Amanda V Woolwich

[Don4071]

Hi need some advice please.

I telephoned the Woolwich today, telling the Customer Advisor that I was sending a letter asking for a comprehensive list of all charges made to our account - under the Data Protection Act. The Customer Advisor gave me the address Customer Relations Dept, Jackson House, Jackson Road, Clacton-on-Sea. Essex.

But reading what others have said in the forums, alot have mentioned they sent their request to the Woolwich in Bexleyheath.

Can anyone tell me if they recognise the Clacton-on-Sea address?

Many thanks

[Thailand]

Yes totally, I sent two letters there and both were acknowledged. (clacton address). Also dont let them fob you off if when you put in your LPA in they say they have a further 40 days.... they dont.

Also use the heading woolwich telephony customer services.

[Don4071]

Many thanks for that - much appreciated.

[Thailand]

Correction, Woolwich telephony customer relations. Your welcome

[Don4071]

Hi all, hope my question makes sense.

Just sent the Woolwich the first request for refund of charges, straight forward enough..... but thinking ahead.... when it get's to the point where I file with the small claims court (under no illusions it won't!) clearly at this point I include interests and court charges in my claim.

My questions is this, the date the Woolwich charges incurred is different from the date the charges was applied, so am I right in calculating the interest from the date the charges were applied?

I think I am... but to those more experienced than me any nudges in the right direction would be appreciated.

Many thanks.

Woolwich - Data Protection Act Ltr Sent 8/8/06
Statements rec'd 6/9/06
1st Req for refund sent 7/9/06 (Straight forward refund of charges & spreadsheet £2,730)

Capital 1 - Data Protection Act Ltr Sent 8/8/06
Statment rec'd 23/8/06
1st Req for refund sent 7/9/06 (Straight forward refund of charges & spreadhseet £876)

[essjaysea]

I think you should go by the dates the charges actually hit your account, as that is that date that the money was unlawfully taken

[Thailand]

Ditto, thats what I did. You're right to be under no illusions - the department can't keep up with us - just when we thought they had made enough cash off us to fund extra staff!

[Don4071]

Originally Posted by essjaysea

I think you should go by the dates the charges actually hit your account, as that is that date that the money was unlawfully taken

Many thanks.

Because the interest calculating spreadsheet uses the term 'Date Incurred', I immediately referred to this date on my statements. Of course, after inputting 91 entries onto the spreadsheet did it occur this couldn't be right!

Hence why I had to check, so thanks again.

Amanda.

[Don4071]

Why ask for Manual Intervention information?

In my Data Protection Act letter to The Woolwich (and other banks/cc) I didn't ask for any information relating to Manual Intervention, but just simply asked for a comprehensive list of charges that had been applied to my account over the last 6 years, together with data, amount and a description of what the charge was for.

I've received this - ok. But my point is ANY charges applied (manual or not), would be shown on the comprehensive list of charges from the bank/credit card company - wouldn't it - or am I missing something here?

[essjaysea]

The question about manual intervention is put to the bank in order to get them to admit one way or another, whether any manual intervention has in fact taken place.

If they confirm that there has been no MI, then they are admitting by implication that all the charges have in fact been computer generated, and that the cost to them will have been approx 50p rather than the 30 pounds they have been charging.

This information will support your claim that the charges are disproportionate, and therefore unlawful.

But The Woolwich generally respond by saying that this information is not covered by the Data Protection Act, and refuse to give a definitive answer either way.

My thoughts are that, as all of these cases have so far been settled prior to a hearing, there doesn't seem to be much point in challenging them on this.

[jonni2bad]

Good reply, I like that!

[Don4071]

Thanks very much for making the picture much clearer.

I did initially use a Data Protection Act letter from another website before coming across you and subsequently have now begun using letters/templates from this website.

I have done my prelim letter to the Woolwich and feel I shouldn’t at this stage write requesting MI information.

Anyhow as Essyjay as mentioned the Woolwich probably will not state either way – so I’m no better off where they’re concerned.

