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philharg

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  1. Firstly thanks citizenB and silverfox1961 for your continual advice andfollowing of this thread. A huge thanks must go to all CAG admin team includingbankfodder. I have now been paid the settlement which was made without confidentiality. Obviously the thread hasn't been updated for a while so I shall explainevents. In November I was granted permission to add Experian and Phones4u asdefendants and the claim was stayed at the time. However the stay was thenlifted after a mediation period and I wasn't aware that it had been liftedhaving put an N244 form in asking for leave. So the date of the 20th January2012 for court had actually not been vacated. Then in January my partner informed me that she had found a letter (whichshe had put into a pile of papers and refound, massive fallout ensued) whichwas from Vodafone. Vodafone had made me an offer of £800 with an expiry date which had alreadypassed. This was a without prejudice offer and was to includeconfidentiality.... However, Vodafone made this offer as a Part 36 offer, informing me that theywould present it in court to the Judge when costs were being drawn up andinforming me that I could be liable for their court fees. This is where I got a bit panicked until I sought advice from CAG and wasinformed that a Part 36 offer cannot even be made in small claims court. Thiswas obviously a tactic by Vodafone to try and get me to accept as it did dowhat it was intended in doing by putting me through a couple of extra nightsrestless sleep. I then responded to Vodafone informing them that this is what I thought theywere trying to do and that any chance of it being a without prejudice letterhad been vitiated. Don't get me wrong mistakes can happen, especially with alitigate in person like myself, but for a company with the legal resources theyhave at their expense this was clearly a deliberate attempt to unsettle me. Ifit was job to be a legal counsel, I wouldn't get the law wrong let’s put itthat way. So I then wrote to Vodafone stating all of the above but that I was howeverwilling to accept their offer without confidentiality however. After a coupleof phone calls between myself and Vodafone they jumped at the chance to settleand I have now been paid out in full. After settlement was agreed I actually then received Vodafone's defencedocuments which they had prepared for court. These didn't even arrive with mebefore 14 days before court so I would of had them thrown out anyway. Now.... this is where it gets interesting. Although Vodafone had neverprovided any bill statements to me or information about how they could ofbilled a number which was never connected with them what they actually did tothe account was to submit a new phone number to it. I have found in the termsand conditions that they are allowed to do this... however not without actuallyletting you know which they obviously never did. There is no letter statingthis or in the account records there is not mention that they did this. And now my last point on this case... The other piece of evidence for Vodafone's defence was a witness statement I shall quote in parts this statement: "I understand that because the Claimant wished to use his existing number with Orange and port this number across to the Vodafone Network that atemporary number was created on his account." Of this I was never informed of at any stage. "Vodafone was wholly unaware that the Claimant had moved this address." Well the debt collection agencies were so fill yourselves in. And why shouldI have ever informed a company with which I did not hold a contract. They planned to use a piece of evidence where I had sent a letter and forgotten to change the date of the letter on it, presumably trying to show I was getting facts wrong. It was then stated: "On 30 June 2011 VF wrote to the Claimant addressing his concerns with regard to his credit file. VF also pointed out to him that he had not provided Vodafone with any evidence as to why his initial request for compensation in the amount of £500 was justified." Well clearly it was because Vodafone paid out more than this. I shall leave it at that now. I will always hold this company with disregardand will always inform people of my case as well as allowing people to ask for my advice to aid their own problems. Yes, maybe it should have gone to court for maybe more public justice and a court order, but with the pressures of life, being a litigate in person and the long term worry I just decided it best to settle out of court in the end. Thank you again for the fantastic help, support and advice I have receivedfrom this website as I could never have done it without CAG. I hope this thread allows others to see the problems in dealing with Vodafone and maybe acts as alight at the end of a very long tunnel. philharg
  2. Just a very quick update for today. I have reached a settlement with Vodafone out of court a week ago. This settlement is without confidentiality and I was awarded £1229 which includes court fees I paid for small claims court. I shall just leave it at that for today but this weekend I shall fill everyone in with a full account of events.
  3. Hi Paragun and and update for all interested.. Yesterday I filed for an amendment to be made with the court to add both Experian and Phones 4u as 2nd and 3rd defendant's respectively. Phones 4u have offered no evidence whatsoever that they have done no wrong. Experian have obviously admitted doing wrong but will not pay compensation. I feel this is the quickest route as opposed to wrangling with Experian for months. They have had their chance to put things right and come clean and instead they prefer to try misleading customers by misquoting law. Although this will obviously delay the case and court date of 20th January 2012 I feel this is the only way to correctly deal with the case. I would rather this than the Judge on the day decide Vodafone are not entirely at fault (although they obviously are at least partially) and for myself to not receive full recompense. As a reply to Paragun specifically I am only asking the court for £1300 for distress and damages. It keeps my costs down and I feel it is a fair amount. I have had much help in putting my case to the small claims court and it simply depends on if you have the time. Vodafone always said if I could prove the damages they would pay. However in the world of credit this can be very very difficult. Can you prove to Vodafone that you would of got a lower interest rate... I doubt they will accept whatever you come up with and this is why you may need to pursue matters in court so they can make the judgement.The expenses I claimed £425 for were hours, SAR's, CRA membership fees, postage costs. Vodafone had agreed to this but haven't paid as they only offered as full and final settlement.
