Cancelling accounts by email? *WINNER*

[steve31]

Hi ya all,

Will try to keep this brief as I know how much reading some of these threads can take!

I wrote to my provider to cancel my monthly contract by email....
I got a reply saying please put it in writing to the following address..etc.

I duly did so, although my mistake now I realise is that I didn't send it recorded delivery
I failed to realise I was still being billed by them (my better half having a habit of opening my mail and then leaving it in amongst her pile of Take A Breaks, Chat, Womans Own etc!).

You guessed it, they didn't recieve the letter!
3 months on I worte to them, after recieving a final warning before DCA for non payment of the previous 3 months when I've not even realised I was still contracted to them, let alone even used the phone!

I wrote to them explaining the circumstances but they insist the charges stand as they did not recieve a letter of cancellation as per the terms and conditions of the contract.
What I'd like to know if I can argue is this...
They have acknowledged in writing that I sent them an email asking to cancel the account. Could this be enough in court for me to not have to pay up? Basically they knew I wanted to cancel the account but insisted on making it more difficult. Is there some termonoligy in law where having to write in by letter could be deemed "an unfair term or condition"?

They also state this matter is nothing to do with them any further and to only contact the DCA.... if I feel its still in dispute should I still write to them and perhaps send a copy to the DCA?

Any idea's people? Cheers!

[steve31]

I've had a scout around and am wondering if the following are relevant.

The Unfair Terms in Consumer Contracts Regulations 1994
Regulation 4(4)


INDICATIVE AND ILLUSTRATIVE LIST OF TERMS WHICH MAY BE REGARDED AS UNFAIR

(d) permitting the seller or supplier to retain sums paid by the consumer where the latter decides not to conclude or perform the contract, without providing for the consumer to receive compensation of an equivalent amount from the seller or supplier where the latter is the party cancelling the contract;
Not that great with the legal jargon but does this (in lay mans terms!) mean: they can't keep my money when I decide not to conclude the contract because I'm cancelling it?
(h) automatically extending a contract of fixed duration where the consumer does not indicate otherwise, when the deadline fixed for the consumer to express this desire not to extend the contract is unreasonably early;
Mine was a fixed contract, it had run it's length. I never asked for it to be automatically extended. Could this be another angle to throw at them?
(o) obliging the consumer to fulfil all his obligations where the seller or supplier does not perform his;
Now I've no proof yet but I'm sure they would have cut my phone off after I didn't pay the first month, they still charged me the next two months when they weren't providing me with a service!
Unfair terms
4.—(1) In these Regulations, subject to paragraphs (2) and (3) below, "unfair term" means any term which contrary to the requirement of good faith causes a significant imbalance in the parties' rights and obligations under the contract to the detriment of the consumer.
I wrote to them via email in good faith to cancel my contract! They decided, to the detriment of the consumer (me!) to ignore it.

Now that I've looked and read it I'm quite positive this is relevant and will definetly be typing them another letter with quotes from above.
I would really appreciate some views, encouragement or even criticism if necessary though!

[jonni2bad]

Hi Steve

You don't need to send items by special or recorded delivery in order for a court to believe that the other party received it. If you have a copy of this letter then that can be viewed as evidence alone that you sent it, especially backed by the contents of the email which indicated you were cancelling.

In my opinion, do not deal with the DCA other than to inform them that the debt is 'formally disputed' and, as such, you will be dealing with the debt owner until resolved. Keep any further letters they might send but there should be no need to reply further to them...

Write once again to the provider (who is this, by the way?) and include

(a) a copy of the letter you first sent

(b) a copy of the email you sent

(c) a copy of the reply to that email.

Inform them that their failure to cancel the contract should not put you to any loss, that you dispute the debt and will not be paying for it, or any further costs associated with the cancelled contract.

Furthermore, should they persist with this action for recovery then you will be forced to bill them for your reasonable time in dealing with the matter.

At this stage I don't see that you would need to rely upon any legislation, but well done for researching the matter first - that in itself is quite unique on here

[steve31]

Many thanks for the reply jonni2bad.

I'll write back to them and state what you say and yes, fortunately I've got copies of everything. It only amounts to £75 but its the priniciple.... and of course I wouldn't be giving £75 away to anyone in any other circumstances so I'm not going to here either!

The provider is Vodafone, who after reading through many of the posts here don't seem very co-operative!

Gives me something to do though! LOL

[buzby]

Your network may have bene Vodafone, but the company that was your Service Provider may not be - always one to watch!. As long as you cancelled to the address that your bill came from, you should be OK.

[steve31]

Its definetly Vodafone but thanks for the advice Mr Buzby

[steve31]

This is what I have sent.....

Dear Sir/Madam,
I am writing to inform you that I still dispute the charges that were applied to my account after September 2007. Your failure to cancel the contract should not put me at any financial loss. If you continue with any action to recover the amount’s charged after September 2007 I will be forced to bill you for my reasonable time in dealing with the matter.