However, I’m at the same stage with a couple other banks/cc companies, so is there any advise whether to ask for MI information now or just leave it. Again, I don’t think that would be a wise move but happy to hear your opinions.

[essjaysea]

I still think that it is worth putting the question about manual intervention; after all you have nothing to lose, and if by some miracle you happen to get a straight answer, then you will have strengthened your case even further.

[Don4071]

Hi all,

Following my prelimary letter to The Woolwich, I had a response from Michele Wallis, Sales & Service Manager, advising they aim to resolve this matter by 9th October.

Although I'm not sending the Letter Before Action until 25th September (I know I'm being a bit premature but theres nothing like being prepared I say!) I have drafted the letter and would appreciate any feedback.

Here goes:


Dear Ms Wallis


Re: Customer Reference: xxxxxxx

Although you advised you hope to resolve this mater by 9th October 2006, I would like to bring your attention to some matters contained in your letter dated 11th September 2006.

I note your suggestion in the Customer Care Leaflet that I can complain to the Financial Services Ombudsman if I am not satisfied with the service you have provided. However, please be advised that it would be inappropriate to complain to the Financial Services Ombudsman where the only forum which can determine a dispute on the legality of charges is my local court.

I would draw your attention to the terms of the contract which you agreed to at the time that I opened my account. It is an implied term of that contract that you would conduct yourselves lawfully and in a manner which complies with UK law and I would ask you to note the following.

If The Woolwich insists it can impose charges in accordance with its terms and conditions of contract, those terms and conditions are subject to the common law and the Unfair Terms in Consumer Contract Regulations 1999 (UTCCR). Indeed, the UTCCR takes precedence over any contractual term where the court finds a term to be ‘unfair’. The court can then treat that term of contract as having no legal effect.

As you will be aware, the court will only award (in a non-negotiated consumer contract) a sum to reimburse actual loss. Your charges do not reflect actual loss. Rather, they include a massive profit margin or penalty. Alternatively, they subsidise the bank's global debt recovery costs and lending losses. There is parliamentary evidence for this assertion.

When the UK banks gave evidence to the House of Commons Treasury Committee on how bank charges were calculated they said:

"[bank charges] are going to pay for all the people we have who pursue debt, collect debt, speak to customers and chase payments. The way these charges are arrived at is by taking these total costs and making some assumptions about the volume that is going to come through to arrive at the individual charges" (House of Commons, 2nd report, 25 January 2005, paragraph 50).

Accordingly, your charges do not reflect the actual loss in my case. They are an illegal penalty charge designed to recover money unconnected with the conduct of my account.

If I do not hear from you within the next 14 days, I will raise an action of payment at my local court for the full amount plus interest plus my costs and without further notice. In that eventuality, I would require you to lodge in court financial vouching for the actual loss sustained in my case, together with your full financial accounts revealing how much income is generated from your bank charges, as against the cost of administering dishonoured transactions.

I looks forward to your response.




Execuse the different fonts ... don't know what I've done there.

Any feedback welcomed....many thanks.

By the way, how do I merge all of my Woolwich Threads together? Don't worry if it's going to give somebody an extra job or a headache to do, it's just so I can keep track.

[closey]

Firstly the charges are unlawful not illegal so please change the wording.

Note sent to a moderator to merge your threads.

[Don4071]

The story thus far....

Following the preliminary letter and LBA letter I've now filled with County Court. The papers were deemed served on 20th October and today received a letter from Barclays offering £1000. (I'm requesting £3,300 incl court fees and interest).

Would I write back to Barclays politely refusing this offer, letting them know that I have filled with the court or just don't communicate any further with them - they will know by now that the papers have been filled.

What would you suggest at this stage?

Thank you

[essjaysea]

I would write back to them accepting their offer, with the proviso that you intend to pursue them for the balance of your claim, and to that end you have already filed a claim for the total amount, and that you are only prepared to settle for the balance