  4. Hi all including Martin, fortunately this isn't about my Vodafone cause for a change. My parents business have been put in a similar position in the last few weeks and have asked me to investigate. They have always had PRS subscription and paid. They have now received a demand of payment from the PPL for the next two years usage and for last year with their additional 50% surchage levied on top. Do they really need it and are they bound to pay for last year having never been 'signed up'. Please can I receive all advice and if you can't post in the thread don't hesitate to PM me. Kind regards philharg
  5. Most recent update: The case has been allocated to small claims court with a date of 20th January 2012. Experian have failed to reply to my 14 day request to finally sort the matter out or be added to court action. I then called up to cancel my subscription to their service. Quite unbelievably their salesman tried to convince me to stay with Experian's service so I could keep track incase the default re-appears. An amazing sales technique I must note which really puts your confidence back in their systems. I have also received a copy of the contract with Vodafone showing the mobile phone number to be 07XXXXXXX written onto the contract. I also have written confirmation from Orange that this number was ported directly from "Cellnet" (actually Virgin Mobile) on the 5th August 2009. The contract with Vodafone was dated the 1st August 2009 and then the contract I took out with Orange was dated 2nd August 2009. On the 2nd August 2009 the number was ported directly over to Orange taking the 3 days to the 5th August. Hence showing Vodafone never had this number ported and never owned the lease against this telephone number at any stage. Phones4u and Experian most likely to be added as 2nd & 3rd defendants in the imminent future. Thanks Phil
  6. So a 14 day LBA was sent to Phones4u to actually come up with some evidence acquiting them of fault or they were being added to court action. They came up with the most generic response possible which addressed nothing which I had set out: "Thank you for your recent correspondence dated 3 October 2011 regarding your contract taken out through our Manchester store. We are keen to ensure that all customers have a positive experience and we take all customer comments seriously. Our aim is to offer a friendly and helpful service on every occasion. We acknowledge you wish to consider your options in regards to the issues you have raised with us. May I take this opportunity to advise that our position remains unchanged. We feel we have responded correctly in regard to the issues relating to the disconnection of your line. The return of your contract was processed in store on the day after your contract was originally transacted. However, if there is any further information, of which we are not yet aware, please contact us and we are more than happy to reconsider this. We are maintaining that we accept no responsibility for your line not being disconnected for the timescale that you provided. After contacting you at the earliest opportunity we processed a return through our store to get the line disconnected as agreed. Should you wish to discuss this further, please contact our customer resolution team on 0844 871 2244. This line is available 9am to 6pm Monday to Friday. Yours sincerely XXXXCustomer Resolution Team"
  7. What's also worrying is that if I hadn't have been checking my credit report daily then I wouldn't have known it had gone on.If it is a system error and not an induvidual data file error then surely this could have happened to a lot of other induviduals whom have recently had default's removed.
  8. So the most recent update..... Experian have admitted that the two subsequent defaults re-appearing were in fact caused by a system error on their behalf. A rather worrying point that a company who's sole job it is to have very accurate records has had system issues putting default's against someone's name. They did not offer any compensation and partially quoted the DPA section 13 to miss out the stress and distress part. I have written back to them and if they do not pay compensation within 14 days they shall be added as the 2nd defendant. I am now awaiting the allocation to court and hopefully have this within the next few days.
  9. Did you get a reply from the CEO's director? Or anymore updates...?
  10. Just wondering if someone could clear this random thought in my head up: Obviously the terms on my side were never fully agreed for the contract as the number had to be ported through. This didn't happen so the contract's agreements were never completed. Vodafone's defence is solely based around them stating that the contract was in place so they were allowed to place defaults against my name etc... However.. having read the terms and conditions set out by Vodafone it quite clearly states: "4. Using our services – the rules d) We’ve allocated you a phone number on the network. This number does not belong to you and we may charge you a fee if you want to transfer this number to another provider." Does the fact that Vodafone never fulfilled their side of the agreement as well not totally invalidate the contract (that was never agreed to in the first place)? ... the number was never ported through and they allocated a number onto the account.. surely this means they never fulfilled their duties in the setting up of a potential contract. Does this just give more weight to the fact that even if Phones4u never told them that the contract was cancelled that Vodafone should never have set up the contract either (even if told to incorrectly by Phones4u). I'm still amazed they can process and charge a mobile phone account with no number... I bet they wouldn't be able to set it up if they didn't have your name and bank account details however. Was considering going to the Trafford Centre in Manchester tomorrow as Rip-off Britain are filming for their show if you turn up and tell them your problems... might just have a day of rest instead.