I have found statutes in law that you are not complying with and will be happy to use them against you in any litigation that is necessary if you persist in recovering the amount due.

Contrary to what you state in your letter, you DO have jurisdiction in this matter and I will not be corresponding with the Debt Collection Agency whilst the amount is still in dispute.
I do not deny that I owe you for services up to the contract termination date which should be approx 8th September 2006.

All I require to settle this dispute is for you to send me a revised bill, taking into account the fact the phone contract should have been terminated in September 2006 and removing all charges applied thereafter.


Again I thank you for your assistance. I look forward to hearing from you as soon as possible and settling the amount owed on the account with no further problems.

Yours faithfully




Steve31!

[jonni2bad]

Seems good to me......

[steve31]

I recieved a letter and they are refusing to co-operate.
Quote from the letter:

As stated in your terms and conditions you are required to send Vodafone 30 days written notice, as this was not recieved your account remained open.
It appears by the system notes that you had been made aware of this on the 10th August 2006 by return email, there is no further actions after this date towards the cancellation of your account.

A quick summary of my case:
I sent them an email to cancel the account, they replied saying I have to put it in writing.
I deem this as an unfair term of contract? They are deliberately making it harder for me to cancel my contract with them. They acknowledge that I wished to cancel it by replying to the email. This alone should be enough in a court, regardless of what it says in the terms and conditions. Anyone agree?

I wrote to them the next day in writing but they claim to have not recieved it.
I done what they asked me to do. I cant prove it because I didn't send it recorded delivery.

I recieved bills although didn't really take notice of them, I knew I had to make a payment on the final month of the contract so was suprised when a month or 2 later I picked up a bill that was amongst my partners pile of magazines that showed line rental for the next month. (She'd opened it and just put it down). I sent an email asking why they were still charging after I'd cancelled the account. I recieved no reply and then got a letter from the DCA!

My next moves, (although I'd appreciate some encouragement or advice)

1. Send them a Subject Access Request. The statements have gone missing . I owe them for one month, I want to be sure of the figure I am claiming for MCOL purposes.
2. Send them a letter before action, highlighting again why I believe the charges should be removed.
3. Submit MCOL and await the defence.

As I say above, I'd appreciate any advice. I have already found some statutes that I think back up my case in The Unfair Terms in Consumer Contracts Regulations 1994. Is it worth me looking through the CCA? Would this also be applicable? Thanks to anyone who has read this far.

[buzby]

There's no need to make this more complicated than it need be, and trying to call in the UTCCR would be self-defeating. You are not challenging Vodafone's right to insist that any contract cancellation is 'in Writing', but their stupin assertion that a notice sent by email is somehow not 'writing'. It is, you wrote the email using a keyboard, if they wanted requests sent by post, fine but that was not what was asked. If they printed off your email it would have been like a letter, so all you need do is get a judge to agree that their stance is being taken simply to extend the contract, and nothing else. No this isn't an unfair contract, just a stupid interpretation of it. Sticking with this also means you avoid any difficulties by not sending the follow-up letter by RD.

[steve31]

Update... sent Vodafone a Subject Access Request and footnote that I will now be charging £7.50 for every letter i have to send them if they persue this matter. They cashed the £10 cheque for the Subject Access Request, so far not had anything from them.

Today recieved letter from the DCA (dated 15th Feb!!!), our client is not prepared to tolerate the outstanding balance on this account any longer. Failure to make full payment within 7 days will result in court action being taken against you which will increase the costs payable.

I phoned the DCA, told them I was recording the call for my own security and that the debt was still in dispute. I was asked if Vodafone were aware of this to which I replied yes. He replied "unfortunately as they have not notified us to stop action against you we have to persue the action."
I stated that as far as I am concerned I have done my part by informing you that the debt is in dispute and that they should correspond with Vodafone to confirm this. He then scored what I believe to be a bit of an own goal by saying "Yes we are aware it is in dispute as it is on your notes in front of me however until we are notified to stop action we will continue to persue you for the money."
He said he would suspend the account for 7 days to give me time to instruct Vodafone to tell them to stop action against me.

Any thoughts anyone?

[steve31]

Thanks for the tip, had never heard of OTELO before...

What exactly is a 'deadlock' letter?

[buzby]

I'd forget forget OTELO - simply write to the DCA stating that the matter is in dispute and you are only advising them of this as a matter of courtesy, not other correspopndence from them will be entertained.

If Vodafone won't comply with the S.A.R - (Subject Access Request), you action next is to report them to the Information Commissioners Office (Information Commissioners Office).

[buzby]

It's only therm that thinks OTELO is worth the effort, however if the netowks don't send you a deadlock letter - meaning discussions/negotiations are at an end - then the won't deal with the enquiry. Better to avoid the monkey and work with the organ grinder direct!

[buzby]

Whether of course you want to delay things for an additional three months* (rather than resolve the matter in a way that puts you in control) is another issue.

*Always assuming they decide to become involved, and not find a way of excluding themselves.