would be worth a tenner! You know the Law CB, it'd really help! :D

I SECOND THAT :mad:

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renegotiation, that's not really a worry as we have the tools and knowledge to deal with that eventuality ;)

 

This has already happened to Dobby, when they requested the simple report anyway.

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Be VERY careful whose advice you listen too

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So in a sense if you haven't accessed your credit report for a long itme you would be better off just getting a simple credit report and then SARing the CRA a month later or something. That is if you wanted to know what they are doing with your data in relation to DCA's I mean.

What sort of world do you want your kids to grow up in?

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Be VERY careful whose advice you listen too

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Thanks CB - DebtMountain's thread looks good to me :)

Jotty's post (8) where Experian states, in reply to a request to have info. removed:

"Experian do not hold copies of the contracts you have signed, which will include your permission to share this information with credit reference agencies. In order to obtain a copy of this information and any further details of an account you will need to contact the companies directly at the addresses provided on your credit report."

 

"We do not hold copies of the information for similar reasons to why we cannot check the uthentisity of each search recorded on your credit report, the strict terms and conditions that we have in place are considered to be sufficient for us to ensure that the companies using our services are only recording legitimate information."

Hmm.

Again, to quote the subject of one themed event in the forthcoming..

Debt Collection, Debt Sale & Purchase Conference 2007

Setting the Standards..

Annual Conference & Exhibition 2007

OPEN TO BOTH MEMBERS AND NON-MEMBERS OF THE ASSOCIATION

'The Definitive Conference for Anyone Involved in the Credit Collection and Debt Sale and Purchase Industry"..

.. Day Two, Focus Sessions, Theme 1:

11.15 am:

..."SCOR – Access to full data is now available to all DBSG Members. Get maximum benefit."

Hmm.

 

Wouldn't I be right in thinking that CreditExpert (Experian) is projecting itself as a service for the consumer?

And yet, here's their Director for Regulatory Affairs, hosting a Focus Session on the fact that members of the Debt Buyers and Sellers Group (which, as we know, has some distinctly dodgy 'members') can now have full access to data as defined here:

Steering Committee on Reciprocity (SCOR)

I quote:

The UK finance industry established the Steering Committee on Reciprocity (SCOR) to develop and oversee documented guidelines on the use and sharing of credit performance and related data on individuals. SCOR consists of representatives from the CML, British Bankers Association, the Finance and Leasing Association, the Mail Order Trade Association and the Consumer Credit Trade Association, together with representatives from the credit reference agencies (CRAs) Experian, Equifax and Callcredit.

 

SCOR produced the Principles of Reciprocity (the Principles) after consultation with financial trade associations and regulatory bodies. The Principles set out the rules for the recording, supply and access of credit performance data shared through the CRAs. The 'Governing' principle is that data should only be shared for the prevention of over-commitment, bad debt, fraud and money laundering, and to support debt recovery and debtor tracing, with the aim of promoting responsible lending.

Hmm.

 

So that will be quite a topic for discussion, then?

Will it be based on the assumption that Debt Buyers and Sellers are 'the good guys', and people in debt are 'the bad guys'?

Or will they be skipping morality due to time constraints and just getting into the information they can 'share' with Debt Buyers and Sellers?

I sense a real conflict of interest here.

Particularly when you notice, just to get a 'feel' for these 25-minute 'sessions', that the session following is called:

"Assignment of Debts - Rights and duties, Section 77, 78 & 79 and all that.

What to watch out for under the Consumer Credit Act in Debt Sale/Purchase Transactions."

 

Hmm.

 

I'm biased. I've had years of experience with one of the most vulnerable groups of people in society. I know - from my own experience - that when you're suddenly hit by a financial crisis, you look for people to trust. Not just people, but organisations... You ask for help, or go under.

But I'm becoming more and more aware of the fact that, in the 'debt business', presentation is everything, and trust is just something that DCAs play with, to get an 'advantage'.

So, when an organisation presents itself as something that enables a consumer to better understand what information is held about them, but also presents itself as some kind of 'information highway' to very, very questionable agencies... my hackles rise.

Anyone who's suffered mental illness - many illnesses in fact - will know just how difficult it becomes to get life insurance. Understandable or not, it makes you very touchy about who has access to your personal data. If a company presents itself as a consumer service, prides itself as having integrity, then shows how poorly that service is regulated by the records held - or rather the 'sources' of such information...

Well, it makes you wonder.

 

It just so happens that I'm due to write an article in September.:)

Wonder what I'll write about... ;)

We will not be intimidated.

'The pen is mightier than the sword'.

Petition to Outlaw Debt Sale and Purchase

- can't read/post much as eye strain's v.bad.

VIVA CAG!!! :)

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Hopefully this will link to ODC's post here:

Re: 3 CCA's sent 10/7/07 and confirmation of statue barred post 41:

Quote:

Originally Posted by vogelrok viewpost.gif

can they put a default against me on my credit report if they cant prove they own the debt legally. ??????

 

Unfortunately they can and do. I think someone should have a go at the CRAs as they are obiged to ensure taht all the info they hold on you is accurate and up to date. However the reality is that they take the word of a scummy DCA before yours:evil:

Out visiting family earlier, but between now and Monday I'll SAR Experian. Special Delivery Monday.

