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I have sent my initial letter requesting refund of charges (over £6,000) for past 6 years. I have just read something about only being able to claim 5 years in Scotland, is this true? Also if i have to go to court stage, is all the advise and templates the same, or are there different rules under Scottish Law? Would REALLY appreciate help!!!
Alpha, yes you can only claim 5 years in Scotland.
These are fundamental questions regarding the Scottish process and it would seem that you haven't done much research into the process.
For one, you can only claim a maximum of £1500 in Scotland.
If I were you, I would start reading through the FAQ section and try to find as much information on the Scottish process as you can. Unfortunately I don't know the ins and outs of the Scottish process so I can't advise you any more, but I would have a read through Seahorse's thread and Dangler8's. Both are scots.
This process is not a walk in the park, you need to do your homework in order for it work properly. If you do things wrong, you run the risk of having your claim thrown out of court (if it gets that far). Just a warning - we don't want you losing out now do we
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Thanks for that, extremely new to all this and just trying to find my way!
It would seem then that as my whole claim is over £6000, I will have to put in at least 4 claims of £1500 each time. Is this correct? I live in hope that it won't get to that stage, but reading through threads I appear a bit naive!
Must say it's a comfort to know I'm not the only one going through this.
No you can't do that either. The scottish courts are striking out subsequent claims on the grounds you are abusing the system. You will have to claim for the lot. I believe the only way to do this is through the Financial Ombudsmen. Again, I don't know enough about this and you will have to look this up on the site.
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Thanks for replying. The 6K is purely just charges incurred - I've added no interest. To be honest I felt if i could just get our money back I would be happy but the more I think about it the more angry I get and want to put interest on. I have read the advice give from the Govan Law Centre and found useful - i will have to take to Ombusdman if RBS don't play ball. Do you know how successful this route has been in the past? It feels quite daunting so getting help at this website really great!
I've got a claim for just short of 5k - and I was so angry I have applied interest to take the total over 6k.
Be careful with adding interest though - I did some research over this and it appears the calculation "formula" that has stood up well in other claims is the section 69 county court (English courts) 8% - which is not compunded. If in doubt over this then there are some brilliant template spreadsheets (alongside the letters you seem to already know about) in the "Templates" section when you log onto the Consumer Action Group website forum. Download these and then simply enter your charges in a list downwards with dates alongside each of the charges. The spreadsheet will automatically calculate the interest and present you with a total amount (of charges and seperately of charges and interest) on the top of spreadsheet.
The others who've replied about the Scottish Small Claims system are right - you can only submit one single claim and for a maximum of £750 (from memory). All this means is that the "dead easy" and "hassle free" system is not an option for you - and you'll have to do a little more research (reading through the threads on this website and FAQ's section). It also means that you're going to have to take RBS all the way to setting a formal court date and potentially to a court appearance - - but the chances are 99% of time they'll back down before that although they'll seriously apply pressure to you before they do back down. Applying pressure means that their (pretty nasty solicitors Cobbets in Manchester) will be writing to you in course and also "offering" to settle for maybe half the amount claimed. If you see it through then from my research most claims seem to take up to 8 months. Apparantly RBS are actually one of the more efficient banks in paying out quickly and they don't practice "dirty tricks" as much as a lot of the English banks like HSBC and Barclays - where they start closing accounts down.
Good luck...... and the others on this website are really friendly and seriously helpful.........
Good new is, RBS appear to be happy to offer settlements on claims for a 5 year period based on charges only. If you are happy with this, I'd say the chances of you needing to go to court will be pretty minimal.
To be honest, I'm considering putting a draft template together for Scottish claimants battling the RBS, but as it will totally go against the advice in general on this site, I'm not sure how well received it would be by the mods.
But. Basically claims over £1500 in Scotland are pretty well restricted, as over this takes you into Ordinary Cause, which means you do require the services of a solicitor. As things get a bit dodgy if you intend claiming statutory interest or past the 5 year limit, the chances of finding a solicitor willing to risk representing you on that basis are pretty minimal.