  11. Well I have asked Experian to explain things very simply to me but they still aren't. Here is an extract of the letter I sent them which they received two weeks ago today: "On about 13th May 2001 you were contacted I understand to remove certain entries on my credit file which had been placed by Vodafone LTD. I understand under instruction from Vodafone LTD you removed them however for no lawful reason they were re-instated on 22nd May 2011, removed again only to be re-instated on the 26th May 2011. As you already know on the 1st August 2011 I asked for an SAR to which you have so far fully failed to completely satisfy, as stated by my email on the 27th August 2011. This email contains details of the additional information I require and warning you that if you do not satisfy your statutory obligations by the 9th September 2011 then you may be subject to complaint and possible legal action. I have inspected the partial disclosure which you have made so far and I notice in your Customer Service Notes History on 23/5/2011 and 31/5/2011 that you in fact admit that there has been a “system error” as you chose to describe it in relation to my credit file. As you are aware you have a duty under the Data Protection Act to produce SAR disclosures in clear language and the codes etc should be explained. Therefore please will you let me have a full explanation as to what the system error was and why this resulted in your failure to remove unlawful entries from my credit file." Obviously I am still awaiting a reply from them. At the end of the day all three companies are currently blaming each other really... Vodafone say it is Experian and Phones4u fault, Phones4u say Vodafone, Experian play dumb to the matter saying they don't speak to Vodafone. I guess the only resolution will be for it to all come out in court where they have to get their stories correct and lawfully prove it. Can I ask a question now to which hopefully someone has an answer.... In November some 3 months after Phones4u attempted to open this contract Vodafone closed it down. They scrapped the subsequent 21 months of the contract which were to follow and only defaulted the previous 3 months. They wiped clean the over £500 which would have to be charged to close the account down early. Is this normal practice of mobile phone companies if they have never received notification that the account is being closed down and they are merely closing it down out of non-payment? Because I would of thought they would have to default the full contract value of say £600? And Hi lastly to Charlotte.. if it's been dragging on for 2 years I suggest you follow my action and put some real pressure on the company to take notice. As you will see from the sheer volume of Vodafone default thread's on this forum they are acting in an incredibly irresonsible way with many accounts it seems. If you want any advice about anything do not hesitate to contact me!
  12. Well the allocation questionnaire was handed in before the date of the 12th so that's all gone through to the courts... just have to wait for things to progress from their side obviously now. Phones4u sent me a letter post phone call confirming many of the details, I am awaiting another letter from them in response to one I sent post the phonecall. Hopefully I receive this within the next week. Experian have still failed to reply to the letter I sent them. However they did state in an email to me regarding an SAR which I hadn't felt they had disclosed fully: So according to Experian they have never even communicated with each other about my credit file as to ascertain the problems with my account... how then would Vodafone decide that it was Experian's fault for the two subsequent defaults if they never even communicated with each other. "2. We have not had any correspondence with Vodafone Ltd. They provide information to us electronically on a monthly basis. They also have the facility to update individual records on our system themselves. 6. We have no internal mail regarding your account or the placement of the default by Vodafone ltd" So according to Experian they have never even communicated with each other about my credit file as to ascertain the problems with my account... how then would Vodafone decide that it was Experian's fault for the two subsequent defaults if they never even communicated with each other. That's all for now, still waiting for some responses to come back from all three companies embroiled in this.
  13. Phones4u have been very effective in getting back to me straight away today by telephone. They have confirmed that the contract was never in place because the number was never ported through... I have been told Vodafone must have been aware of this because they were told by Phones4u that the porting had failed to go through, however it appears Vodafone opened up a line anyway (with no mobile phone number) and continued charging. Phones4u's opinion is that Vodafone's offer of £426.08 for my expenses to date is their admittance of liability and that this is a rather late stage to suddenly write Phones4u into the defence.
  14. So to update for everyone.... I have received Vodafone's defence a couple of days ago. The main of it is based around them stating they were lawfully allowed to enter because the contract was entered into. However the contract was never fully agreed because they couldn't port my number across. For the first time in their defence they have placed the blame on Phones4u stating that Phones4u never notified them that the contract had not been completed fully. With regards to Experian they haven't stated in their defence that the two subsequent entries onto my credit file were caused by Experian. They have only stated that their was some delay in their removal caused by Experian. They have stated that the entry of these two subsequent entries onto my credit file was lawful however! Even though it had already been established their was no debt. Their defence here is rather muddled... they originaly stated it was Experian's fault... they are nwo going down the line that they were lawfully added because of the supposed "contract"... yet how could it be lawfully re-added if they had already admitted their was no debt... this would in turn make it unlawful again anyway? Today I have notified both Phones4u and Experian that Vodafone are offically laying the blame with them now both in correspondence and in their county court defence. It is certainly the first time Vodafone has said it is Phones4u's fault. The 12th September is when my allocation questionnaire is due back in and I certainly won't be waiting too long to pop that in.
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