Tried the SAR generator, but there's no CRA SAR to generate! So I'll go by the template. Or alternatively say:

"Give me everything, you b*****s. I want all my information. Every bit. And tell me who you've shared it with. I'm enclosing ten quid but I tell you now, I think this information should be free to the data subject. And after the other 2 SARs to CRAs, making these requests free of charge will be next on my to-do list. Then I'm checking out the Land Registry. Bit of a free-for-all with you lot right now, ain't it? Things will change!:x"

Oh alright, I won't put that. BUT I WANT TO!!;)

We will not be intimidated.

'The pen is mightier than the sword'.

Petition to Outlaw Debt Sale and Purchase

- can't read/post much as eye strain's v.bad.

VIVA CAG!!! :)

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For the SAR I think it's a simple case of asking for all documents and notes concerning all activity concerning us.

So the bank one should do as a template: http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/bank-templates-library/516-1-data-protection-act.html

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Be VERY careful whose advice you listen too

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:) Thanks CB - when you say 'us' does that mean I can ask for one covering both hubby and me? Sorry if this is already in the links you provided but I'm drowning in a sea of papers here!! :D

Will be more organised tomorrow. :)

We will not be intimidated.

'The pen is mightier than the sword'.

Petition to Outlaw Debt Sale and Purchase

- can't read/post much as eye strain's v.bad.

VIVA CAG!!! :)

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subscribing with great interest, yet confusion. i recently signed up to the free credit report with experian and have since been bombarded with emails offering loans and the like. its really annoying. i am interested in joining you on the S.A.R campaign, but am wondering where it is leading. what are we hoping to achieve from it? sorry if i sound a bit dim, but i want to know the plan before i begin. is it simply to stop the unwanted correspondance, or is there a bigger picture?

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Just where in the legislation do we actually give our express written permission for Experian et al to share our personal Data. I certainly never did yet they seem quite happy to pass it to any ****** from their friends in the DCAs to use for whatever purpose. Its not the first time a DCA has threatented to DEFAULT me because ''WE CAN''

 

 

BARSTEWARDS the lot of them

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subscribing with great interest, yet confusion. i recently signed up to the free credit report with experian and have since been bombarded with emails offering loans and the like. its really annoying. i am interested in joining you on the S.A.R campaign, but am wondering where it is leading. what are we hoping to achieve from it? sorry if i sound a bit dim, but i want to know the plan before i begin. is it simply to stop the unwanted correspondance, or is there a bigger picture?

Def. a bigger picture Lolly. Credit Reference Agencies advertise their services to consumers, as a means for consumers to become better informed about their credit status, and what information is recorded on their credit file. But when you take up the 'offer', the credit file is 'flagged' that you've just accessed your own information, thereby letting all the types that you've just mentioned have a good look at your credit file, send you all the stuff you've also just mentioned. Catch-22. Debt buyers and sellers are particularly keen... potential custom! Ack!

We will not be intimidated.

'The pen is mightier than the sword'.

Petition to Outlaw Debt Sale and Purchase

- can't read/post much as eye strain's v.bad.

VIVA CAG!!! :)

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subscribing with great interest, yet confusion. i recently signed up to the free credit report with experian and have since been bombarded with emails offering loans and the like. its really annoying. i am interested in joining you on the S.A.R campaign, but am wondering where it is leading. what are we hoping to achieve from it? sorry if i sound a bit dim, but i want to know the plan before i begin. is it simply to stop the unwanted correspondance, or is there a bigger picture?

subscribed.gif"warning" Requesting Credit Ref Gave Me Nothing But Trouble !! Take a look at my thred Lolly as this also happened to me :-x

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:) Thanks CB - when you say 'us' does that mean I can ask for one covering both hubby and me?

 

sosumi, remember that DPA covers individuals, so you'd have to do one each with TWO lots of fees as well.

Be VERY careful whose advice you listen too

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CB, just been reading one of the links you put on here... O.. M.. G..:eek::D

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/legalities/20118-default-hell.html

Looks like we could really pin them down??:D

Right, cleared up all the letters etc., settled down a bit (too much sun yesterday!)

Thanks for the note about the SAR being for each person, rather than both of us. Hubby's not as bothered as me (plus mine poss. involves medical history), so I'll just go for mine. I'll put the SAR on here in a bit, to make sure I've got everything right.

 

Also, I thought last night - particularly in relation to Experian, what about the Advertising Standards Authority? Like in Dobby's thread, I think we're being misinformed about what happens when we search our own records, and the CreditExpert (Experian) advert is everywhere I look these days!

http://www.asa.org.uk/asa/

We will not be intimidated.

'The pen is mightier than the sword'.

Petition to Outlaw Debt Sale and Purchase

- can't read/post much as eye strain's v.bad.

VIVA CAG!!! :)

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Sosumi, I agree, we have been lead to believe that the CRA's are working as an independent body, but from experience here that just isn't true.

There are DEEP links between the CRA's and collection industry that simply shouldn't be allowed.

The number of times there are posts where people have checked their file and DCA's have come knocking or they simply trawl through our records is scary. This whole thing smacks of MASSIVE breach of the DPA and hopefully this action should go some way to uncovering that.

 

If it does I think that our next course of action should be a serious complaint to the appropriate bodies. Now I wonder if the FOS would be interested ;)

 

Hopefully with all the good work that CAG is doing the financial industry as a whole will get the wake up call that they need.

 

Post your S.A.R - (Subject Access Request) when you're done and we'll have a look.

I've been thinking along the same lines as well.

Something short and sweet and too the point I believe is in order.

Be VERY careful whose advice you listen too

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