So he options really do boil down to sticking to a 5 year claim, based on charges only. And either using a solicitor and the timescales advised here. Or waiting 8 weeks after prelim, then complaining to the fos. EItherway, you WILL get your money back. BUT. What you will probably find is, RBS will offer you fairly close to your claim before court, or the FOS take action. I HAVE complained to the FOS, with an offer on one account following swiftly after. But I haven't yet had a response from the FOS to my complaint. Which I am letting stand anyway, as I have yet to receive an offer on my other account. I do anticipate this coming im before the FOS make a ruling though.
I think the thing to take heart from is, RBS ARE settling Scottish claims without a fight, based on the above. But it IS taking somewhat longer than the 2+2 weeks timescales. Nudging them along by email though, does seem to hurry things up a bit. But if everyone started doing that, then I imagine THAT avenue would get clogged pretty quickly.
Hope that helps somewhat. Bear in mind that the above is based on my own experience.
Just to pick up on something Atlantic said. The statutory interest of 8% should only be added if you go to court. Adding this beforehand could be seen as vexacious or you not knowing what you are doing. It is especially important you don't add this on at the beginning if you do end up having to use the FO.
As for Seahorse....funnily enough I was speaking to Dangler on Thursday about speaking to you and some of the more frequent Scottish users about requesting a General Scottish forum to be set up where you could place templates, processes et al in as a central point for you to refer to. I did suggest he requested it in the General forums and got you personally in on it. I would think the only thing that would go against that section being opened is there possibly being no mod / site helper with the right knowledge to cover that area (I am speculating, their may be, I don't know that's all). If there's not, I guess there's an opening for someone lol . Anyways, it's a great idea even if it ends up as a stick in the RBS forum. I'm sure Sn00psmum would be happy to contribute too. There ya go SH, a whole little scottish team for you!
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Seahorse, as you seem have taken this much further down the track than I have, do you have any wording suggestions for future letters? I'm a bit concerned know as I have sent the initial request for refund letter based on the template from this website. This obviously now is not relevant and I am worried I will come across as not knowing what I am doing (it's true but I'd rather they didn't know!!) Any advice?
Alpha - it's just a thought - but don't worry too much about not "looking" as if you know what you're doing by using a template from this forum....
The way RBS are structured down at Gogarburn (old farm out by the airport they basically pulled down and reconstructed their "global-empire" headquarters!) - they'll have deciated teams, probably numbering a few big desks, of people handling these claims. The sheer number of claims they (and every other bank) receives means that their sharp eyed staff will pay attention to the details of each claim but they will simply see so so so many template claims that there'll be nothing much to differentiate between customers using a simple template and high flying lawyers normally serving the sheriffs court on Chambers Street.
That said and the absolute essential advice for anyone (from what I have humbly seen through my own research - and I'm a begginner too!) is that you must must stick to your timetables that *you* have set in your various correspondence and letters........
I am just picking up on a few of the other postings on this thread - but I really do think it would be a brilliant idea at least to have a seperate section in the login page for issues relating to Scots Law. Although I am now based down in England (and with an English address am exercising legal rights through English legal system and ultimately against RBS's English HQ addresses - as they have HQ's in both London and Edinburgh) initially I was really confused about what to do and where to look for advice as this website is dominated by english claimants and advice which is almost completely irrelevant for Scots Law. I think there maybe should also be a section for Northern Irish law as well - as they also have a different system and maximum claim amount is something like £2,000.
There is just one more thing T4FF said about my original posting concerning the statutory interest amount.....
Although T4FF is probably right in their reasoning about looking like you are'nt sure about what you're doing - I added the interest to get a "final total" amount for which I was claiming and gave a full Breakdown of how I arrived at that amount in my first letter to RBS. I am following Martin Lewis's (Financial Journalist from MoneySavingExpert: Consumer Revenge - Credit Cards, Shopping, Bank Charges, Cheap flights and more) advice and looking at the entire process as a "haggling" exercise and at a real push am prepared to back down on the interest bit and simply accept the charges themselves - but am fully expecting to have negotiations with the bank during the process of claiming.
In this sense - do your research as you may well find T4FF to be right - but adding the charges right at the start is simply my own way of approaching getting the money back........
I realise that MLs site advises on doing this and ok each site probably has their own way of running this process, and each site might seem like a correct way of doing it but it just doesn't make sense to do at this stage. There is only one reason you are entitled to statutory income - because you have filed a court claim.
The trouble is atlantic, there is a big flaw in your argument for adding 8% at that stage......you got it on the advice of Martin Lewis
On another point you made, I would think that a major advantage for anyone using the CAG templates is the fact they are using the CAG templates. The banks are aware of us and are scared of us, they see a CAG template, they know that person means business and has this forum behind him/her.
Sorry I'm not trying to be argumentative :o just realised I've countered another two of your posts....just voicing my opinion!
In anycase, more importantly, good luck Alpha
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As for Seahorse....funnily enough I was speaking to Dangler on Thursday about speaking to you and some of the more frequent Scottish users about requesting a General Scottish forum to be set up where you could place templates, processes et al in as a central point for you to refer to. I did suggest he requested it in the General forums and got you personally in on it. I would think the only thing that would go against that section being opened is there possibly being no mod / site helper with the right knowledge to cover that area (I am speculating, their may be, I don't know that's all). If there's not, I guess there's an opening for someone lol . Anyways, it's a great idea even if it ends up as a stick in the RBS forum. I'm sure Sn00psmum would be happy to contribute too. There ya go SH, a whole little scottish team for you!
No trouble T4FF........ you do sound like you've a fair bit of experience with things - so it's always good to get some constructive criticism 2 my ideas........ and everyone elses then maybe we all can muddle through this together in our various threads and get our and Alpha's money back!
Hi sorry to butt in, I concur with T4FF and Seahorse, no disrespect to other sites but CAG does the business as many successful claims have proven. I am sure when banks get CAG template letters they do know that they are from members of this site.
05/03/07 S.A.R - (Subject Access Request) handed in at branch
Found missing statements at home !!!!
08/03/07 Prelim+ schedule posted rec del
22/03/07 No reply to prelim LBA posted rec del
05/04/07 14 days and no reply to LBA, sent e-mail
27/04/07 Offered FULL SETTLEMENT £3375
03/05/07 Cash in bank account
Yup, it's there, but seems to be a bit less structured than the rest of the site. Seems to be more a case of everyone offering advice based on their own experiences (me included) than anything else.
I think we should all just club together to buy a house just south of the border and use that as our address to get our claims in.
Seahorse, as you seem have taken this much further down the track than I have, do you have any wording suggestions for future letters? I'm a bit concerned know as I have sent the initial request for refund letter based on the template from this website. This obviously now is not relevant and I am worried I will come across as not knowing what I am doing (it's true but I'd rather they didn't know!!) Any advice?
Sorry Alpha, I nearly missed this one. Working nights just now and just grab moments to check CAG as and when I can.
I see no reason at the moment why you shouldn't stick with the letters on here. It's probable that after the lba 14 days are up though, that you might like to think about putting together one stating your intention to approach the fos with your complaint.
I'm going to have a think about this, as I'm concerned that following CAGs advice, and subsequently sending a letter at odds with that advice might be sending the wrong message to the bank. I really do think we need to come up with an alternative strategy for claims in Scotland over £1500, but at the moment I'm not too sure what direction that strategy should go.
I don't think it's so much of a problem in the case of RBS as they appear to be getting their act together. But I believe some of the other banks are still acting in a Stalin like fashion and are trying to grind claimants down. I think I need to have a look at threads from those forums and try to get an idea of where to go from here.
Scot needs help!
. I have just read something about only being able to claim 5 years in Scotland, is this true? Also if i have to go to court stage, is all the advise and templates the same, or are there different rules under Scottish Law? Would REALLY appreciate help!!!
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Originally Posted by T4FF
No reply to prelim LBA posted rec del
